took the ranger in to my local ford dealer yesterday afternoon to have the srs light on the dash looked at, and hopefully, repaired. while i was waiting in the lounge area drinking their coffee, i struck up a conversation with a nice looking lady that had brought her mercury mountaineer in. at this point the service adviser advised me my little truck needed a sensor replaced at a cost of $245 parts and labor. i told him to fix it already. thought i was getting hosed, but it's a safety related issue and i have little to no experience working on srs systems. a few minutes later the same adviser comes in and tells my new found friend that it was going to cost $465 to have the alternator replaced on her mercury! i thought holy smokes, they're taking her to the cleaner's. he then went on to advise her that the cause of her check engine light was due to bad O2 sensor's, caused by a clogged catalytic converter. he told her (get this) $3000 to replace the converter! she was almost in tears. i felt bad for her so i gave her my phone number and told her to go to NAPA and get an alternator and i would install it for her. do catalytic converter's really cost THAT much? i know what i would do if it were mine.
a visit to my local ford dealer
- Thread starter HM12460
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I have seen cats on NAPA and AAP websites for around or less than $200 I don't know how dealers can charge $3000+
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I bought a pair of Magnaflow cats for my Lincoln for less than 250 bucks IIRC.
Originally Posted By: HM12460
he told her (get this) $3000 to replace the converter! she was almost in tears.
do catalytic converter's really cost THAT much? i know what i would do if it were mine.
I don't know what year she has, but here are some discount Ford cat prices for a Mercury Mountaineer.
http://www.silverstatefordparts.com/partlocator/index.cfm?action=getJointLocator&siteid=214290&chapter=§ionids=7,2489&groupid=60222&make=23&model=Mountaineer&year=2000&catalogid=1&displayCatalogid=0
It case the link doesn't work, it's $425-$1300 EACH (there is a left and a right) for a 2000 Mountaineer using genuine Ford parts.
he told her (get this) $3000 to replace the converter! she was almost in tears.
do catalytic converter's really cost THAT much? i know what i would do if it were mine.
I don't know what year she has, but here are some discount Ford cat prices for a Mercury Mountaineer.
http://www.silverstatefordparts.com/partlocator/index.cfm?action=getJointLocator&siteid=214290&chapter=§ionids=7,2489&groupid=60222&make=23&model=Mountaineer&year=2000&catalogid=1&displayCatalogid=0
It case the link doesn't work, it's $425-$1300 EACH (there is a left and a right) for a 2000 Mountaineer using genuine Ford parts.
Wow. I know service writers are crooks, and are there to make commission, but personally this guy was taking her to the cleaners because he could, AND was probably also she was a woman.
you're in Michigan, so you don't have to worry about a California certified cat.
bad o2 sensors can ruin a cat, but I've never heard of it getting plugged up, but it is a possibility I suppose.
installation of a cat on a mountaineer is pretty easy, they bolt in and bolt out.
the $3000 was probably $2000 to much. the O2 sensor even a motorcraft is only $90 if that.
Time to goto a regular honest shop.
you're in Michigan, so you don't have to worry about a California certified cat.
bad o2 sensors can ruin a cat, but I've never heard of it getting plugged up, but it is a possibility I suppose.
installation of a cat on a mountaineer is pretty easy, they bolt in and bolt out.
the $3000 was probably $2000 to much. the O2 sensor even a motorcraft is only $90 if that.
Time to goto a regular honest shop.
Around the first of the year in California at least, they pulled many universal cats. Many CA application aftermarket cat applications seem slow coming to market...so dealer cats at least for some are the only way to go.
Not sure about other states or what it is like now but just a few months ago the local muffler shop said he could not get aftermarket cats for my friends F-150. The dealer wanted over $2000.
Not sure about other states or what it is like now but just a few months ago the local muffler shop said he could not get aftermarket cats for my friends F-150. The dealer wanted over $2000.
Well on many OEm today the cat's are welded into the whole exhaust system many of them do not sell a cat by itself. In the good old days all Toyota hads Cat's that had 4 bolts holding them to the exhast if it went bad you removed the 4 bolts and bolted another one up! To reduce production cost's and stick the end user with higher exhast replacement cost out of waranty they made everything one piece all welded together. THis is why almost no one goes to the OEM for exhaust anymore unless they have more money then brains. You can buy the parts and either bolt it in place useing clamps or weld it in place. If I ever have a cat go bad I am just cutting them and putting in pipe! I will keep the OS sensors and if need be move them around to get the temp just right but I will not pay an arm and a leg for something that should never have been made as one intergral part of the exhaust. My Camry has two pup cat's welded into the exhast manifold it self. Stupid beyound belief because I assure the slight reduce in emissions they get is not going to save the earth!
