2011 Prius Valve Cover Photos
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Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
Well, forget about Mobil 1 if it doesn't prevent HG failure!
I was thinking the same thing.
On a serious note, it's obvious when an engine has been well maintained. Thank you for the pics!
Well, forget about Mobil 1 if it doesn't prevent HG failure!
I was thinking the same thing.
On a serious note, it's obvious when an engine has been well maintained. Thank you for the pics!
Originally Posted by nthach
caprice_2nv said:
Originally Posted by StevieC
Raidin, it's because of the "fear thin low HTHS" crowd here...
When 0w20 was first introduced it was sold in Germany at the Toyota dealers as an oil especially for hybrids, so no surprise here. It makes sense though, a small liquid cooled engine used in low performance application with less than a 100% duty cycle, its perfect for that use.
Raidin, it's because of the "fear thin low HTHS" crowd here...
When 0w20 was first introduced it was sold in Germany at the Toyota dealers as an oil especially for hybrids, so no surprise here. It makes sense though, a small liquid cooled engine used in low performance application with less than a 100% duty cycle, its perfect for that use.
It's fine in any normally operated engine where it's called for.
Originally Posted by CR94
Originally Posted by nthach
Originally Posted by ekpolk
For those who doubt this, I have a one word rebuttal: Fel-pro.
And Fel-Pro has a good track record for problem children. If I had to do one, I would use a PermaTorque MLS.
Toyota has a new, improved head gasket, used in later 3rd-generation Prii. Too late. Of course they don't admit the early version was defective.
Part numbers change for all sorts of reasons on Toyota's.
Originally Posted by nthach
Originally Posted by ekpolk
For those who doubt this, I have a one word rebuttal: Fel-pro.
And Fel-Pro has a good track record for problem children. If I had to do one, I would use a PermaTorque MLS.
Toyota has a new, improved head gasket, used in later 3rd-generation Prii. Too late. Of course they don't admit the early version was defective.
Part numbers change for all sorts of reasons on Toyota's.
But so are all the other viscosity that are allowed, they don't say xw20 is optimal and in many cases it isn't. There are engines that are built for it and in those engines it may well be optimal.
Eg The Ford 5.4 2V was back spec'd for 5w20 unless it was used for towing in which case 5w30 should be used. Clearly 5w20 was not the correct oil for this engine as it could not protect it under all operating conditions.
Eg The Ford 5.4 2V was back spec'd for 5w20 unless it was used for towing in which case 5w30 should be used. Clearly 5w20 was not the correct oil for this engine as it could not protect it under all operating conditions.
Originally Posted by Trav
But so are all the other viscosity that are allowed, they don't say xw20 is optimal and in many cases it isn't. There are engines that are built for it and in those engines it may well be optimal.
Eg The Ford 5.4 2V was back spec'd for 5w20 unless it was used for towing in which case 5w30 should be used. Clearly 5w20 was not the correct oil for this engine as it could not protect it under all operating conditions.
That's a design fault that they didn't realize until after. That's not a fault of the 20wt oil and they decided rather than having to fix all the vehicles to run on the spec'ed oil they would spec a 30wt instead.
Lots of TGDI applications running 20wt oils where the oil temperature is tightly controlled it's fine.
But so are all the other viscosity that are allowed, they don't say xw20 is optimal and in many cases it isn't. There are engines that are built for it and in those engines it may well be optimal.
Eg The Ford 5.4 2V was back spec'd for 5w20 unless it was used for towing in which case 5w30 should be used. Clearly 5w20 was not the correct oil for this engine as it could not protect it under all operating conditions.
That's a design fault that they didn't realize until after. That's not a fault of the 20wt oil and they decided rather than having to fix all the vehicles to run on the spec'ed oil they would spec a 30wt instead.
Lots of TGDI applications running 20wt oils where the oil temperature is tightly controlled it's fine.
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No it is not, it will run on xw20 as long as you don't go over the weight limit and they did not retract the xw20 back spec. Why are you running 0w30 in your own vehicle that is spec for xw20?
You don't practice what you preach?
You don't practice what you preach?
It has nothing to do with it.
Originally Posted by Trav
No it is not, it will run on xw20 as long as you don't go over the weight limit and they did not retract the xw20 back spec. Why are you running 0w30 in your own vehicle that is spec for xw20?
You don't practice what you preach?
I explained in multiple threads why. It's not because I fear 20wt's like the "Thick is in" crowd. Further I even said I was switching back to 20wt at the next oil change.
No it is not, it will run on xw20 as long as you don't go over the weight limit and they did not retract the xw20 back spec. Why are you running 0w30 in your own vehicle that is spec for xw20?
You don't practice what you preach?
I explained in multiple threads why. It's not because I fear 20wt's like the "Thick is in" crowd. Further I even said I was switching back to 20wt at the next oil change.
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JHZR2
Staff member
Originally Posted by Raidin
Originally Posted by JHZR2
Originally Posted by StevieC
Look at all that carnage from a 20wt. My god man you should switch to a 0w40 immediately.
Thanks for posting.
Originally Posted by Snagglefoot
That must be a typo. You can't get 185,000 miles on 0w20!
Don't forget, it's a hybrid and so the engine isn't running all the time... so it doesn't really have 185k...
