Dexos D alternative

[WarEagle]

Good afternoon,

First time posting. I don’t mean to high jack the thread, but there has been some good information shared.

I purchased a 2025 AT4 3.0 in August. So far, the truck has been great. I did my first oil change at 1k miles, 2nd at 4k miles, and now I’m sitting at a little over 5k miles.

I’m using Castrol Edge Turbo Diesel 0w20 Dexos D. In another 1-2K miles, I’m going to send my oil in for an analysis to see what the wear metals are at.

It looks like some of the 3.0 LZ0 owners are experimenting with a little heavier weights/viscosity and have seen some positive results with their wear metal tests.

I know my truck is under warranty but there have been thrust bearing issues with the 25/26 LZ0 motors and GM recently switched their 6.2 motor to a higher viscosity due to bearing issues.

I’m considering switching to Mobil 1 ESP 0w30 or the Pennzoil Platinum Euro L 5w30, which I believe are both Dexos 2. I also saw that Pennzoil has a Platinum Euro LX 0w30 with low SAPS. It has a very high Boron level. Does anyone have any experience with the Euro LX?

Or there is the Amsoil 5w30 synthetic diesel oil (which they say meets/exceeds Dexos D) and their 5w30 LS synthetic euro oil.

My truck sees a little “around town” usage, but it’s mainly for driving from SoCal to Utah. My truck usually sits around 194-198 degrees for the engine temp. On our way back a few weeks ago, we were sitting in traffic, crawling up a long grade and the truck got up to 219. I was shocked to see this since it was only 60 degrees outside. Makes me wonder about the temp when crossing the desert when it’s 120 degrees.

Any thoughts on the above mentioned oils? Thank you in advance for your time.

Doubt I can help much but thought I’d chime in anyway.

I have a ‘21 with the LM2 with 86k miles. Switched from ESP 0w-20 to ESP 5w-30 about 20k miles ago for two OCI and then to 0w-30 since. From the oils you listed my choice would be the ESP 0w-30. Based on info here and elsewhere, I believe a switch to a x-30 is wise.

Also, after some discussion here with @edyvw, I’ll likely be switching to Amsoil euro 5w-30. He recommended it over the Amsoil diesel 5w-30. My reasoning for wanting to switch to Amsoil is to extend OEM OCI to 7,500 from 5K. Not that the ESP isn’t capable, I just have more faith in the Amsoil for whatever reason.

To add, I’ve never run a used oil analysis so take everything I say with a grain of salt and welcome to BITOG!

 

[CleverUserName]

Good afternoon,

First time posting. I don’t mean to high jack the thread, but there has been some good information shared.

I purchased a 2025 AT4 3.0 in August. So far, the truck has been great. I did my first oil change at 1k miles, 2nd at 4k miles, and now I’m sitting at a little over 5k miles.

I’m using Castrol Edge Turbo Diesel 0w20 Dexos D. In another 1-2K miles, I’m going to send my oil in for an analysis to see what the wear metals are at.

It looks like some of the 3.0 LZ0 owners are experimenting with a little heavier weights/viscosity and have seen some positive results with their wear metal tests.

I know my truck is under warranty but there have been thrust bearing issues with the 25/26 LZ0 motors and GM recently switched their 6.2 motor to a higher viscosity due to bearing issues.

I’m considering switching to Mobil 1 ESP 0w30 or the Pennzoil Platinum Euro L 5w30, which I believe are both Dexos 2. I also saw that Pennzoil has a Platinum Euro LX 0w30 with low SAPS. It has a very high Boron level. Does anyone have any experience with the Euro LX?

Or there is the Amsoil 5w30 synthetic diesel oil (which they say meets/exceeds Dexos D) and their 5w30 LS synthetic euro oil.

My truck sees a little “around town” usage, but it’s mainly for driving from SoCal to Utah. My truck usually sits around 194-198 degrees for the engine temp. On our way back a few weeks ago, we were sitting in traffic, crawling up a long grade and the truck got up to 219. I was shocked to see this since it was only 60 degrees outside. Makes me wonder about the temp when crossing the desert when it’s 120 degrees.

