2025 Ram 1500 Ramcharger PHEV

[demarpaint]

Is DEF used in other countries? I didn't know if that was a US development. Seems they've slowly made diesel less compelling by design.

I don't know. With the castration of the diesel engine I can see why they went with the gas engine. Although prior to castration the diesel would have been a great choice. From what I read the 3.6L was the logical choice, and it makes sense since they invested a lot of money into a mfg facility for the 3.6L not that long ago, and the engine makes enough power to supply that generator with all it needs. From what they said that Ram platform will probably be in use for the remainder of the decade or until the grid etc to support all electric improves. It didn't make sense for them to use a turbo engine, or make an engine specifically for that platform with such a short time frame in mind. They'll use what they have already in place. Time will tell if this will be successful or not.

 

[Torrid]

I don't know. With the castration of the diesel engine I can see why they went with the gas engine. Although prior to castration the diesel would have been a great choice. From what I read the 3.6L was the logical choice, and it makes sense since they invested a lot of money into a mfg facility for the 3.6L not that long ago, and the engine makes enough power to supply that generator with all it needs. From what they said that Ram platform will probably be in use for the remainder of the decade or until the grid etc to support all electric improves. It didn't make sense for them to use a turbo engine, or make an engine specifically for that platform with such a short time frame in mind. They'll use what they have already in place. Time will tell if this will be successful or not.

I'd rather an efficient diesel if something like VW used to do was still available. I don't even care about it being a hybrid. Of course dieselgate was a whole thing, but that's also why diesel is dying here. A truly efficiently tuned diesel lets out nastier toxins than one that will pass emissions. It's not going to work in the US for that reason.

 

[demarpaint]

I'd rather an efficient diesel if something like VW used to do was still available. I don't even care about it being a hybrid. Of course dieselgate was a whole thing, but that's also why diesel is dying here. A truly efficiently tuned diesel lets out nastier toxins than one that will pass emissions. It's not going to work in the US for that reason.

Exactly, which is probably why they went with gas.

 

[Thebigm]

All-new 2025 Ram 1500 Ramcharger Unveiled With Class-shattering Unlimited Battery-electric Range​

Ultimate Ram 1500 Combines an Unprecedented Range With New Levels of Capability and Performance

• All-new 2025 Ram 1500 Ramcharger’s battery electric vehicle technology delivers the industry’s best combination of range, towing and payload
• New level of performance delivered with 250-kilowatt (kW) front and 238 kW rear electric drive modules (EDMs) powered by an on-board 130 kW generator and a 92 kilowatt-hour (kWh) battery with a targeted range of up to 690 miles
• All-new 2025 Ram 1500 Ramcharger capable of:
  • 663 horsepower and 615 lb.-ft. of torque
  • 0 – 60 miles per hour (mph) in 4.4 seconds
  • Towing up to 14,000 lbs. and payload of up to 2,625 pounds
• Built on new STLA Frame body-on-frame architecture designed specifically for full-size electric vehicles featuring a body-on-frame design that incorporates the battery pack efficiently

https://media.stellantisnorthamerica.com/newsrelease.do?id=25436&mid=1


Ultimate Ram 1500 offers class-shattering range with segment-leading capability and performance
The 2025 Ram 1500 Ramcharger delivers innovative performance with a liquid-cooled 92 kWh battery pack and is paired with a 3.6-liter V-6 engine on-board 130 kW generator, sending power to a 250-kW front and 238-kW rear EDM. The EDMs combine the motor, gearbox and inverter along with all-wheel-drive capability. The 2025 Ram 1500 Ramcharger features one EDM on the front axle with an automatic wheel-end disconnect that allows the front wheels to spin freely in certain conditions, maximizing efficiency. The second EDM is positioned on the rear axle with an available electronic-locking rear differential.

Power flows in sequence from the 3.6-liter V-6 engine to the on-board 130-kW generator. The engine generates mechanical power that is converted to electrical power by the generator. The electrical power can be used to charge the battery when the battery is depleted or if the driver wants to preserve the battery power. It can also be applied to the high-voltage bus where the EDMs can use the generator electrical power plus the battery electrical power to provide maximum power to the wheels. There is no direct mechanical path from the engine to the wheels.

The 3.6-liter Pentastar V-6 engine is adapted for the specific mission of powering the onboard generator, with unique packaging to make room for the front EDM. The on-board generator mounts directly to the engine while a power inverter module mounts on the vehicle and connects to a junction box.

A liquid-cooled 92-kWh battery pack features a design that incorporates the pack efficiently with a pouch cell format in a parallel configuration. Ramcharger’s battery is positioned under the floor in the center of the truck and maintains a flat floor. Ram offers customers a quick and convenient recharging solution with the ability to add up to 50 miles of all-electric range in approximately 10 minutes with 400-volt DC fast charging at up to 145 kW.