Also I am sure this gal has not been running the exotic highly additive-ized oil I run in my vechile so how is that her cat's are pluged did they explain how their OEM oil change interval with SM oils that are supposed to be kinder to cat's managed to kill them? I find it amazing that I run insanely high additive level oils like Redline and M1 15W50, HEAVY Duty Diesel Engine Oil and in the last few years I have taken to adding more additives to my oils as I put them in my car even! Yet since 1979 no one in my emediate family has ever had a cat fail! It is always the oil burners runing any oil because the oil is going through the cat's and the oil has additives attached to it or in solution stop the oil consumption stop the cat's from going bad not weak the oil to make cat's last longer!!!! Stupid beyound belief it is like watching the three stoges after a while you just can not take any more of it!
The dealers are my biggest issue with Ford. I know, all makes have [censored] dealers but every Ford dealer I have been to just seems really cheesy. I was at a Ford dealer with a friend of mine recently (had to get a part) so I walked around the showroom. They had a Focus with a sticker of $20k and used Fusion 4 cyl for $21k. I know these are not the prices you would pay after negotiations but it really turned me off.
Last year I was seriuosly looking at the Edge. I liked the Edge and was speaking with the Sales guy. The Manager came over and it was like a scene from a bad movie with every canned line and hard sell approach you could think of. I smiled, and told the salesman I felt sorry for him as I walked out.
I like the new Ford cars, it just seems that the dealer network is out to screw you (more so then others, or at least more obvious) and the buyer support is severly lacking (this is a different story). Just my personal experience.
Last year I was seriuosly looking at the Edge. I liked the Edge and was speaking with the Sales guy. The Manager came over and it was like a scene from a bad movie with every canned line and hard sell approach you could think of. I smiled, and told the salesman I felt sorry for him as I walked out.
I like the new Ford cars, it just seems that the dealer network is out to screw you (more so then others, or at least more obvious) and the buyer support is severly lacking (this is a different story). Just my personal experience.
Originally Posted By: Vikas
You do know that CATs are mandated by Federal EPA for 8/80K coverage? How old is her Mountaineer?
Also unless pushed for, dealer will NEVER volunteer this information.
- Vikas
Actually to my surprise the Ford dealer down here brought it to my dads attention when he brought in his 05 Ford for making knocking sounds recently...They happily replaced the C.C...They also mentioned if it was off the warrenty it would be 300 bucks plus labor.
You do know that CATs are mandated by Federal EPA for 8/80K coverage? How old is her Mountaineer?
Also unless pushed for, dealer will NEVER volunteer this information.
- Vikas
Actually to my surprise the Ford dealer down here brought it to my dads attention when he brought in his 05 Ford for making knocking sounds recently...They happily replaced the C.C...They also mentioned if it was off the warrenty it would be 300 bucks plus labor.
Originally Posted By: Vikas
You do know that CATs are mandated by Federal EPA for 8/80K coverage? How old is her Mountaineer?
Also unless pushed for, dealer will NEVER volunteer this information.
- Vikas
Double billing? Hmmmm.... Also on the newer stuff it can be 100 or 120k.
Also if she wasn't complaining of lack of power, the cats were more likely inefficient, not plugged. I don't think MI has inspections, so she's under no duress to get that light off.
Pretty stupid "sales pitch" from the dealer, they should have fixed her alternator reasonably and let her go happy (and in the opinion they're "experts") then called her in a month to try and sell cats. Sometimes people snap and say forget it, I'm not putting any money in this thing...
You do know that CATs are mandated by Federal EPA for 8/80K coverage? How old is her Mountaineer?
Also unless pushed for, dealer will NEVER volunteer this information.
- Vikas
Double billing? Hmmmm.... Also on the newer stuff it can be 100 or 120k.
Also if she wasn't complaining of lack of power, the cats were more likely inefficient, not plugged. I don't think MI has inspections, so she's under no duress to get that light off.
