Amsoil thickening and long drains....

Don Stevens · Jul 29, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Bill Morris:
Does it mean Amsoil is an inferior synthetic oiL

Absolutely not.....This is merely an observation that in some applications this particular grade happens to thicken over extended drains. Period.

I have tested the 10W40 in and old 200,000 mile plus BMW to 26,000 miles between oil changes with excellent results. Either hat car was easier on the oil or that particular grade was more viscosity stable, or both. I am sure there are thousands of other success stories.

Going back to my original point... "every application is different"

Keep in mind, we are talking about 7500, 15000, 25000 mile drain intervals here. Most oil compnaies don't even consider suggesting such drain intervals.

Don

Pablo · Jul 29, 2004

Thanks guys for being an intelligent crowd!!

To me it's about improvement of a good thing...I post this type of stuff at considerable risk. Not to hack or slash but to get things out in the open.

We have to be real - I also don't expect any oil company to discuss formulas!!

As much as people hack Amsoil, there are maybe only one or three oil companies that we could have this level of discussion.....so much for the "guerrilla marketing"....

thedawk · Jul 29, 2004

Thanks goes to you Pablo. I am an Amsoil user and I like the stuff just fine. However, I do not like the 25000 and 35000 mile OCI marketing ploy. To me it's just like some of these weight loss infomercials you see on TV. They show a before and after picture of some incredible weight loss subject and say the results happened in six weeks or less with the very small print at the bottom of the screen that says "Results not typical, or, Your results may vary." Those OCI are applicable to such a small percentage of the public that Amsoil should not be using that as a selling tool for the average buyer of their products. I would bet that Amsoil would increase their image if they would advertise a 10000 to 15000 mile OCI instead.

RJCorazza · Jul 29, 2004

Slightly off the thickening out of grade topic...
The 25k & 35k advertisments were a turn-off to me before I switched to Amsoil, and they still are. I am not a marketing professional, but it would seem to me that the average driver is not going to spend $6.00 to $8.00 per quart on any oil. The folks that will spend the money on a top notch product will not (generally) leave it in the crankcase for 25-35k miles (bypass filtration with UOA excepted). I believe the end result is "Joe Average" sees the price and looks elswhere and "Joe Oil" just ignores the claim.

jthorner · Jul 29, 2004

quote:

They stated that modern American V-8s run hot by design, with 8 cylinders there is more blow by than 4 or 6, and the high ambient temp in FL and A/C running year round all contribute to an "extreme" definition.

Pardon me, but that is a bunch of nonsense.

Amsoil has simply avoided the question every time it is asked and tries to put it back on the application/customer.

John

Whimsey · Jul 30, 2004

If memory serves me right(sounds like the guy from Iron Chef

) Terry discussed this a while ago on this board. Maybe he can chime in again or somebody ambitious can do a search. I thought it was something about Amsoil was originally formulated for "dirtier richer" running fuel diluting engines than today's super clean engines. Or maybe it was something about solvents in the gas

.

Whimsey

yannis · Jul 30, 2004

And i think it was TooSlick who mentioned in a old thread that Mercedes's 229.5 extented oil change specification is accompilshed only by thinner mostly 5W30 oils.
Why? because after 30.000kms eventually they will end up 40 or 50 weight oils...

kickster · Jul 30, 2004

What you talking about AMSOIL thickening! My 20W50 turned into a 10W40.
Look at the numbers

Pablo · Jul 30, 2004

Kickster - Pablo wrote:

quote:

I have only seen this with the ASL (PAO 5W-30) and the 0W-30 in selected cars. Certainly not with the HDD 5W-30 or the 15W-40 or S2K 20W-50.

Plus look at the amount of fuel in your oil and the subsequent lowered flashpoint.

MolaKule · Jul 30, 2004

Kikster,

They must really pour Ethyl's MMT in their gas up there; with the fuel dilution, the manganese really shows.

Motorbike · Jul 30, 2004

I'm not certain this will add much to the topic since it's but one analysis but ..

Here is the typical data sheet from 1991 vintage Amsoil 10w-40 along with the UOA of a Nissan engine ran from 8/91 to 8/92 .

It's in grade .

Amsoil 10w-40

MolaKule · Jul 30, 2004

quote:

I must say also - I have only seen this with the ASL (PAO 5W-30) and the 0W-30 in selected cars. Certainly not with the HDD 5W-30 or the 15W-40 or S2K 20W-50.

Buster - I can't say if this is an old formula vs. new formula thing, because it seems to depend more on the engine and service conditions than anything.