The 2025 Ram 1500 Ramcharger uses the all-new STLA Frame platform and is designed specifically for full-size electric vehicles featuring a body-on-frame design. The all-new high-strength steel frame is comprised of advanced materials to be lightweight, yet stiff and durable. The STLA Frame is wider in the middle to efficiently incorporate the battery pack while still using protection afforded by the frame rails.

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But it's a RAM

 

[MrHorspwer]

It actually seems like a very small engine for 130kw. Kubota uses a 6.1l turbo diesel on their 130kw units.

A N/A 3.6l V6 seems horribly under-torqued in this application.

Absolutely. You hook the advertised 14k lbs to this truck and it's going to burn through that 96kW battery in less than 100 miles. That Pentastar is going to be grunting to keep up with the load.

Between the small battery, overtaxed V6, and tiny fuel tank, I bet it won't go 200 miles with a reasonably sized travel trailer hooked to the back. There's no free lunch when it comes to energy.

Is DEF used in other countries? I didn't know if that was a US development. Seems they've slowly made diesel less compelling by design.

Yes, DEF is used in other countries.

Adoption in other markets actually preceded adoption in the US by a few years.

The EPA staggered their lowering of NOx emissions over a few years that allowed manufacturers to adapt to the standards before implementing a full SCR system. This rollout probably created more problems than it solved, as manufacturers tried to get away with excessive amounts of cooled EGR to lower NOx, which only led to clogged EGR valves and EGR coolers. Moving right to an SCR system probably would have saved operators more than a few headaches.

 

[dogememe]

Absolutely. You hook the advertised 14k lbs to this truck and it's going to burn through that 96kW battery in less than 100 miles. That Pentastar is going to be grunting to keep up with the load.

Between the small battery, overtaxed V6, and tiny fuel tank, I bet it won't go 200 miles with a reasonably sized travel trailer hooked to the back. There's no free lunch when it comes to energy.

Yeah, as neat as it is, I wonder how well it's going to work for towing/hauling. If the Volt needs "mountain mode" to get up a long, steep hill at highway speeds (assuming the battery is discharged), how is the Ramcharger thing going to be able to do it while fully loaded, towing a trailer.

Around town it will be no problem, you can just run the "generator" at a higher speed while cruising after an acceleration to recharge the battery, but if you're going up the grapevine (for example) with a fully loaded truck, that's not going to work. 130Kw generation capability just seems too low.

 

[Cujet]

What's all the excitement? It's just a plug-in hybrid truck.

I wonder what the fuel economy is when the generator is running?

The fuel economy will be relatively poor on the engine alone. The "stack of losses" are significant when using a conventional engine, to drive a generator, through a charger, into a battery, out of a battery, into a motor controller, into a motor or two. Then through a simple gearbox and out to the wheels. Expect the generator to be 90% efficient, The charge controller to be 94% efficient, the motor controller to be 93% efficient, the motor to be 90% efficient and gearbox losses to be around 5%.

If the engine makes 200HP, only 135 will make it to the wheels. Considerably worse than the 15% loss 170HP (to the wheels) of a modern 200HP engine, automatic transmission and differential.

Another way to look at this is that pickup trucks often consume FROM THE GRID, about 1KWh per 1.3 miles driven at 80MPH. No different with an onboard generator.

 

[Torrid]

The fuel economy will be relatively poor on the engine alone. The "stack of losses" are significant when using a conventional engine, to drive a generator, through a charger, into a battery, out of a battery, into a motor controller, into a motor or two. Then through a simple gearbox and out to the wheels. Expect the generator to be 90% efficient, The charge controller to be 94% efficient, the motor controller to be 93% efficient, the motor to be 90% efficient and gearbox losses to be around 5%.

If the engine makes 200HP, only 135 will make it to the wheels. Considerably worse than the 15% loss 170HP (to the wheels) of a modern 200HP engine, automatic transmission and differential.

It’s the real life Bluetooth driveshaft that always gets laughed at during SEMA.

 

[UncleDave]

Yeah, as neat as it is, I wonder how well it's going to work for towing/hauling. If the Volt needs "mountain mode" to get up a long, steep hill at highway speeds (assuming the battery is discharged), how is the Ramcharger thing going to be able to do it while fully loaded, towing a trailer.

Around town it will be no problem, you can just run the "generator" at a higher speed while cruising after an acceleration to recharge the battery, but if you're going up the grapevine (for example) with a fully loaded truck, that's not going to work. 130Kw generation capability just seems too low.

