Auto-Rx mixed with Redline

[c3po]

Originally Posted By: 92GTA
Originally Posted By: c3po
Originally Posted By: 92GTA
Originally Posted By: stang5
why do you think you need to arx the car? It's been fed synthetic oil it's whole life....


Lol, my eyes. It looks awful under the valve covers and in the valley. Totally covered and even textured.


I see that you have said it LOOKS awful under the valve covers and in the valley, any chance you could take some before pics, and when you are done with the Clean and Rinse Phase of arx you can take some after pics and show us so we can compare the before and after pics.


Sorry, I just finished a top-end refresh and don't want to tear it apart again just for pics otherwise I would. I'd love to show how the cleaning abilities of Royal Purple are totally bogus even with good PCVs and changing it every 3,000 miles even though it didn't need it,


What are you expecting arx to accomplish here, meaning do you think it will clean up everything under the valve covers, I would think after the Rinse Phase of arx is done you would want to take a look and see what arx has cleaned up, you may be surprised.

 

[92GTA]

What are you expecting arx to accomplish here, meaning do you think it will clean up everything under the valve covers, I would think after the Rinse Phase of arx is done you would want to take a look and see what arx has cleaned up, you may be surprised. [/quote]

I cleaned most of the top-end up during my refresh. I am looking to clean what I couldn't see at this point. Thanks for the concern though.

 

[Gary Allan]

POE is a common component to both Auto-Rx and Redline. One other component of Auto-Rx is an ester friction modifier and the other one is the natural fatty acid ester.

I would not choose this oil to use with Auto-Rx.

 

[BuickGN]

Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
POE is a common component to both Auto-Rx and Redline. One other component of Auto-Rx is an ester friction modifier and the other one is the natural fatty acid ester.

I would not choose this oil to use with Auto-Rx.


Gary, are you implying you want two unlike oils, an ester and a dino?

 

[JohnBrowning]

You know I have never taken the Lords name in vain put some of you people just need to be taken out back and beaten for not reading or doing the slightest bit of home work! The bottle last time I checked said not to use synthetic, this web site has covered it at least 1000 times and Frank has his own web site with more details then anyone should need on how to use this product!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. You can not run it with Redline it is like a complete and total waste it will not work or do anything! If you did this you just tossed your money away because you will get nothing int he line of effects. It will not hurt anything it just will not clean!


Auto-Rx is a natural ester read the patent or the form for more information! One little bottle or even two can not compete with a sump full of synthetic ester's. All ester's are polar and will seak out other polar items like metals...........So if the ester in Redline are trying to seak out all the alloys in the engine and bond with them how is Auto-Rx supposed to do that? Not to mention Redline has more additives then any other oil sold in the USA for automotive applications. The more chemistry you stick in the sump the more Auto-Rx has to compete with. Organa metalic additives are generaly polar as well outher wise they would not want anything to do with the alloy parts in your car they would be repuled.

PAO would in fact work half way decent in theory because it is not very polar and neither are G-I-III base stock's. In a PAO situation though you would normally have a lot more additives in the oil because it would be designed to exceed the performance or OCI of conventional oils additives levels more then anything else are what allows an oil to last longer then another all else being close to equal!

Many allounces have been made inthe last 3 years to Auto-Rx to try and make it easier to use this is why I think some G-III oils are allowed for the cleaning phase like RTS but last time I checked and it has been a while yous till needed to use nothing but dino for the rinse if you expect the crude to release fromthe parts and into the oil!

I know I am being a bit short or stern but this has been covered more then 100 times on this board and probably closer to 1000 times. Their are instructions onthe bottle and their is even a seperate forum just for this product and how best to use it. So their is no shortage of information that is already waiting for you to read it.

So use with cheap dino it is not going to be in the sump that long and rinse with cheap dino!


http://www.tattoodle.com/results/results.aspx?q=Can+auto+rx+be+used+with+synthetic

 

[Oilpants]

Im right their with you John Browing!!! Why cant people read and follow simple instructoin's??? if I were to think my cars engine was dirty and slutched I shurely would consider auto Rx a prime candydate/organic polar cleaner!!!

 

[azsynthetic]

Originally Posted By: Oilpants
Why cant people read and follow simple instructoin's???


The same reason that we are here asking about what oil is the best while that information is clearly spelled out in the owner manual.

 

[postjeeprcr]

Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
POE is a common component to both Auto-Rx and Redline. One other component of Auto-Rx is an ester friction modifier and the other one is the natural fatty acid ester.

I would not choose this oil to use with Auto-Rx.


