Catch Cans Work - Toyota D4-S 3.5L V6st (Proof)

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The oil is in its vapor state, how is that going to hurt the engine? It's not even clear if the oil is a significant contributor to DI valve deposit issues, yet these catch cans are selling like crazy on various forums. So a catch can cools the oil vapor enough to condensate, great, but how does that help? If the engine is hot, the intake manifold and the valves are hot, the oil is going to stay in vapor form and go though the combustion process with no problems.
 
Originally Posted by KrisZ
The oil is in its vapor state, how is that going to hurt the engine? It's not even clear if the oil is a significant contributor to DI valve deposit issues, yet these catch cans are selling like crazy on various forums. So a catch can cools the oil vapor enough to condensate, great, but how does that help? If the engine is hot, the intake manifold and the valves are hot, the oil is going to stay in vapor form and go though the combustion process with no problems.


Valvoline seems to think oil that makes it into the combustion chamber or over the valves in direct injected engines could be a problem, along with other oil blenders to change their formulas. Further, OE's changed certain aspects of their direct injected engines to help prevent the oily vapour from building up on the valves because gas no longer washes them so that is point two that the catch can "might" help.
 
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Originally Posted by KrisZ
The oil is in its vapor state, how is that going to hurt the engine? It's not even clear if the oil is a significant contributor to DI valve deposit issues, yet these catch cans are selling like crazy on various forums. So a catch can cools the oil vapor enough to condensate, great, but how does that help? If the engine is hot, the intake manifold and the valves are hot, the oil is going to stay in vapor form and go though the combustion process with no problems.


Once the vapor hits the intake manifold is will also condense and collect inside the intake. In fact, even the PCV line will have oil residue inside it, which means the oil is not saying 100% vapor once it leaves the guts of the engine.

https://youtu.be/l6m3FaNdAA4?t=3m10s
 
Originally Posted by StevieC

It's only because I wanted to prove that they do the job they claim. Whether there is an actual benefit or not is to be debated in the long term.


What exactly is the job they claim? Do people say they don't catch any oil?

Are you proving they catch oil or prevent the GDI problems?
 
Originally Posted by demarpaint
I'd love to see if there's a difference in what the can catches between different brands of oil and if changing viscosity matters.
The crankcase of any engine is full ofoil mist and blow by gasses. The NOACK % of evaporated oil has no real meaning .
 
Originally Posted by AZjeff
Originally Posted by StevieC

It's only because I wanted to prove that they do the job they claim. Whether there is an actual benefit or not is to be debated in the long term.


What exactly is the job they claim? Do people say they don't catch any oil?

Are you proving they catch oil or prevent the GDI problems?


I'm proving they actually catch oil. I don't know if they will fix GDI issues but there is good evidence that it "might" because if there air that is passing over the valves in a GDI engine doesn't contain oil then there is nothing to stick to the valves and create build up. Last I checked air doesn't leave carbon.

In my case because I have Port Injection and Direct Injection and both are active most of the time so it's a non-issue for me. The advantage I can see from running this is that I don't have extra oil going through my intake and coating it, going through the engine and possibly leaving deposits and not going out the catalytic convert poisoning it or coating it with Moly longer term. Now if this actually is of some benefit many miles down the road most likely not because a lot of vehicles live long long lives with original cats and intakes but for GDI it "could" help out the valve issues. Time will tell for other non dual injection systems.
 
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Originally Posted by KrisZ
The oil is in its vapor state, how is that going to hurt the engine?... So a catch can cools the oil vapor enough to condensate, great, but how does that help? If the engine is hot, the intake manifold and the valves are hot, the oil is going to stay in vapor form and go though the combustion process with no problems.
We've recently read, right here on BITOG, that oil in the PCV system is mainly oil mist, not vapor. Water vapor will certainly condense out, especially in cold weather.

Guess what happens when the proposed fuel filter in the PCV line clogs (with ice or oily gunk or whatever)?
 
I don't plan to run the Fuel Filter on the PCV line past the can for long. Just long enough to give me an indication if the can is catching everything or if some of it is getting by. That said I took the exit hose from the can off the Barbed Joiner to the OE hose to route it a different way because it was causing me engine cover not to seat properly and at that point which is 3/4's of the way back to the engine it was completely dry.

The OE hose before I installed the can was wet inside with oil when it was in the stock configuration. So time will tell.
 
