Auto-Rx maintenance dose...

[Saturn_Fan]

That's great. ARX is a solid product, I don't think anyone is arguing this point. I think folks are seeing some people using 2 oz, some 3, others 4, and this is creating confusion in BITOG land.

I have given my position some thought, and I think going with what the directions say on the web site is the starting point. Anyone else using less or more does so at their own discretion and this should not be viewed as a money grab by Auto-RX.

 

[SD26]

I'll chime in with the million dollar question.

2oz in one crankcase is going to be a certain percentage. While 4oz is going to be a similar percentage in another.

Is there a basic formula for the maintenance dose based on crankcase capacity?

 

[Saturn_Fan]

Not sure my fellow Wisconsinite. I will check that out.

 

[bmwtechguy]

It's not an exact science. As my dosage guide (and after reading a lot of ARX threads) I have decided to go with approx. 2 oz per quart for cleaning and .5 oz per quart for maintenace dose. I don't think you will hurt a thing to go over or under those numbers. I tend to use slightly more when in doubt with ARX, which will not hurt a thing.

 

[Reishi]

What is the best way to measure the ARX out of the bottle? I mean, the difference between 3 and 4 ounces are hardly noticeable as it is. How are you guys measuring out exact amounts like that?

 

[Saturn_Fan]

Get the product warm in a hot water bath or next to a heater, etc. then simply take one of those syringes they sell at Wal mart with the ounce and ratio marks and go from there. They are like two bucks and are made for 2 cycle oil ratio measures really.

 

[Rick20]

At this point I don't think that the maintenance dose rate has changed over at the ARX site, which should be considered the gospel. Barkerman is doing an experiment with 4 fluid ounces and perhaps he will show us some benefits to using a bit extra.

On the other hand Louis Gone Fishing is submitting that running a maintenance dose, without prior cleaning doses, seemed to turn around an ailing big block in a motor home. So what gives?

Best advise is to follow the applications over at ARX. Frank monitors all of the applications and puts forth the best applications based on repeatability.

 

[Gary Allan]

Originally Posted By: Saturn_Fan
If I want to skip maintenance dose, I can just add another bottle down the road sometime.


My basic nature is like this too. It's most apparent with me in fuel adds. I have a hard time doing it with the high frequency of fillups. The problem is that I end up doing needed treatments at periodic intervals. Not bad in a quick view, but that means that the condition must get to the point of "needs to be dealt with". In the case of fuel, I really have to manage my personal hassle quotient to work with a perpetual add type cleaner (FP, or the RLI stuff). Since I can't do it reliably, I use Amsoil PI at 5k intervals.

The cost isn't a problem with me. The hassle factor is the killer/maker. Adding 4oz every 6 months (in my case - for most of my vehicles in the extended fleet), is within my hassle envelope of convenience.

I think that the FM properties of the stuff would have some impact here. I'm sure that it will be harder to nail down in proof type results just due to the number of variables involved in getting consistent data.

It would be nice to have an engine on a dyno that's being run for 150 hours straight and add 4oz at the 50 hour mark and monitor emissions and fuel consumption ..but I'm spending my million on Mars real estate futures.

 

[BarkerMan]

There is no confusion from my point of view. I am just testing the idea that Auto-Rx might perform better at a higher dose rate. My PM's with Louie were about using the product on a vehicle he did not own and shows that using Auto-Rx on an almost new engine can show definite benefits. The vehicle he was driving was less than a year old and was suffering from being moved around a tiny sales lot almost every day for six months and never having a chance to warm up. This motorhome did not have a thousand miles on it at the start of the trip. If you don't think that using Auto-Rx is worth the money then you are not seeing the same things that I do. The cost of Auto-Rx is well covered by the benefits of using it. Again if you can't see that then you should definitely not use the product. I don't think that Frank Miller wants you to pay for something that does not work for you. There are plenty of other additives out there for you to try.

 

[02zx9r]

Originally Posted By: Reishi
What is the best way to measure the ARX out of the bottle? I mean, the difference between 3 and 4 ounces are hardly noticeable as it is. How are you guys measuring out exact amounts like that?


well what I did, kinda crude but I had a pasta sauce jar i cleaned out and it has the markings on the side in ounces, i just kind of eye balled it between 2 ounces and 4 ounces and guestimated I was at 3 ounces, then i got a small water bottle, poured it in there and used a sharpie and made a mark so for future doses I just fill it up to the line on the bottle and pour it in.

I use a plastic water bottle and do the same with MMO

 

[BarkerMan]

I think the syringe from the parts store will handle it and there the post from 'Johnny' that gives a link to a great dispensing bottle. Johnny has the best solution, I'm going to order one and thank you Johnny. You see, even someone that worked for an oil company can have good ideas after he has retired.

