Brazil Plane Crash

[Brons2]

This happened to a city close to where i live.

They are talking a lot about icing and stall , i don't know a lot about aircrafts. But we will know this after they remove the bodies, there was 62 passengers, no one survived (obviously). They have recovered 30 bodies so far.

My wife was born and lived all her life in Sao Paulo until emigrating to the US, and she was in Sao Paulo on family business when this crash happened. She had flown several times between Rio and Sao Paulo the week of the crash, so as you can probably imagine, there was a moment of sheer panic when I heard there had been a crash in Brazil. When I saw it was an ATR though I knew she was safe as there are only 737 and A32x operating between CGH and SDU.

 

[Brons2]

Just checked, no high terrain between the two airports.

Lowest safe altitude was 6000

View attachment 234649

Hmm. I am pretty familiar with the local geography around Sao Paulo, and that looks like a straight line. Just eyeballing that, the Mantiqueira Mountains don't seem to be super far off that line, and they go up to 9100 feet-ish. I wonder if @Astro14 has ever taken the 76 down to GRU/SBGR, he might be familiar.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mantiqueira_Mountains

 

[Astro14]

Hmm. I am pretty familiar with the local geography around Sao Paulo, and that looks like a straight line. Just eyeballing that, the Mantiqueira Mountains don't seem to be super far off that line, and they go up to 9100 feet-ish. I wonder if @Astro14 has ever taken the 76 down to GRU/SBGR, he might be familiar.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mantiqueira_Mountains

I am not familiar enough to comment on that. I would have to check the charts

 

[Just a civilian pilot]

Hmm. I am pretty familiar with the local geography around Sao Paulo, and that looks like a straight line. Just eyeballing that, the Mantiqueira Mountains don't seem to be super far off that line, and they go up to 9100 feet-ish. I wonder if @Astro14 has ever taken the 76 down to GRU/SBGR, he might be familiar.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mantiqueira_Mountains

Yes, that was a straight line.

I have never flown to SA.

ATC ( actually, pilots not declaring an emergency...ATC would have got them lower but the pilots NEVER mentioned severe ice to ATC ) not high terrain, is what kept them in the severe ice.

101% pilot error as harsh as that sounds.

 

[Just a civilian pilot]

Hmm. I am pretty familiar with the local geography around Sao Paulo, and that looks like a straight line. Just eyeballing that, the Mantiqueira Mountains don't seem to be super far off that line, and they go up to 9100 feet-ish. I wonder if @Astro14 has ever taken the 76 down to GRU/SBGR, he might be familiar.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mantiqueira_Mountains

I just double checked the terrain along that straight line and nothing is above 10,000 , even if not going direct.

Highest elevation is 9.180 feet.

For me , as a pilot, as long as the en route terrain is NOT above 10,000 en route, I am not concerned at all ( in case of loss of pressurization or engine failure....highest can maintain altitude single engine is about 17,000 ).

Approach and landing is different ( especially with no ATC radar for the approach ) if its a mountainous airport.

Pedra da Mina

2,798 m (9,180 ft)

22°25′S 44°51′W

[td]



Highest point

No ATC radar for this airport.



Incident: Canada Rouge B763 near Huatulco on Jan 29th 2018, EGPWS terrain warning prevents CFIT​

By Simon Hradecky, created Wednesday, Feb 7th 2018 21:15Z, last updated Wednesday, Feb 7th 2018 21:38Z​ ​ An Air Canada Rouge Boeing 767-300, registration C-GHLU performing flight RV-1893 from Calgary,AB (Canada) to Huatulco (Mexico) with 250 passengers and 9 crew, was in level flight at 16,000 feet about 33nm north of Huatulco in non-radar environment, when air traffic control cleared the flight to descend to 6000 feet MSL at pilot's discretion. About 30nm north of the aerodrome the crew initiated the descent, about a minute later at 11,800 feet MSL the crew received an EGPWS "Caution Terrain" aural warning. The crew climbed the aircraft back to 13,500 feet MSL and continued to Huatulco before commencing the descent and landing safely. The Canadian TSB reported Mexico's DGAC rated the occurrence a serious incident and opened an investigation. According to approach plates for Huatulco the minimum safe altitude north of the aerodrome is 13,400 feet. Terrain is rising up to 3600 meters/11808 feet about 24nm north of the aerodrome.​

​

 

[Brons2]

The rules for getting a tour of United training Center are somewhat complex.

You have to have a “sponsor“, someone who works there. You have to provide your drivers license, phone number, address, and email, and that sponsor has to obtain prior permission with all of your above information.

