9000k service intervals. Should I change filter have way thru?

Originally Posted by UncleDave
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by UncleDave
Originally Posted by andreigbs
You know what they say about opinions....

My advice: follow your owner's manual on oil change interval, replacing both oil AND filter.

End of story, sleep better at night.


Too be clear - if your owners manual says NOT to replace the filter every OCI you'd sleep just as well?

UD

He would. He would change it every OCI just bcs. that is being good owner.
Honda did it bcs. average fan of an appliance vehicles literally will have an orgasm over that.



You speak for him?

So you think Honda got it wrong?

UD

No, I am assuming he would do that.
No, I am not sure they got it wrong or right.
 
Originally Posted by UncleDave
Originally Posted by edyvw

Where did I say I do not trust it? Do not twist my words. I said I would change filter bcs. it is cheap and I am already changing oil.
I do not fallow OCI anyway, I change oil on BMW and VW every 5k instead of 10k. I do fallow Toyota OCI interval.
You are my friend fishing here for confirmation bias. You want someone to agree with you so you can sleep better at night.
Then do it. Change it every second OCI. Actually, change it every third OCI, just bcs. I am not sure anyone here will not sleep at night bcs. you cannot make a decision about your vehicle on your own.


I asked you - if toyota said to change the filter every other OCI would you - and you said no. Everyone here can read what you wrote.

I dont care what you do or dont do, who you do or dont agree with Im not sensitive about it - just curious as to why.

So you do what Toyota says but not BMW or VW. Why? UOA's? because dad did? because you think they dont care about your engine?

No right or wrong answer - just your reasoning.

Occasionally I hear something new or compelling - but I haven't heard any compelling reasons why the manufacturers have it wrong in this thread.

UD










Why I change oil often? Bcs. I mental rest doing work on a cars.
Why not on Toyota? Bcs. it is as attractive as my GE fridge in a kitchen.
 
My parent's 1993 Caravan with the 3.0L Mitsubishi V6 recommended changing the oil filter at every other change. However, my dad changed the filter each time because it's inexpensive.

Plus... if the OP can afford the cost to buy an S5, then oil filters with every oil change is chump change to him. If changing the oil filter is too expensive for him, he should of bought something less expensive to be able to afford oil filters, or make some lifestyle sacrifaces.

Back to so-called rating of oil filter life.

Fram Extended Guard (XG, Gold can) was rated for 10,000 mile changes with full synthetic oil
Then was renamed Ultra Synthetic (XG, Gold can), which increased to 15,000 mile changes
Now, currently rated for 20,000 mile changes.

How did Fram come up with the filter life change? Is there a standardized test that is recognized by SAE, ANSI, ASTM, and/or ISO? Or did they arbitrarily increased it for marketing reasons, including to steal sales from Mobil 1 Extended Performance filters when used with Mobil 1 Annual Protection oil?
 
Absolutely, because the engineers who designed the car are much smarter than me. If they have designed the filter to last twice as long as the oil and mandate changing it every other OC, that's what I'd do. Being pragmatic, moderate and using good judgement goes a long way.

I'd draw the line at "lifetime fluids" since despite all such claims, I've yet to see it in real world examples. Over time and usage even the best lubes will deteriorate.

The other thing to remember is that every time you open the hood and start replacing parts it's possible to fubar something, even easy things. Plastic and metal parts like spin-on filter screws or oil filter housing covers also degrade a bit every time you tighten/loosen. You potentially run the risk of over-fatigue on parts that could break prematurely. Why chance it? Stick to the recommended schedule; ze Germans know vat zey are doing
wink.gif
 
Why are we talking about Hondas? OP has an Audi.

Speaking of which, the OCI on these cars in central Europe is quite literally double what it is in the states. 30,000km or two years, but it does go by OLM so if you drive only in the city or whatever it will be faster, but still much longer than the regular OCI in North America. The cars in Europe are not exactly failing everywhere, they use good oil, good filters and usually have 6-9 litre oil capacity.

If the car is tuned I can see making a case for shorter OCI but otherwise, it is a waste of money, time and resources.
 
Originally Posted by Jimmy_Russells
Why are we talking about Hondas? OP has an Audi.

Speaking of which, the OCI on these cars in central Europe is quite literally double what it is in the states. 30,000km or two years, but it does go by OLM so if you drive only in the city or whatever it will be faster, but still much longer than the regular OCI in North America. The cars in Europe are not exactly failing everywhere, they use good oil, good filters and usually have 6-9 litre oil capacity.

If the car is tuned I can see making a case for shorter OCI but otherwise, it is a waste of money, time and resources.