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Stevie, one of my other posts I linked a white paper from MIT on the various paths that oil into the PCV system is generated. If a vehicle has a PCV system, it's an engineering impossibility to keep all of the oil out of the system. Tighter rings, PCV baffles, other trickery can help, but it's a simple fact of oil that "some" portion is going to vaporize; either from heat, from being slung around mercilessly by the rotating assembly, or yada yada. I think the only real way to eliminate all intake issues would be a line from the PCV to some tie-in point after the converter. But obviously then you run legally afoul of several things... plus you take the chance of the oil not being hot enough to fully vaporize, and dripping liquid oil out of your exhaust.
 
If you really want to get fancy, save the cup drippings until you can fill an oil sample cup with it, and send it out for a UOA. That would tell you how much was water, how much was fuel, and how much was oil. The makeup of the oil is really insignificant other than to see what parts of the additives made it all the way through the system.
 
Originally Posted by StevieC
I don't plan to run the Fuel Filter on the PCV line past the can for long. Just long enough to give me an indication if the can is catching everything or if some of it is getting by. ...
OK. About "catching everything," at least one of the catch-can enthusiasts on priuschat.com has already tried running two of them in series. Yes, the second one caught some. Some brands have proven more effective than others.
 
Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
Stevie, one of my other posts I linked a white paper from MIT on the various paths that oil into the PCV system is generated. If a vehicle has a PCV system, it's an engineering impossibility to keep all of the oil out of the system. Tighter rings, PCV baffles, other trickery can help, but it's a simple fact of oil that "some" portion is going to vaporize; either from heat, from being slung around mercilessly by the rotating assembly, or yada yada. I think the only real way to eliminate all intake issues would be a line from the PCV to some tie-in point after the converter. But obviously then you run legally afoul of several things... plus you take the chance of the oil not being hot enough to fully vaporize, and dripping liquid oil out of your exhaust.


I figured that 100% is not achievable... I get that.


Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
If you really want to get fancy, save the cup drippings until you can fill an oil sample cup with it, and send it out for a UOA. That would tell you how much was water, how much was fuel, and how much was oil. The makeup of the oil is really insignificant other than to see what parts of the additives made it all the way through the system.


Good idea, I would be curious to see what it's made up of.
grin2.gif
 
Originally Posted by CR94
Originally Posted by StevieC
I don't plan to run the Fuel Filter on the PCV line past the can for long. Just long enough to give me an indication if the can is catching everything or if some of it is getting by. ...
OK. About "catching everything," at least one of the catch-can enthusiasts on priuschat.com has already tried running two of them in series. Yes, the second one caught some. Some brands have proven more effective than others.


Thanks... Interesting.
 
At Wide Open Throttle......The crankcase is evacuated through the Breather Hose NOT the PCV Valve & Hose.

I only installed catch can's on boosted vehicles & we had to use TWO of them for it to be effective......One inline on the breather hose & one inline on the PCV line (with a check valve that seals better than the PCV valve).
 
This thing has an 8 speed transmission. So at best I'm doing 2K rpm on the highway when traveling at really high speeds. Well high enough not to loose my license.
Usually I do 120 KPH / 74.5 MPH it's about 1850 RPM according to my scan gauge.

Even accelerating moderately rarely pushes the RPM over 3K before the transmission shifts and if it's in "Eco/Boring" mode it wants to shift well before then as it tries to lock-up as soon as possible with its various multi-stage lock-up modes available in most gears.

I hardly ever mash my foot into the floor and take it out to the redline because it has a lot of power as it is in the lower RPM band for more than adequate passing. And speeding.
grin2.gif
 
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Originally Posted by CT8
Originally Posted by demarpaint
I'd love to see if there's a difference in what the can catches between different brands of oil and if changing viscosity matters.
The crankcase of any engine is full ofoil mist and blow by gasses. The NOACK % of evaporated oil has no real meaning .


And i'm thinking it is a poor man's way of checking NOACK. Either way if that was collected after 250 miles, that was a lot of oil, and combustion by-products..
 
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Originally Posted by StevieC
Again because no one seems to read the post above where I explained the "Why" behind this. This is only an experiment, I'm not saying it's needed. Since I have it in place I will just leave it in place because catching the oil can't do anything but help for the reasons I mentioned above.

It's only because I wanted to prove that they do the job they claim. Whether there is an actual benefit or not is to be debated in the long term.


I am listening. I am reading and comprehending. Great Job! Keep it up.

Which model of catch can did you use?
 
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