 

[Rick20]

The million dollar question regarding the best amount of a maintenance dose may not center around sump capacity, but instead the volume of frictional sources within a given motor. For example a single over head cam 4 cylinder motor has far less frictional sources, when compared to a multivalve V-8. Given that ARX is merely carried around the oiling system by the host oil, and works mostly under heat, pressure and oil flow, then it would seem plausible that the ideal maintenance dose will vary based on motor design and size of displacement, eh?

 

[dargo]

Originally Posted By: Rick20
The million dollar question regarding the best amount of a maintenance dose may not center around sump capacity, but instead the volume of frictional sources within a given motor. For example a single over head cam 4 cylinder motor has far less frictional sources, when compared to a multivalve V-8. Given that ARX is merely carried around the oiling system by the host oil, and works mostly under heat, pressure and oil flow, then it would seem plausible that the ideal maintenance dose will vary based on motor design and size of displacement, eh?


So ARX has not figured out a maintenance dose yet in 8-years???? Add in a FOS, MTBF, etc come on people...

I remember Frank saying ARX is not a friction reducer like solvants (gotta love that) but it is a friction mod..Gee, unless you go up in friction you go down (reducer).....

When people state "plausible" etc, they have no idea on what is going on... aka guessing.

 

[SD26]

Originally Posted By: dargo

So ARX has not figured out a maintenance dose yet in 8-years???? Add in a FOS, MTBF, etc come on people...


Actually, they have, and that's 3oz per the website.

But there are people here that are experimenting, beta testers, that are moving forward in trying different ways of using the product.

Similarly, there are different configurations.


I'll add that I just recently purchased the Auto RX product, but I haven't put on any miles as of yet to report anything. But I've been around enough products on the back end to recognize the difference between the folks that are testing and the actual directions, which are stated on the website.

 

[Dyoel182]

Originally Posted By: SD26
Originally Posted By: dargo

So ARX has not figured out a maintenance dose yet in 8-years???? Add in a FOS, MTBF, etc come on people...


Actually, they have, and that's 3oz per the website.


Yes but it used to be 2oz per dose or 3oz for an engine with known sludging problems.

 

[Saturn_Fan]

Good point Gary. I guess it really is not too much of a hassle for me to syringe out the 3 oz from the bottle every OCI. I talked with Frank and he really changed my thinking on this. The maintenance dose is indeed the heart of the program.

Speaking of fuel additives, ever wonder why some of them are in black or dark bottles with no tick marks to measure out the amounts. I can't for the life of me figure out how to add the necessary ounces required for the 12.1 gallons of fuel I put in my Saturn for example. It would look really funny for me to sit there at the gas pump and syringe out the amount per the directions on the bottle.

 

[dbdeland]

Frank has continued over the years to make Auto-Rx a better product in my opinion that only helps the customer with an improved product.

 

[Rick20]

Dargo,

For you stick with the stated maintenance dose. You're killing me. I would like you to create 3 samples of typical sludge in your lab. When you have them prepared, let me know.

For the rest let's see what Barkerman's tests reveal in the near future, with his experiment.

 

[Gary Allan]

Originally Posted By: dargo

I remember Frank saying ARX is not a friction reducer like solvants (gotta love that) but it is a friction mod..Gee, unless you go up in friction you go down (reducer).....

When people state "plausible" etc, they have no idea on what is going on... aka guessing.


Solvents cut oil. Simple enough for most to reason. Fuel does it all the time. I don't believe that Frank would say "friction reducer", if so, I'd surely think that he just mis-posted or didn't qualify his statement. This is surely different than a friction modifier.

I'm also sure that much is exploratory speculation about it too. Nothing wrong with that, imo.

Have you used it?

Out of any product that falls into anything other than oil that you put in a crankcase, this is one that has more than enough confirmed evidence ..from such a broad and diverse group of end users ..that it's NOT PLAUSIBLE for this to be some wishful good old pal conspiracy to shake down unsuspecting new customers.

PEL- EEZ

 

[dargo]

Originally Posted By: Rick20
Dargo,

For you stick with the stated maintenance dose. You're killing me. I would like you to create 3 samples of typical sludge in your lab. When you have them prepared, let me know.

For the rest let's see what Barkerman's tests reveal in the near future, with his experiment.


Again, you tell me what they are..You ARE killing me..Maybe you can up the MD to 4 oz vs 3 oz) and tell people to post...After 8 years you would think............But people are still beta testing...wow...Not on my dime here.