The reason for different OCI is better quality of gas and different burn.
Also, not all countries have flexible OCI. All European manufacturers in Europe base OCI on specifics of that market.
 
Originally Posted by andreigbs
Absolutely, because the engineers who designed the car are much smarter than me. If they have designed the filter to last twice as long as the oil and mandate changing it every other OC, that's what I'd do. Being pragmatic, moderate and using good judgement goes a long way.

I'd draw the line at "lifetime fluids" since despite all such claims, I've yet to see it in real world examples. Over time and usage even the best lubes will deteriorate.

The other thing to remember is that every time you open the hood and start replacing parts it's possible to fubar something, even easy things. Plastic and metal parts like spin-on filter screws or oil filter housing covers also degrade a bit every time you tighten/loosen. You potentially run the risk of over-fatigue on parts that could break prematurely. Why chance it? Stick to the recommended schedule; ze Germans know vat zey are doing
wink.gif


I am not sure they mandate, they recommend.
 
Originally Posted by edyvw
I am not sure they mandate, they recommend.


One could argue if the warranty coverage depends on documented maintenance at specified intervals, using the approved parts, that pretty much is a mandate.
 
Originally Posted by andreigbs
Originally Posted by edyvw
I am not sure they mandate, they recommend.


One could argue if the warranty coverage depends on documented maintenance at specified intervals, using the approved parts, that pretty much is a mandate.

No, warranty does not depend on documented maintenance. We have been through this: Magnusson-Moss Act.
Also, what they will do? Decline warranty bcs. you changed filter with every OCI? Lawyers are going to line up to represent you.
 
Originally Posted by Jimmy_Russells
Why are we talking about Hondas? OP has an Audi.

Speaking of which, the OCI on these cars in central Europe is quite literally double what it is in the states. 30,000km or two years, but it does go by OLM so if you drive only in the city or whatever it will be faster, but still much longer than the regular OCI in North America. The cars in Europe are not exactly failing everywhere, they use good oil, good filters and usually have 6-9 litre oil capacity.

If the car is tuned I can see making a case for shorter OCI but otherwise, it is a waste of money, time and resources.


Because the thread morphs into what people do, why they do it, and what different manufacturers recommend.
 
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by andreigbs
Originally Posted by edyvw
I am not sure they mandate, they recommend.


One could argue if the warranty coverage depends on documented maintenance at specified intervals, using the approved parts, that pretty much is a mandate.

No, warranty does not depend on documented maintenance. We have been through this: Magnusson-Moss Act.
Also, what they will do? Decline warranty bcs. you changed filter with every OCI? Lawyers are going to line up to represent you.


Warranty coverage does depend on documented maintenance at specific intervals.

If you decide to skip an oil change, or show no paperwork demonstrating you had a specific maintenance interval conducted, it builds the case against a warranty repair coverage

Using manufacturer stamped parts, that's Magnuson-Moss Act.
 
Originally Posted by UG_Passat
My parent's 1993 Caravan with the 3.0L Mitsubishi V6 recommended changing the oil filter at every other change. However, my dad changed the filter each time because it's inexpensive.

Plus... if the OP can afford the cost to buy an S5, then oil filters with every oil change is chump change to him. If changing the oil filter is too expensive for him, he should of bought something less expensive to be able to afford oil filters, or make some lifestyle sacrifaces.

Back to so-called rating of oil filter life.

Fram Extended Guard (XG, Gold can) was rated for 10,000 mile changes with full synthetic oil
Then was renamed Ultra Synthetic (XG, Gold can), which increased to 15,000 mile changes
Now, currently rated for 20,000 mile changes.

How did Fram come up with the filter life change? Is there a standardized test that is recognized by SAE, ANSI, ASTM, and/or ISO? Or did they arbitrarily increased it for marketing reasons, including to steal sales from Mobil 1 Extended Performance filters when used with Mobil 1 Annual Protection oil?


I cant speak specifically for any of them but here is what I would surmise.....

Although there may be a specific capacity test one would learn a filters capacity as a normal course of running a 4548-12 test.
You keep injecting a controlled and measured amount of contaminant into the stream, count what gets through until the bypass opens.

Add to this that modern autos put out very little contamination in terms of grams per M/KM most likely a determinable amount based on CARB EPA.
This amount has been dropping as standards tighten- so the filters job becomes easier in this regard.

Add to that testing the various manufacturing techniques that confirm the likelyhood an intact filter at the end of a 5,7500, 10, 15, 20K miles.

When I look at how filters that claim high miles are constructed I typically see a common set of features (backed media, metal end caps, synthetic or blended media, silicon ADBV, bypasses vary)

Honda flies against this allowing/promoting a lower featured filter to stay in service for up to 20K miles.
One almost never hears about OEM honda failures bringing rise to doubt weather such construction techniques are truly needed or overkill.