ALSO - for the newbies reading this - we are talking about a slight thickening into a 40 wt oil, not some gone gonzo sludgefest.

Buster is correct, we're talking about a thickening affect over time, not some sudden sludge problem.

I do think Amsoil has avoided a direct question so far regarding thickening.

And I do use ASL in my M-I-L's Oldsmobile with Amsoil SDF23 filters, and have not noticed this thickening affect and we only change her oil once a year.

What I was really trying to say in my original post was (and didn't communicate it very well): "I wonder if they had a bad batch of poor base oil or addpack or both." However, I don't think their QC group would allow this, so this may be some kind of anomaly?

[ July 30, 2004, 12:46 PM: Message edited by: MolaKule ]

Patman · Jul 30, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by MolaKule:
Kikster,

They must really pour Ethyl's MMT in their gas up there; with the fuel dilution, the manganese really shows.

Yep, all of my UOAs show high manganese thanks to Canadian gas. When I get my Corvette next week I'm going to run nothing but Sunoco gas in it for the first oil change interval, just to see if they truly are telling the truth about having no MMT in their fuels.

Patman · Jul 30, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Whimsey:

quote:

Originally posted by Patman:
When I get my Corvette next week

Click to expand...

Wow when did this happen! Now this is a "full size" corvette, not one of those 1:38 scale diecast ones, like my Jaguar S-Type and my Ford Super Duty F-250

. Of course you'll post pics of your "new baby"

.

Whimsey

Definitely a full size Corvette!

Just like this one below:

A used car dealer here in Ontario bought it from a Florida auction and it's currently sitting in Buffalo NY. It's been there for a few weeks now, the dealer is still waiting for the auction house to send him the title, then it gets clearance from customs and he can bring it across. It's taking a lot longer than he figured it would, but the last time I spoke with him he expected I would be able to get the car by next weekend. Hopefully it comes true, I've been searching for a C5 for over six weeks with no luck, this is the first one in my price range that isn't a six speed. (I must have automatic)

The car is a black on black 97 coupe, with only 71,000 miles on it. So it's fresh enough to still have lots of life left, but broken in enough so that it shouldn't show high copper on it's first UOA.

buster · Jul 31, 2004

Patman, good luck! Hey, I'd run Auto-Rx and then change over to GC. Is that your plan? You could run Castrol GTX in it with the Auto-RX, do a UOA and then put in the great green liquid.

Pablo · Jul 31, 2004

Wow! Nice car!! Mind me asking how much $?

pscholte · Jul 31, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Patman:

quote:

Originally posted by MolaKule:
Kikster,

They must really pour Ethyl's MMT in their gas up there; with the fuel dilution, the manganese really shows.

Click to expand...

Yep, all of my UOAs show high manganese thanks to Canadian gas. When I get my Corvette next week I'm going to run nothing but Sunoco gas in it for the first oil change interval, just to see if they truly are telling the truth about having no MMT in their fuels.

Pat,

We'll really believe you got the new Vette only if your posting frequency takes a dive!!

Patman · Jul 31, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by buster:
Patman, good luck! Hey, I'd run Auto-Rx and then change over to GC. Is that your plan? You could run Castrol GTX in it with the Auto-RX, do a UOA and then put in the great green liquid.

99.9% of C5s out there run nothing but synthetic, so I don't think it needs Auto RX just yet anyhow. Besides, I really want to see a 5k run with GC in an LS1, and by the time I get this car I've got just enough time to run a 5k interval before the weather gets cold out.

Patman · Jul 31, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Pablo:

Wow! Nice car!! Mind me asking how much $?

It is going to be $27,000 Canadian. Thanks to a friend of mine who has the secret password to get onto the Manheim auction website, I know that it sold at the Florida auction for exactly $15,500 US. So if it sold down there it would've sold for around $17 or $18k US most likely. The price I'm paying is very fair though, it's actually about $3k less than a similar 97 with this kind of mileage. It is a lot of hassle to bring a car across the border though, and the dealer has been out all this money for a while before he gets paid. So if he makes $2-3000 on the deal I'm comfortable with that, especially since I'm getting a good deal too. By him buying from the US, both of us win, at least in terms of the cost, but certainly not in terms of this long waiting game! If I don't get the car before next weekend I swear I'm going to explode.

Nobody on planet earth wants a C5 Corvette as badly as me.

pscholte · Jul 31, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Patman:
If I don't get the car before next weekend I swear I'm going to explode.

Quick, Pat! Drink some of the Green Elixer of Tension and Friction Reduction...no matter how much your internals heat up, you won't explode...you've got to trust me on this one.

Amsoil thickening and long drains....

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