Berkeley Professor arrested for Assault.

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Just because the CEO Ken Lay did (a lot of) unethical things does not mean business people are unethical as a group. Just because a former teacher did something unethical does not mean teachers are unethical as a group.

What concerns me is the people who see these examples as good evidence that the group is unethical as a whole. This ties in with "the part-whole fallacy" and "confirmation bias"...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy_of_composition
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias
 
Originally Posted By: Vuflanovsky
..... wealthy alumni will contribute to their alma maters or programs that they believe in whether that involves their name on a building or an ongoing scholarship program or not. They won't hold back funds based on how thoroughly politicized they think a university system, administration, student body or climate is .....


I have no idea about wealthy alumni, but I no longer donate to my alma mater because of their lack of commitment to freedom of speech.

They enlist students to call and beg for money, and when I tell them why I will not contribute, they seem to not understand the basic principle of free speech.
 
Originally Posted By: PimTac
A video of the Montana "incident" has been released and the witness has changed her story. The witness is a reporter herself. The Guardian reporter was rude and intrusive.


Please provide a link to the video that proves your assertion.
 
Originally Posted By: WillsYoda
Just because the CEO Ken Lay did (a lot of) unethical things does not mean business people are unethical as a group. Just because a former teacher did something unethical does not mean teachers are unethical as a group.

What concerns me is the people who see these examples as good evidence that the group is unethical as a whole. This ties in with "the part-whole fallacy" and "confirmation bias"...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy_of_composition
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias



While I agree with you in principal, I think it's fair to say that the majority of the education establishment (at all grade levels), just like the majority of 'journalists' lean a certain way politically....there is nothing wrong with that until they start being BIASED and indoctrinating.
In 2004, my daughter came home from grammer school and told me that they had a mock election and that the teachers were definitely pushing for Kerry....I don't think that teachers should be INDOCTRINATING young pre teens...I called the school and made a complaint. When she was in HS 4 years later the same thing happened. Are taxpayer funded schools supposed to
push a political agenda?
It is a pretty well known fact that a college students grades will suffer if they espouse conservative views....this is also WRONG...
 
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Lots of trashy 'educators' in the USA. Really not surprised at all what he did.
I sure had a few in hs and that was in the 80's. Had 2 of them trying to push the sierra club on us.
 
Originally Posted By: pbm

The newly elected Congressman (not Senator) did not use a weapon and was responding to an aggressive pushing of a microphone in his face by a member of the BIASED media.


I just knew there would be an excuse for assault offered in this case.
 
Originally Posted By: WillsYoda
1. He is not a Berkeley prof. He isn't even a teacher anymore, and was never a professor anywhere. He is a former Diablo Valley College temp instuctor who does not even have a doctorate (all real professors have doctorates like PhDs). He got a masters degree from a 4th rate program that lets in anyone with a pulse. So he is not in any substantial sense representative of either Berekely, professors, or ethicists.

2. Educators by and large are good people who work day and night to help our kids thrive.

It pains me when people disparage educators as a group. I've known many who are living saints.



While I agree that most educators are good people just as most police officers, mailmen, truck drivers etc....are....there are plenty who aren't. About 10 years ago, while I was doing an inspection of a sleazy motel in the South Bronx, I struck up a conversation with the hotel manager. It happened to be July and I asked him how business was (this was a hotel that had 'hourly rates')...and he said "it's been slow because the high school down the block is off for summer vacation"....I thought about it for a second or two and said.."the students"??...he replied....."No, the teachers".... I was shocked. That is a true story.
 
Originally Posted By: WillsYoda
1. He is not a Berkeley prof. He isn't even a teacher anymore, and was never a professor anywhere. He is a former Diablo Valley College temp instuctor who does not even have a doctorate (all real professors have doctorates like PhDs). He got a masters degree from a 4th rate program that lets in anyone with a pulse. So he is not in any substantial sense representative of either Berekely, professors, or ethicists.

2. Educators by and large are good people who work day and night to help our kids thrive.

It pains me when people disparage educators as a group. I've known many who are living saints.


You hit the nail on the head. There's some bad apples out there but most to what I have witnessed are awesome individuals who care deeply for the education of students.

The chair of my department and is also a Software Engineering professor is one of the hardest working people I know. She worked hard getting industry experience and got her PHD and became a professor 25 years ago.

She taught 18 credits this semester which is a HUGE amount for those who aren't familiar with University credit hours. She also at the same time handle the budgets for the Computer Science, Computer Engineering, and Software Engineering departments. Not only that but she has been working so much overtime and put forth all her effort to get our Computer Engineering department ABET accredited and also our Software Engineering department ABET accredited (we are only 1 of 27 colleges with ABET accreditation for SE).

It's a shame that those bad apples are out there but there will always be.

For the most part in my experience in college and high school every teacher/professor I have had has been upmost professional, striving for us to have a quality eduction and leave their opinions to themselves and not in the classroom.
 
Originally Posted By: Win
Originally Posted By: Vuflanovsky
..... wealthy alumni will contribute to their alma maters or programs that they believe in whether that involves their name on a building or an ongoing scholarship program or not. They won't hold back funds based on how thoroughly politicized they think a university system, administration, student body or climate is .....


I have no idea about wealthy alumni, but I no longer donate to my alma mater because of their lack of commitment to freedom of speech.

They enlist students to call and beg for money, and when I tell them why I will not contribute, they seem to not understand the basic principle of free speech.