Love to learn more how these determinations are made.


UD
 
Last edited:
Thank you.
Originally Posted by UG_Passat
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by andreigbs
Originally Posted by edyvw
I am not sure they mandate, they recommend.


One could argue if the warranty coverage depends on documented maintenance at specified intervals, using the approved parts, that pretty much is a mandate.

No, warranty does not depend on documented maintenance. We have been through this: Magnusson-Moss Act.
Also, what they will do? Decline warranty bcs. you changed filter with every OCI? Lawyers are going to line up to represent you.


Warranty coverage does depend on documented maintenance at specific intervals.

If you decide to skip an oil change, or show no paperwork demonstrating you had a specific maintenance interval conducted, it builds the case against a warranty repair coverage

Using manufacturer stamped parts, that's Magnuson-Moss Act.


Thank you.
 
Originally Posted by UG_Passat
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by andreigbs
Originally Posted by edyvw
I am not sure they mandate, they recommend.


One could argue if the warranty coverage depends on documented maintenance at specified intervals, using the approved parts, that pretty much is a mandate.

No, warranty does not depend on documented maintenance. We have been through this: Magnusson-Moss Act.
Also, what they will do? Decline warranty bcs. you changed filter with every OCI? Lawyers are going to line up to represent you.


Warranty coverage does depend on documented maintenance at specific intervals.

If you decide to skip an oil change, or show no paperwork demonstrating you had a specific maintenance interval conducted, it builds the case against a warranty repair coverage

Using manufacturer stamped parts, that's Magnuson-Moss Act.

Yes, you cannot skip oil interval, but you do not have to conduct that OCI at dealership. You can do it yourself in your garage, keeping receipt. I thought that would be understandable.
No, you do not have to go buy oil in VW dealership to conduct oil change. You can get it in Wal Mart, as long as oil is approved for use, let's say VW 502.00 in that engine.
 
Originally Posted by UncleDave
Originally Posted by UG_Passat
My parent's 1993 Caravan with the 3.0L Mitsubishi V6 recommended changing the oil filter at every other change. However, my dad changed the filter each time because it's inexpensive.

Plus... if the OP can afford the cost to buy an S5, then oil filters with every oil change is chump change to him. If changing the oil filter is too expensive for him, he should of bought something less expensive to be able to afford oil filters, or make some lifestyle sacrifaces.

Back to so-called rating of oil filter life.

Fram Extended Guard (XG, Gold can) was rated for 10,000 mile changes with full synthetic oil
Then was renamed Ultra Synthetic (XG, Gold can), which increased to 15,000 mile changes
Now, currently rated for 20,000 mile changes.

How did Fram come up with the filter life change? Is there a standardized test that is recognized by SAE, ANSI, ASTM, and/or ISO? Or did they arbitrarily increased it for marketing reasons, including to steal sales from Mobil 1 Extended Performance filters when used with Mobil 1 Annual Protection oil?


I cant speak specifically for any of them but here is what I would surmise.....

Although there may be a specific capacity test one would learn a filters capacity as a normal course of running a 4548-12 test.
You keep injecting a controlled and measured amount of contaminant into the stream, count what gets through until the bypass opens.

Add to this that modern autos put out very little contamination in terms of grams per M/KM most likely a determinable amount based on CARB EPA.
This amount has been dropping as standards tighten- so the filters job becomes easier in this regard.

Add to that testing the various manufacturing techniques that confirm the likelyhood an intact filter at the end of a 5,7500, 10, 15, 20K miles.

When I look at how filters that claim high miles are constructed I typically see a common set of features (backed media, metal end caps, synthetic or blended media, silicon ADBV, bypasses vary)

Honda flies against this allowing/promoting a lower featured filter to stay in service for up to 20K miles.
One almost never hears about OEM honda failures bringing rise to doubt weather such construction techniques are truly needed or overkill.

Love to learn more how these determinations are made.


UD






Like?
 
Originally Posted by edyvw

Like?


Like when I see 3rd party filter cut opens I don't see failed Honda branded OEM filters often.

Hondas AO 1-3 series is a pretty marginally built compared to what manufacturers proffer as a 20K filter and sold by the millions, and I rarely see or hear failures and because Honda uses an A/B filter change scheduler's they stay on the car a long time. The AO-1 (If i recall) is oem'd by Fram and is between an xtra guard and a tough guard and not identical to either.

UD
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by BucDan
We're still talking, but OP is gone.


Hopefully he stopped worrying about it and finally had a good night's sleep
wink.gif
 
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