Pretty stupid "sales pitch" from the dealer, they should have fixed her alternator reasonably and let her go happy (and in the opinion they're "experts") then called her in a month to try and sell cats. Sometimes people snap and say forget it, I'm not putting any money in this thing...
Originally Posted By: HM12460
...i was waiting in the lounge area .... i struck up a conversation with a nice looking lady ....so i gave her my phone number...
Everyone see that? That is how you become the mac daddy of Michigan Ford drivers. Just hang out at the dealer, "yeah, I'm gettin my sensor checked...", meet the nice women and make it happen.
Well done, my Ranger-driving friend!
...i was waiting in the lounge area .... i struck up a conversation with a nice looking lady ....so i gave her my phone number...
Everyone see that? That is how you become the mac daddy of Michigan Ford drivers. Just hang out at the dealer, "yeah, I'm gettin my sensor checked...", meet the nice women and make it happen.
Well done, my Ranger-driving friend!
Next thing you know he'll be showing her his dipstick and checking her oil!
You know we all like to eat but too many sectors of business or industry are just simply getting out of hand. The prices for parts at Dealerships are just one such industry. The difference between OEM and After Market are insane. Often the after market part is built or rebuilt by the same company that builds or rebuilds the OEM part. Usualy the Aftermarket part is better warantied and often built to a higher standard. A new tensioner for my wifes Buick 3.8 that was new not a reman was built in Canada by the same company that builds them for GM. It is exactly the same in every way. It cost about 1/3 as much from AutoZone and had a better a warranty then the dealership!THe OEM's try to make too much money on their parts side and they could be makeing a lot more because they drive alot of people into AutoZone with their high prices!
MI does not have inspection we are Federal not California emissions so no vechile inspection at all not to register not at purchase nothing! Catalytic Converters are not often replaced in this state not a lot of Tree Hugger's in this State!
MI does not have inspection we are Federal not California emissions so no vechile inspection at all not to register not at purchase nothing! Catalytic Converters are not often replaced in this state not a lot of Tree Hugger's in this State!
I can almost guarantee the $3000 cats cost the dealer ~$2700. Dealer matrixes cut the margins signifigantly on big ticket items.
Ford reams dealers on actual Ford (not Motorcraft) items. You can often find OEM manufacturer's parts for a fraction of what a dealer would pay for the same thing. I can remember steering racks from TRW. Dealer cost from FoMoCo was 3 times what a jobber charged for the exact same new in the box rack, minus a Ford part number.
Ford reams dealers on actual Ford (not Motorcraft) items. You can often find OEM manufacturer's parts for a fraction of what a dealer would pay for the same thing. I can remember steering racks from TRW. Dealer cost from FoMoCo was 3 times what a jobber charged for the exact same new in the box rack, minus a Ford part number.
Originally Posted By: punisher
I can almost guarantee the $3000 cats cost the dealer ~$2700. Dealer matrixes cut the margins signifigantly on big ticket items.
Ford reams dealers on actual Ford (not Motorcraft) items. You can often find OEM manufacturer's parts for a fraction of what a dealer would pay for the same thing. I can remember steering racks from TRW. Dealer cost from FoMoCo was 3 times what a jobber charged for the exact same new in the box rack, minus a Ford part number.
truer words have not been spoken... very small margins on the big ticket items. a lot of the motorcraft parts sold at walmart are below dealer cost.
also any Ford service writer worth their weight in feathers would have run parts coverage in OASIS and then checked the SLTS. literally takes a couple minutes, i do the parts coverage for customers on parts side and have saved customers thousands of dollars by taking that extra step.
I can almost guarantee the $3000 cats cost the dealer ~$2700. Dealer matrixes cut the margins signifigantly on big ticket items.
Ford reams dealers on actual Ford (not Motorcraft) items. You can often find OEM manufacturer's parts for a fraction of what a dealer would pay for the same thing. I can remember steering racks from TRW. Dealer cost from FoMoCo was 3 times what a jobber charged for the exact same new in the box rack, minus a Ford part number.
truer words have not been spoken... very small margins on the big ticket items. a lot of the motorcraft parts sold at walmart are below dealer cost.
also any Ford service writer worth their weight in feathers would have run parts coverage in OASIS and then checked the SLTS. literally takes a couple minutes, i do the parts coverage for customers on parts side and have saved customers thousands of dollars by taking that extra step.
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