95 Civic - Light Pinging

[JZiggy]

Hey everyone,

My 95 Civic (D15B7) has always run really nice since I got it about 15k miles ago (now has almost 215k). Recently it started pinging occasionally. It's a bit difficult to describe it and when it happens, but I will try...

- The pinging is always very light and rattly, not heavy detonation or the sort of noise when you load the engine accidentally at super low rpms, like trying to start in 2nd gear.
- It never pings when at cruising speed, ~3000rpm, even up hills.
- It tends to ping between 1500-2500rpm at medium throttle position. It's strange, if I push the gas down further the pinging stops. If I let up a little it also stops.

The valves are adjusted, timing is within spec, fuel filter recently replaced, spark plugs are OEM-spec and in good condition. Spark plug wires, cap, and rotor were replaced recently. Fuel injector cleaner (Techron) has been used a couple times.

Nothing different happened to precipitate the problem. The pinging did not start immediately after a part was replaced or anything like that.

My initial thoughts:
- Try higher quality gas (Shell rather than Kroger)
- Try higher octane has (though it is spec'ed at 86)
- Try colder spark plugs
- Check throttle angle sensor
- Send out fuel injectors for cleaning ($$)


I would appreciate advice, especially if any of the Honda peeps can chime in!

 

[Trav]

Quote:
Try higher octane

This..

 

[aquariuscsm]

My car will ping when I really put my foot into it between shifts. I use premium unleaded. I wonder if it`s just the fact that today`s gasoline is junk,or maybe the ethanol has something to do with it?

 

[MyTQuick]

I had a similar issue on a 98 Civic. Mine would ping mid-throttle and up though. The higher octane fuel would help the issue too. I eventually replaced the pre-catalytic convertor oxygen sensor to correct the issue.

 

[aquariuscsm]

Originally Posted By: JZiggy
(Shell rather than Kroger)


Kroger was the worst gas in my car.

 

[Eddie]

Seems like all the normal checks have been done. Next step would switch fuel brands but, stay with lower octane. If changing brands doesn't work, then checking the O2 sensors. I have read that they do get "lazy" ans also get off the factory default values. Ed

 

[MyTQuick]

Originally Posted By: Eddie
Seems like all the normal checks have been done. Next step would switch fuel brands but, stay with lower octane. If changing brands doesn't work, then checking the O2 sensors. I have read that they do get "lazy" ans also get off the factory default values. Ed


That's what I found on my O2 sensor. The pre-cat sensor was 'lazy' when switching values. That's why it got replaced.

 

[JZiggy]

Forgot to mention that the O2 sensor was replaced recently too, factory Denso part.

I'll start with running better brand gas and see what happens...

 

[charbaby]

JZiggy,
What ever you do try, do it and let it rest awhile. As trying too many thing at once may not tell you what actually has helped, if at all!

Are you sure that there isn't some rattling(heat shield somewhere else?) I've had this happen in the past. Did the "Pinging" start after you had work done?(valve adjustmemt) or were the valves adjusted prior to your purchace? Just throwing things out there!

Wondering if the previous owner was using HIGH Octane or thicker oil to help mask the pinging, prior to you taking ownership. Also, was the timing advance 2 deg's over spec? Their timing spec usually allows 2 deg's on either side. For example...15 deg's, +/- , 2 deg's.(13-17). Maybe tweek it backward a bit? I have done this too!

When you said that you tried TECHRON, was this the TECHRON Fuel System Cleaner or, the Fuel Injector/Intake Valve Cleaner w/Techron in it???...The "TECHRON Fuel System Cleaner" is what you want! Or try another brand such as others recomended here at BITOG such as REGANE or RedLine(I can't remember RedLine's actual name)I think SL-1???

Also, after trying one thing and waiting, try another such as different brand of gas(several tankfulls). If the different brand of gas doesn't help, only then try the higher octane.

Another thing is...How is your MPG and performance combonation??? I mean, does the Civic seem to run fine??? If the MPG/Perf are both OK, then I wouldn't send out your injectors for cleaning because the way you describe things, all seem fine except for some light pinging. I mean, there is 215K on the engine! This doesn't meant the HONDA is all used up, it just mean it's older now!

As engines age, there becomes lots of carbon deposits on the piston tops and that could be cause for some detonation. Maybe somemore fuel system cleaning is in order!

 

[Billbert]

Also, make sure the EGR valve & passages are clear of carbon

 

[JZiggy]

Hey Char Baby, thanks for your thoughts. I completely agree with your scientific approach to try to isolate the variables.

This is definitely pinging and not a rattle... when I hear it, if I change throttle position a little bit it immediately goes away.

Yes, Techron fuel system cleaner -- I did my BITOG homework before getting it... even got it BOGO!

No telling about the PO. It was a college-age girl who knew nothing about it. The car had been well-maintained by her extended family and then became the college car. The sucker didn't even start when I bought it (bag ignition coil).

I will also double-check the timing, and maybe retard it a point or two to see if that helps (AFTER trying a tankful of Shell gas!!)

Car has plenty of pickup, as much as 1.5L will allow. Feels like it has good compression, runs very smoothly. Worst mpg is 33 driving hard in the city, best is 43 driving 60mph on the highway. I usually clock in around 37-39 mpg.

I also did a Kreen piston soak and 1k Kreen run a few thousand miles ago...

 

[JZiggy]

No EGR on this little beast

 

[charbaby]

Well done!
Sounds like the engine is running quite well 'cept for the pinging. And after trying several things that myself and others have mentoined, should the pinging remain, it is what it is!

I've had little nagging issues with cars that I could never find/fix and I ended up beating my brains in trying, while the car still ran forever. Don't do this as the Civic will probably run longer than you'll keep'er!

I have a friend with a GM 3.8L V6 that has a cold stratup knocking sound, and this Buick engine will probably run forever this way. It's one of those things!

 

[mechtech2]

EGR system is #1 on my list.
Forget colder plugs!
Maybe carbon build up. A couple of tanks of Chevron Techron or Gumout Regane will make this much better, if it is the cause.
[Great maintenance, in any event.]
Running a bit warmer ? A hot engine will ping more.

Pinging like you mention is not unusual. It fits perfectly with a faulty EGR system. At full throttle, timing is backed off, so there is less knock.

 

[Rand]

does a 95 civic even have EGR?

 

[JZiggy]

No it does not.

 

[lexus114]

carbon build up??

 

[Mau]

Ya use top tier fuel (Shell would be good) stick with 87 octane, use Techron or Redline fuel system cleaners and drive it hard. Do a couple WOT runs (take her to fuel cut off!)

See how it goes...

 

[Vikas]

Most owner's manual state that slight pinging under load is normal. If you can get your hand on a scanner such as UltraGauge or ScanGauge, you can watch the timing advance and correlate it with the pinging.

 

[ltslimjim]

Any updates on the pinging?