I think I saw 130 sustained with a 190 Peak which is around 260 ponies.

 

[dogememe]

I think I saw 130 sustained with a 190 Peak which is around 260 ponies.

Maybe I don't understand but it seems too small?

 

[UncleDave]

Maybe I don't understand but it seems too small?

It remains to be seen if it is or not, it all depends on how it actually works -

Is the ice going to sustain like a volt?
Or is it going to charge and stop?

The marketing is a bit silly with the "unlimited range battery" claim.

 

[tcp71]

Maybe in tow mode the ICE will try to keep the battery at 70% vs regular mode where it will allow a drop to 40% or some other value. 70% should get you up almost any long climb with the expectation that there is a drop on the other side that can use regenerative braking to recharge the battery at high levels using the weight of the truck/trailer to drive the generator. ICE works as hard as possible on the uphill towing part helping to minimize the drop.

 

[UncleDave]

Maybe in tow mode the ICE will try to keep the battery at 70% vs regular mode where it will allow a drop to 40% or some other value. 70% should get you up almost any long climb with the expectation that there is a drop on the other side that can use regenerative braking to recharge the battery at high levels using the weight of the truck/trailer to drive the generator. ICE works as hard as possible on the uphill towing part helping to minimize the drop.

The Fast lane trucks Ike numbers are interesting.
Regardless of what they say Davis Dam is tougher tow and I do Davis a couple times a year.

 

[demarpaint]

Maybe in tow mode the ICE will try to keep the battery at 70% vs regular mode where it will allow a drop to 40% or some other value. 70% should get you up almost any long climb with the expectation that there is a drop on the other side that can use regenerative braking to recharge the battery at high levels using the weight of the truck/trailer to drive the generator. ICE works as hard as possible on the uphill towing part helping to minimize the drop.

Hopefully they have the ability to flash the computer to tweak the battery % for people who tow with it. Or a tow haul mode for lack of a better term the drive can switch on. That's something the early adopters will learn quickly about. I hope this platform is a winner for them and more follow. If this works out by the second or third year of production they'll have bugs worked out.

 

[meep]

Great thread here. I’m glad they did what they said they would do.

I waited many, many years to buy my first truck, and then a number more to buy one new. I’m not want to rely heavily on payments - if I can’t put down a solid down payment, it’s not for me... I’m not so desperate for a vehicle to sell-out to debt.

BUT I love cars. And I love efficiency. And I (sigh) love my truck. And this one is the designs I have been the most interested in. But for that price? It’s almost like “old men who drive trucks will burn gas.” I cant see myself being able to spend that kind of coin. By the time one saves up that kind of money, they knew what it took to get there.

point #2. It’s this forum that showed me some math that demonstrated that the mpg delivered from the onboard generator concept amounted to 14mpg. I’m thinking one of our best minds (meant sincerely) like @OVERKILL or @Cujet. If they are correct, 14 mpg is a good “backup plan” for occasional use but a solid step backwards if used much. In addition, that’s 7mpg when towing a trailer with a full face on it. think about it - if I’m pulling a 6k lb trailer up a steep grade, I’ve pulled the battery down to 20%, and it’s HOT. The inverter is hot. The EDMs are hot. Then the genset kicks in. The engine is hot. The gen head is hot. And half of the relative fuel efficiency is going up in heat. thats kind of wild thinking about it. I’d be very interested to see the engineering they have here - and the gearhead in me gets excited and the naysayer in me gets bristled.

personally, I would have gambled with a smaller genset. I understand that it would be a flop if they undersized it and the folks with the money to buy one and used it would destroy the name, but if you’re buying an electric truck, towing just can’t be the main thing. Those who tow heavy understand that simplicity is gold as the drivetrains get worked, strained and hot. RVers generally also have no issue slowing down to respect both traffic and power train. you can dip into battery reserves during the climbs, and let it catch up on the descents and straights. If I wanted electric, I’d want that compromise for the lighter weight and hopefully improved maintenance accessibility.

Also, if the relatively small battery pack is used daily where the efficiencies are realized, it will see relatively deep cycles, which will age faster (maybe it could still outlast the practical life of the vehicle?)

and then I have this issue/frustration/bias:
- that is a strikingly beautiful truck
- it likely maintains the best interior of the big 3
- but I’ve owned 5 Chrysler/Jeep products in my life and saw the good and bad
- but - they experiment more with technology and that’s a good thing!

also, great point about vehicle weight. These gonna be heavy. Weight is devastating to the lighter vehicle in an accident.

trucks may not be the best application for EV tech. Passenger vehicles seem more suitable. But I understand that if you need quick ROI to pay for the research, do it with the vehicles that command the highest profit margins, and then if it pays off we’ll see it being done in suvs, vans and sedans. To that end, this may almost be an experiment for Ram. ???