...and that's fair...while I'm not a fan of academia in general, my point was I think you need to separate the "what" and "why" of what these donors are contributing to versus intimating that the political climate of a university is going to dictate someone dropping the idea of funding a new engineering wing or a nanotechnology institute. These people doing such usually don't have a particular agenda and so if someone is "surprised" that they don't withdraw funds based on x then ( at least in those cases ) that's just projecting their POV/agenda onto something that doesn't have one in the first place.
 
Originally Posted By: Alfred_B
I guess when assaults happen:

Anti-Trump... you get arrested and your life is ruined.

Pro-Trump... you get elected to the Senate.


Anti-Trump. Hit several people over the head with a bike lock causing serious injury and there's video of it happening.

Pro-Trump. Just audio recording of a reporter who claims he was body slammed but no actual witnesses to the event.
 
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Originally Posted By: Alfred_B
I guess when assaults happen:

Anti-Trump... you get arrested and your life is ruined.

Pro-Trump... you get elected to the Senate.


Anti-Trump. Hit several people over the head with a bike lock causing serious injury and there's video of it happening.

Pro-Trump. Just audio recording of a reporter who claims he was body slammed but no actual witnesses to the event.



Guess you totally missed the discussion about a Fox News team (pro-Trump org, BTW) saying that the reporter was attacked just for asking a question about a heath bill?
 
So typical of "The Mob". Extremely reactive, violent, irrational, and mentally unstable. Very frustrated, lost souls internally. Nonexistent self-control & self-awareness. Still attention seeking after all these years....no doubt he'll find plenty of company in prison with the rest of the sociopaths.

Come and Take Them.
 
Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Originally Posted By: Alfred_B
I guess when assaults happen:

Anti-Trump... you get arrested and your life is ruined.

Pro-Trump... you get elected to the Senate.


Anti-Trump. Hit several people over the head with a bike lock causing serious injury and there's video of it happening.

Pro-Trump. Just audio recording of a reporter who claims he was body slammed but no actual witnesses to the event.



Guess you totally missed the discussion about a Fox News team (pro-Trump org, BTW) saying that the reporter was attacked just for asking a question about a heath bill?


There might have been a discussion about that, but the guy who just got elected was the one who was accused by a reporter of being body slammed. There wasn't any video or witnesses, just an audio recording where the reporter claimed he was just body slammed. That may have actually happened as the guy who was elected apologized.

I think it's different than having video of someone getting hit over the head with a bike lock.
 
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Originally Posted By: Alfred_B
I guess when assaults happen:

Anti-Trump... you get arrested and your life is ruined.

Pro-Trump... you get elected to the Senate.


Anti-Trump. Hit several people over the head with a bike lock causing serious injury and there's video of it happening.

Pro-Trump. Just audio recording of a reporter who claims he was body slammed but no actual witnesses to the event.



Guess you totally missed the discussion about a Fox News team (pro-Trump org, BTW) saying that the reporter was attacked just for asking a question about a heath bill?


There might have been a discussion about that, but the guy who just got elected was the one who was accused by a reporter of being body slammed. There wasn't any video or witnesses, just an audio recording where the reporter claimed he was just body slammed. That may have actually happened as the guy who was elected apologized.

I think it's different than having video of someone getting hit over the head with a bike lock.


The Fox team WERE the witnesses to Gianforte's alleged assault. I think V_P is referring to the 19th post, where that is explained with a link to an article written by one of the witnesses: Fox Reporter's Article about the Incident
 
13.gif
 
Originally Posted By: pbm
Originally Posted By: WillsYoda
Just because the CEO Ken Lay did (a lot of) unethical things does not mean business people are unethical as a group. Just because a former teacher did something unethical does not mean teachers are unethical as a group.

What concerns me is the people who see these examples as good evidence that the group is unethical as a whole. This ties in with "the part-whole fallacy" and "confirmation bias"...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy_of_composition
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias



While I agree with you in principal, I think it's fair to say that the majority of the education establishment (at all grade levels), just like the majority of 'journalists' lean a certain way politically....there is nothing wrong with that until they start being BIASED and indoctrinating.
In 2004, my daughter came home from grammer school and told me that they had a mock election and that the teachers were definitely pushing for Kerry....I don't think that teachers should be INDOCTRINATING young pre teens...I called the school and made a complaint. When she was in HS 4 years later the same thing happened. Are taxpayer funded schools supposed to
push a political agenda?
It is a pretty well known fact that a college students grades will suffer if they espouse conservative views....this is also WRONG...


When I was in grade school in the 70s,we had a mock election (Carter vs Ford). I remember how much fun it was and we as well as our teacher (she was awesome,I still remember her) had a blast! No bias or leanings whatsoever. It was just an exercise to teach us about the voting process. Things sure have changed huh!
 
Originally Posted By: Vuflanovsky
While the sentiment of this thread is preaching to the choir ( at least in my case ), I think wealthy alumni will contribute to their alma maters or programs that they believe in whether that involves their name on a building or an ongoing scholarship program or not. They won't hold back funds based on how thoroughly politicized they think a university system, administration, student body or climate is if it furthers a philanthropic goal. Many wealthy donors are involved with the universities at a granular level that doesn't involve idjits with bike locks or anarchist scum that are there to agitate. It might be hard to understand this but sometimes everything doesn't fit into an ideological box governed by an "us and them" sentiment. Shocking...I know.



At least here, Univeristy of Missouri did suffer after the Melissa Click incident I mentioned before. Enrollment was down 25% the next school year.

Many alumni, my wife included, haven't donated since. It also made it easier to no renew our Mizzou football season tickets.

I don't recall how much they said donations were down. The only figure I recall was the enrollment and as I said, about 25% maybe lower, but certainly more than a 20% drop.

It does matter to some alumni and impacts their choices to send their kids to the school.
 
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