The family of every new hire pilot gets a tour, on “family day” when the new hires get their wings. United flies the families out to Denver, gratis, positive space, and provides a shuttle from the airport to the training center. The tour doesn’t include flying the Sim, but you get to see all of the evacuation training and aircraft mockups that the flight attendants use in addition to the flight training devices.

It’s the world’s largest airline training center, there’s a lot of space to wander around and see cool stuff. We have a Memorial Garden for the crews lost on 9-11. We even have a museum, with uniforms, and other artifacts, models and film footage dating back to 1928. It’s a great tour honestly.

If you want to fly the simulator, then your sponsor must be qualified to operate the simulator, which means they have to be either an instructor or evaluator. Further, Scheduling is not allowed to schedule a tour during normal business hours.

So, a lot of pieces have to line up for the simulator tour. You need to know in advance, you have to get permission, you have to have the right “sponsor“ and you have to have the simulator availability.

So you're saying there is a chance?

(just kidding)

 

[Astro14]

So you're saying there is a chance?

(just kidding)

Well - More of a chance than Jim Carrey had with her!

 

[wwillson]

The final report was released. Seems to be the usual accident cause, as series of mistakes that lead to disaster.

Brazil Releases Final Report on Deadly Voepass Flight 2283 Crash That Killed 62

Brazil's Center for Investigation and Prevention of Aeronautical Accidents (CENIPA) has released its final report into the tragic crash of Voepass Flight 2283, identifying a combination of icing conditions, de-icing system failures, pilot actions, maintenance shortcomings, and organizational safety deficiencies as the factors that led to the loss of all 62 people on board.
The accident occurred on August 9, 2024, when the ATR 72-500 was operating Flight 2283 from Cascavel to São Paulo-Guarulhos. While cruising, the aircraft encountered severe icing conditions before entering an aerodynamic stall and an unrecoverable flat spin. The aircraft crashed in Vinhedo, northwest of São Paulo, leaving no survivors. The dramatic final moments of the aircraft were captured on video and quickly spread worldwide.

According to the final investigation, the ATR encountered atmospheric conditions favorable for severe ice accumulation. Investigators found that the aircraft's de-icing system suffered multiple malfunctions during the flight. Cockpit recordings revealed the captain reported the de-icing system was not functioning correctly, while the first officer admitted at one point that he had forgotten to activate it. The crew repeatedly switched the system on and off despite continuous icing warnings.

The report states that the aircraft generated eight "Cruise Speed Low" warnings and later a "Degraded Performance" alert, but the required emergency procedures were not fully carried out. Investigators believe the crew may have experienced "inattentional blindness" and "inattentional deafness," where excessive workload caused them to overlook or fail to respond to critical warnings.

CENIPA identified a total of 19 contributing factors behind the accident. These included adverse weather, crew decision-making, emotional state of the pilots, equipment failures, operational pressures, organizational deficiencies, and insufficient regulatory oversight.
The investigation also uncovered significant maintenance and safety culture issues within Voepass. Previous failures involving the aircraft's de-icing system were reportedly not properly documented in maintenance records. Investigators found evidence that some maintenance tasks were performed without adequate supervision and described a "culture of informality" where pilots and mechanics avoided recording technical defects to keep aircraft in service.

Additionally, investigators noted that the aircraft should not have been dispatched due to an unrelated windshield wiper fault, although this defect was not considered a direct cause of the crash.

As a result of the investigation, CENIPA has issued safety recommendations to the European Union Aviation Safety Agency (EASA) and ATR, urging a review of the ATR "Degraded Performance" procedures to better prepare flight crews for severe icing events and prevent similar accidents in the future.

Voepass suspended operations after Brazil's aviation regulator ANAC raised safety concerns and later filed for bankruptcy protection in 2025. ANAC has announced it will conduct a detailed technical review of the report and its recommendations over the coming months.
The final report reinforces a long-standing aviation safety lesson: major accidents rarely result from a single failure. Instead, they occur when technical faults, environmental hazards, human factors, maintenance practices, and organizational weaknesses align, creating a chain of events that ends in catastrophe.

 

[fdcg27]

FWIU, cycling the boots on and off is the proper action in using them. Some ice is allowed to accumulate that inflating the boots will then break free.
I wonder how much of this was related to the previously found deficiencies of the ATR in actual icing conditions?
There have been other similar accidents, notably the one in Roselawn, IN.
Still, this carrier does seem to have operated in a pretty informal manner, without adherence to rigorous operating and maintenance standards.