That is interesting one ester is a natural fatty acid, I wonder how an oil made of natural fatty acid esters would clean.

 

[BoiseRob]

Originally Posted By: postjeeprcr
..........I wonder how an oil made of natural fatty acid esters would clean.


postjeepcr,

You do know that soap is made from fat, right?

 

[92GTA]

Straight from Auto-Rx on the subject!!!!

"Redline uses a polyol ester base. This is very similar to the polyol ester we use in ARX. This application would work fine. It is likely that at $8.95 per quart, Red Line users aren’t interested in running a 2500 mile clean phase. I would suggest that he run a 4000- 5000 mile cleaning phase. This would be fine unless the motor is sludged up, which is unlikely on this motor and oils run over its life. You get some cleaning from RedLine on its own. But he will get a lot more cleaned up in the recommended 4 to 5 K cleaning phase. I would think that he might want to run a 3 or 4 fluid ounce maintenance dose total in the next OCI with Red Line.

Frank"

I also would like to note that I forgot to order my 2nd bottle not knowing I needed that much and after ordering the 2nd, he very promptly still gave me the 2 bottle order price even though it was 2 seperate orders a couple hours apart. Thanks Frank!

Alex

 

[BuickGN]

Originally Posted By: JohnBrowning
You know I have never taken the Lords name in vain put some of you people just need to be taken out back and beaten for not reading or doing the slightest bit of home work! The bottle last time I checked said not to use synthetic, this web site has covered it at least 1000 times and Frank has his own web site with more details then anyone should need on how to use this product!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. You can not run it with Redline it is like a complete and total waste it will not work or do anything! If you did this you just tossed your money away because you will get nothing int he line of effects. It will not hurt anything it just will not clean!


Auto-Rx is a natural ester read the patent or the form for more information! One little bottle or even two can not compete with a sump full of synthetic ester's. All ester's are polar and will seak out other polar items like metals...........So if the ester in Redline are trying to seak out all the alloys in the engine and bond with them how is Auto-Rx supposed to do that? Not to mention Redline has more additives then any other oil sold in the USA for automotive applications. The more chemistry you stick in the sump the more Auto-Rx has to compete with. Organa metalic additives are generaly polar as well outher wise they would not want anything to do with the alloy parts in your car they would be repuled.

PAO would in fact work half way decent in theory because it is not very polar and neither are G-I-III base stock's. In a PAO situation though you would normally have a lot more additives in the oil because it would be designed to exceed the performance or OCI of conventional oils additives levels more then anything else are what allows an oil to last longer then another all else being close to equal!

Many allounces have been made inthe last 3 years to Auto-Rx to try and make it easier to use this is why I think some G-III oils are allowed for the cleaning phase like RTS but last time I checked and it has been a while yous till needed to use nothing but dino for the rinse if you expect the crude to release fromthe parts and into the oil!

I know I am being a bit short or stern but this has been covered more then 100 times on this board and probably closer to 1000 times. Their are instructions onthe bottle and their is even a seperate forum just for this product and how best to use it. So their is no shortage of information that is already waiting for you to read it.

So use with cheap dino it is not going to be in the sump that long and rinse with cheap dino!


http://www.tattoodle.com/results/results.aspx?q=Can+auto+rx+be+used+with+synthetic



I think that's all the OP was asking for, an explanation of why it works the way it works. Not everyone is a mindless sheep, some want to know the reasoning behind things. It didn't make sense to not use a PAO and an Ester. Now I know the answer is the additives in the PAO and the polarity of the ester. See, how hard was that? It only took 20 posts and 100 rude comments to get to that.

This is the homework you talk about. Frank was e-mailed first. And taken out back and beaten, hope you have more than 2 people.

 

[sprintman]

I don't have much experience with RX but you can choose a better oil. And forget this 'looking under the valve cover mania' as it's purely a splash fed area and very little happens.

 

[BuickGN]

It's the ring land cleaning abilities interest me but they're kind of hard to see through the valvecover.

I think most people use the valvecovers as a reference because that region usually has the most sludge and it's the only thing you can see without taking something apart.

 

[c3po]

Originally Posted By: sprintman
I don't have much experience with RX but you can choose a better oil. And forget this 'looking under the valve cover mania' as it's purely a splash fed area and very little happens.


I would guess most people are into THE VALVE COVER MANIA because on many of today's engines that is where the camshaft is, I would think if people are buying a product to clean there engines that they would want this area clean to.