Any thoughts on the above mentioned oils? Thank you in advance for your time.

Euro LX is Pennzoil's’ Low Ash VW 507 oil. The boron may be borate ester which is organic friction reducer used Pennzoil Ultra Platinum line.

Pennzoil and Quaker State are very similar if not identical in formulation although Quaker State is sometimes cheaper. Keep this in mind.

All of these low ash offerings are marginally better than each other if not the same performance. They all share the same limitations as previously discussed.

 

[edyvw]

Doubt I can help much but thought I’d chime in anyway.

I have a ‘21 with the LM2 with 86k miles. Switched from ESP 0w-20 to ESP 5w-30 about 20k miles ago for two OCI and then to 0w-30 since. From the oils you listed my choice would be the ESP 0w-30. Based on info here and elsewhere, I believe a switch to a x-30 is wise.

Also, after some discussion here with @edyvw, I’ll likely be switching to Amsoil euro 5w-30. He recommended it over the Amsoil diesel 5w-30. My reasoning for wanting to switch to Amsoil is to extend OEM OCI to 7,500 from 5K. Not that the ESP isn’t capable, I just have more faith in the Amsoil for whatever reason.

To add, I’ve never run a used oil analysis so take everything I say with a grain of salt and welcome to BITOG!

I personally find ESP 0W30 exceptional oil. I was just saying, if you go Amsoil, AEL would be my choice.

 

[UNC006]

Doubt I can help much but thought I’d chime in anyway.

I have a ‘21 with the LM2 with 86k miles. Switched from ESP 0w-20 to ESP 5w-30 about 20k miles ago for two OCI and then to 0w-30 since. From the oils you listed my choice would be the ESP 0w-30. Based on info here and elsewhere, I believe a switch to a x-30 is wise.

Also, after some discussion here with @edyvw, I’ll likely be switching to Amsoil euro 5w-30. He recommended it over the Amsoil diesel 5w-30. My reasoning for wanting to switch to Amsoil is to extend OEM OCI to 7,500 from 5K. Not that the ESP isn’t capable, I just have more faith in the Amsoil for whatever reason.

To add, I’ve never run a used oil analysis so take everything I say with a grain of salt and welcome to BITOG!

I wouldn’t extend to 7500 OTI unless I had bypass filtration because EGR & DPF regen pumps abrasive soot into the engine that’s too fine for any non-bypass filter. In a modern diesel without bypass filtration, you’re much better off with Mobil 1 ESP at 4k +-1k OTI than any oil at 7.5k.

The most harmful particles are 2-22 microns. The PPE filter for the LZO is only 23 microns absolute (98.7% multi-pass efficiency), 10 microns nominal (50% multi-pass efficiency).

 

[WarEagle]

I wouldn’t extend to 7500 OTI unless I had bypass filtration because EGR & DPF regen pumps abrasive soot into the engine that’s too fine for any non-bypass filter. In a modern diesel without bypass filtration, you’re much better off with Mobil 1 ESP at 4k +-1k OTI than any oil at 7.5k.

The most harmful particles are 2-22 microns. The PPE filter for the LZO is only 23 microns absolute (98.7% multi-pass efficiency), 10 microns nominal (50% multi-pass efficiency).

I’ll be changing the oil probably next weekend which should put me right at 5,000 miles on this OCI. I’m going to stop by my local Caterpillar and see if I can get an oil analysis kit and see how everything looks

 

[UNC006]

For a lot of owners, the DEXOS D rating is about warranty coverage. The thrust bearing failures, requiring engine replacement, allegedly include a question about whether you are using a Dexos d oil…and potentially an oil sample.

I’ve run both 5w30 ESP and now a 0w20. I can’t say what the used oil analysis will look like just yet, but I can hear the turbo spool up and whoosh about 50% louder with the 0w20. No idea if that’s bad…it’s the spec oil. I’m due to get the bearings inspected and wanted to have a Dexos D spec oil in it when it goes to the dealer.