 

[hemioiler]

Great thread here. I’m glad they did what they said they would do.

I waited many, many years to buy my first truck, and then a number more to buy one new. I’m not want to rely heavily on payments - if I can’t put down a solid down payment, it’s not for me... I’m not so desperate for a vehicle to sell-out to debt.

BUT I love cars. And I love efficiency. And I (sigh) love my truck. And this one is the designs I have been the most interested in. But for that price? It’s almost like “old men who drive trucks will burn gas.” I cant see myself being able to spend that kind of coin. By the time one saves up that kind of money, they knew what it took to get there.

point #2. It’s this forum that showed me some math that demonstrated that the mpg delivered from the onboard generator concept amounted to 14mpg. I’m thinking one of our best minds (meant sincerely) like @OVERKILL or @Cujet. If they are correct, 14 mpg is a good “backup plan” for occasional use but a solid step backwards if used much. In addition, that’s 7mpg when towing a trailer with a full face on it.

if the relatively small battery pack is used daily where the efficiencies are realized, it will see relatively deep cycles, which will age faster (maybe it could still outlast the practical life of the vehicle?)

and then I have this issue/frustration/bias:
- that is a strikingly beautiful truck
- it likely maintains the best interior of the big 3
- but I’ve owned 5 Chrysler/Jeep products in my life and saw the good and bad
- but - they experiment more with technology and that’s a good thing!

also, great point about vehicle weight. These gonna be heavy. Weight is devastating to the lighter vehicle in an accident.

trucks may not be the best application for EV tech. Passenger vehicles seem more suitable. But I understand that if you need quick ROI to pay for the research, do it with the vehicles that command the highest profit margins, and then if it pays off we’ll see it being done in suvs, vans and sedans. To that end, this may almost be an experiment for Ram. ???

I think the point of this truck is that you don't use the gas engine much at all. Most people daily commute, the EV part should do the vast majority of this.

But trucks also occasionally (or not so occasionally) tow a lot, RV's, utility trailers etc, or maybe it's your only vehicle and you don't want to deal with public charging while towing a trailer. That's where the gas generator comes in.

On top of that, the EV bit of this means its a far better tow rig than any ICE/diesel 1500. The power numbers are incredible, the extra weight gives stability for controlling the trailer, especially since the weight is very low down.

FCA is not new to this stuff, they've had hybrid caravan's, wranglers, the E/T system in the rams, I have no real concerns about them being able to pull this off. But I won't be the first customer either.

 

[meep]

I think the point of this truck is that you don't use the gas engine much at all. Most people daily commute, the EV part should do the vast majority of this.

But trucks also occasionally (or not so occasionally) tow a lot, RV's, utility trailers etc, or maybe it's your only vehicle and you don't want to deal with public charging while towing a trailer. That's where the gas generator comes in.

On top of that, the EV bit of this means its a far better tow rig than any ICE/diesel 1500. The power numbers are incredible, the extra weight gives stability for controlling the trailer, especially since the weight is very low down.

FCA is not new to this stuff, they've had hybrid caravan's, wranglers, the E/T system in the rams, I have no real concerns about them being able to pull this off. But I won't be the first customer either.

Solid thinking here.

 

[Torrid]

I think the point of this truck is that you don't use the gas engine much at all. Most people daily commute, the EV part should do the vast majority of this.

But trucks also occasionally (or not so occasionally) tow a lot, RV's, utility trailers etc, or maybe it's your only vehicle and you don't want to deal with public charging while towing a trailer. That's where the gas generator comes in.

On top of that, the EV bit of this means its a far better tow rig than any ICE/diesel 1500. The power numbers are incredible, the extra weight gives stability for controlling the trailer, especially since the weight is very low down.

FCA is not new to this stuff, they've had hybrid caravan's, wranglers, the E/T system in the rams, I have no real concerns about them being able to pull this off. But I won't be the first customer either.

I get it. Unfortunately what my head goes to is pulling around the dead weight of an engine and generator 98% of the time.

 

[demarpaint]

FCA is not new to this stuff, they've had hybrid caravan's, wranglers, the E/T system in the rams, I have no real concerns about them being able to pull this off. But I won't be the first customer either.

I agree with all your points. My bet is by the second or third year they'll have it greatly improved, or **** can it altogether. Either way let the guys that must have the first generation of a new platform/tech be the guinea pigs, and Stellantis can learn on the dime of the early adopters.

 

[JavierH19]

I kinda expect ram to kill the v6 soon to put in a 4 cyl variant of their hurricane with or without a turbo. The efficiency curves change a lot once you don't have gear ratios and load variance.