 

[JohnBrowning]

It is just frustrating how many thousands of times does it need to be covered??????????????? Frank has his own Forum and more instructions on his site then Jimmy Carter has liver pills as to how best used the product for sludge,varnish,engines,transmission,powers teering!!!! You name it....It is not like ARX just came on the market and has instructions in Chinese on the back of the bottle and now web site support?

This is not a case of "Their are better oils to use!" this is a case of "It flat out will not work with Redline due to combination of Ester content and additives that are sky high!!" Frank has said this himself I am not making this stuff up. On top that why do we need to spoon feed everything to everyone does not a consumer have some responsibility to make sure he use's the product he bought in the manner in which it is intended? Google brings up all kinds of BITOG stufff on synthetics and "Auto-RX"......What is next do we have to tell people to put oil in the 710 cap and not the coolant cap? Even something as idiot proof as a DVD player comes with instructions and in this case their is an entire web site devoted to Auto-Rx that is well beyond the instruction book that came with your DVD player and TV set that no one reads! This is a product that has to be better documented then any other consumer product!

On top of that if I was made a mistake that bone headed I sure would not want to shout it out loud on a forum of about 10,000+ members! That is like forgetting to put the drain plug back in most people that change their own oil have done it at least once but most do not brag about!LOL I am happy to say I have not yet done that but my Dad has! Luckily he noticed before starting the car!

 

[92GTA]

Well the email response I posted from Frank at Auto-Rx a couple posts back that he sent me this morning sure is opposite of what you states he said. Maybe what you are quoting is from some time ago. Things do change you know. Have an open mind and try thinking new thoughts and have new ideas every now and then.

 

[c3po]

Originally Posted By: 92GTA
Well the email response I posted from Frank at Auto-Rx a couple posts back that he sent me this morning sure is opposite of what you states he said. Maybe what you are quoting is from some time ago. Things do change you know. Have an open mind and try thinking new thoughts and have new ideas every now and then.


1) BuickGN
2) sprintman
3) Gary Allan
4) John Browning

I think you are going to have a very hard time convincing these 4 members that it is fine to use Redline Oil for your ARX Clean Phase, its just not going to happen.

sprintman has been using arx longer than anyone on this board, he knows what he is talking about.

Gary Allan is a very respected member here, and when he says something we all listen.

John Browning is another member with alot of knowledge on this subject.

I have no clue why Frank is changing his mind on this subject, but when I was 1st going to use arx I told him I wanted to use Amsoil 100% Synthetic Oil, and he told me to use dino oil becuase that would get me the best results, it seems you have already made up your mind about using Redline Oil for the Clean Phase so I just do not understand why you started this thread, if it was to convince everyone that its o.k. to use Redline then I just do not see anyone on here who wants to follow your lead.

 

[sprintman]

I used RL with RX many years ago, I won't be doing it again, each to their own though. Oh and I'm with BuickGN, ring pack cleaning does it for me, Ihave zero interest what it looks like under the valve cover (you should see my Mazda)

 

[Gary Allan]

Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
POE is a common component to both Auto-Rx and Redline. One other component of Auto-Rx is an ester friction modifier and the other one is the natural fatty acid ester.

I would not choose this oil to use with Auto-Rx.


Gary, are you implying you want two unlike oils, an ester and a dino?


I don't know if I'm implying that (as in, I don't know). Just on the surface view I don't think you would want something with SUCH an aggressive add pack competing for the turf. It will trump it, but YMMV. The use of the more oddball oils (like RL and something like GC perhaps) adds the complication that while some chemist may have spun up something in a jar ..or factored it from the chemical properties in "what would/should happen", not too many tests in the field have probably been done to determine just what the best duration/frequency is to provide maximum effect.

I don't know how long the OP has had this engine on Red Line. If it's been a few years, then I'd say that it's either done as much as it can do in terms of whatever cleaning ability it has ..or ... the deposits are more service related* and can't be coped with by Red Line ..or they were there before the start of Redline and Redline hasn't had enough time to do the job .. (can I find another combo in there?).


* service related - exclusive short trip ..maybe employing some older trick techniques like cooler thermostat ..aftermarket intake w/o coolant ports ..whatever.

 

[JohnBrowning]

Redline will not leave any deposits from hydrocarbons but with the additive package it has it could leave a lot of molly behind plated to the surfaces. Redline can do some cleaning but not the type of cleaning that ARX does. ARX can usually clean out past chemistry if that is an issue.

If the car has been run on Redline and has not had something like coolant leak or over heat a head then it should not have a lot of deposits. Few synthetics leave many deposits behind in a healthy engine. Their is one guy with 300,000+ on his Honda running almost nothing but Redline and his engine is spotless inside!The pics are posted some place onthis site!