I want to run a 5w30…but my sample of one used oil analysis on ESP 5w30 wasn’t anything special. Iron was still in the 50s. I have a used oil analysis pending for Castrol EDGE Euro 5w30k…it might be better. Maybe.

Please share how many miles the intervals were for Mobil 1 5W-30, Castrol 5W-30 and 0W-20. 52ppm Iron over 3.5k miles is 14.9ppm/1k miles (bad). Over 7k miles it’s 7.4 (good).

 

[Surprise2]

I wouldn’t extend to 7500 OTI unless I had bypass filtration because EGR & DPF regen pumps abrasive soot into the engine that’s too fine for any non-bypass filter.

I thought that the LM2 and LZ0 EGR pickup location is post DPF so that it uses soot free EGR gasses.

NHTSA bulletin 19-NA-180

 

[UNC006]

I thought that the LM2 and LZ0 EGR pickup location is post DPF so that it uses soot free EGR gasses.

NHTSA bulletin 19-NA-180

You’re right, the low pressure EGR loop is post DPF, which greatly reduces soot pumped into the engine. However, the high pressure EGR loop is used until the engine reaches operating temperature and when under heavy throttle. This system pumps soot back into the engine before it’s filtered out by the DPF.

Also, I was also wrong about regen. It does not get more soot into the oil. It dilutes the oil with diesel because extra fuel is sprayed into the cylinder during regen. So more furl goes unburned and mixes with the oil on the cylinder walls.

So, though my previous post was only partially accurate, the net result of soot from the high pressure EGR and fuel dilution from regen means that earlier 3-5k mile OTI still seem like the better way to go for modern diesels than extended drain intervals via more expensive oil without bypass filtration.

For folks that are going to run 6-10k mile intervals anyways, @CleverUserName ’s suggests to use a low Noack HDEO makes a lot of sense for it’s better soot handling ability.

 

[UNC207]

I've found that the problems with high oil temperature on the LM2 motors are directly related to the oil tubes that spray oil onto the underside of the pistons, which rapidly transfer the oil heat from the aluminum pistons to the oil. It only takes seconds to raise the oil temperature 25 degrees or more. I've had my LM2 push the motor oil temp over 250 degrees on a long grade in under a minute without towing anything.

For the above reason, I changed to AMSOIL Signature Series 0W-40 100% Synthetic Max-Duty Diesel Oil as soon as our LM2s were out of warranty.

 

[WarEagle]

I've found that the problems with high oil temperature on the LM2 motors are directly related to the oil tubes that spray oil onto the underside of the pistons, which rapidly transfer the oil heat from the aluminum pistons to the oil. It only takes seconds to raise the oil temperature 25 degrees or more. I've had my LM2 push the motor oil temp over 250 degrees on a long grade in under a minute without towing anything.

For the above reason, I changed to AMSOIL Signature Series 0W-40 100% Synthetic Max-Duty Diesel Oil as soon as our LM2s were out of warranty.

I just switched from ESP 0w-30 to HPL CK-4 5w-30 after talking with David at HPL. I asked him if I should bump to a 40 and he recommended staying with the 5w-30 for now and see where we’re at after a couple of OCIs

 

[UNC196]

Thought this might be interesting for the topic.


From right to left-

1. Dealer oil change with AC Delco 0-20 and an AC Delco filter. Optilube fuel additive.

2. Mobil 1 ESP 5w30 and a PPE filter. Hotshot EDT fuel additive.

3. Castrol Edge Euro K 5w30 and a PPE filter. Hotshot EDT fuel additive.

4. Castrol Edge Euro Turbo Diesel Dexos D 0w20 and a STP filter. Archoil Winter Blend fuel additive.


I had one oil change I didn’t capture because the PPE filter leaked 2+ quarts and I had to replace it and refill it, which would have changed results.