While I'm not aware of the whole subject, I wanted to bring up the fact that I have a hybrid that has been running 0W-20 for 457k miles, and that most of my driving is highway driving, so the engine is running a lot more than some may think. I would put it at 90% of the time, as most of the roads I travel are above the maximum speed the car can run in EV mode.
Note the wink. As a fellow hybrid user who puts most miles on the highway though having a short routine commute, I'm in the same boat.
Originally Posted by stanlee
meh high miles on a prius is not like high miles on a all gas car. Electric motor does the off the line accelerating (the low end stuff) and its purposely kept at low rpm for its engine size for fuel efficiency (the top end stuff) so it A. SHOULD look excellent as it does not work hard at all and B. should not be blowing head gaskets given its light duty and partial use.
Maybe my Honda Accord hybrid is different, but IMO the electric power train sees a relatively easy life. It doesn't take a lot of pedal for the ice to kick in and augment or take over for the electric motors. While motors give full torque at 0 rpm and can be a good acceleration aid, my observation is that the car relies upon the engine much more than one would think.
This is sensible because current creates heat (I^2 R), and internal generation of heat in batteries is a primary cause of chemical ageing, degradation, and most important here, impedance growth.
On the highway the engine does all the work about 90% of the load. Sometimes the battery cycles through on flat land cruising or going down a hill. But to add challenge to that situation, the engine very rapidly transitions from high(ish) continuous power to full off, to back on again. That can create al sorts of challenges with unburned fuel, heat soak, etc. If a car takes 60hp to cruise at 60 mph, then the engine is routinely going from 50% load in my car (66% for the prius) to not only zero load but off (air flow through the engine removes a lot of heat and now the engine isn't pumping air), then back on, sometimes in a matter of seconds. That's plenty severe, in many ways worse than an ICE, even if the standard ICE is loaded and operating more.
Not an excuse for a bad HG though.
Originally Posted by JHZR2
Originally Posted by StevieC
Look at all that carnage from a 20wt. My god man you should switch to a 0w40 immediately.
Thanks for posting.
Originally Posted by Snagglefoot
That must be a typo. You can't get 185,000 miles on 0w20!
Don't forget, it's a hybrid and so the engine isn't running all the time... so it doesn't really have 185k...
While I'm not aware of the whole subject, I wanted to bring up the fact that I have a hybrid that has been running 0W-20 for 457k miles, and that most of my driving is highway driving, so the engine is running a lot more than some may think. I would put it at 90% of the time, as most of the roads I travel are above the maximum speed the car can run in EV mode.
Note the wink. As a fellow hybrid user who puts most miles on the highway though having a short routine commute, I'm in the same boat.
Originally Posted by stanlee
meh high miles on a prius is not like high miles on a all gas car. Electric motor does the off the line accelerating (the low end stuff) and its purposely kept at low rpm for its engine size for fuel efficiency (the top end stuff) so it A. SHOULD look excellent as it does not work hard at all and B. should not be blowing head gaskets given its light duty and partial use.
Maybe my Honda Accord hybrid is different, but IMO the electric power train sees a relatively easy life. It doesn't take a lot of pedal for the ice to kick in and augment or take over for the electric motors. While motors give full torque at 0 rpm and can be a good acceleration aid, my observation is that the car relies upon the engine much more than one would think.
This is sensible because current creates heat (I^2 R), and internal generation of heat in batteries is a primary cause of chemical ageing, degradation, and most important here, impedance growth.
On the highway the engine does all the work about 90% of the load. Sometimes the battery cycles through on flat land cruising or going down a hill. But to add challenge to that situation, the engine very rapidly transitions from high(ish) continuous power to full off, to back on again. That can create al sorts of challenges with unburned fuel, heat soak, etc. If a car takes 60hp to cruise at 60 mph, then the engine is routinely going from 50% load in my car (66% for the prius) to not only zero load but off (air flow through the engine removes a lot of heat and now the engine isn't pumping air), then back on, sometimes in a matter of seconds. That's plenty severe, in many ways worse than an ICE, even if the standard ICE is loaded and operating more.
Not an excuse for a bad HG though.
Originally Posted by Trav
But so are all the other viscosity that are allowed, they don't say xw20 is optimal and in many cases it isn't. There are engines that are built for it and in those engines it may well be optimal.
Eg The Ford 5.4 2V was back spec'd for 5w20 unless it was used for towing in which case 5w30 should be used. Clearly 5w20 was not the correct oil for this engine as it could not protect it under all operating conditions.
U-Haul was wanting people to use 15W-40 oil for topping off their trucks if they needed oil even though Ford calls for 5W-20 and GM 5W-30. They were assuming worst case scenario even though the DoD and VVT systems were designed around a certain range of oil viscosities. Then again, not everyone checks the oil and coolant levels on a U-Haul even though it states in the rental agreement and near the fuel cap that it's the renter's responsibility to check fluid levels.
The Japanese are ambiguous with oil recommendations. I wouldn't hesitate to use a xxW-20/16 in a modern Japanese car but there are always problem children *cough*Subaru*cough*
But so are all the other viscosity that are allowed, they don't say xw20 is optimal and in many cases it isn't. There are engines that are built for it and in those engines it may well be optimal.
Eg The Ford 5.4 2V was back spec'd for 5w20 unless it was used for towing in which case 5w30 should be used. Clearly 5w20 was not the correct oil for this engine as it could not protect it under all operating conditions.
U-Haul was wanting people to use 15W-40 oil for topping off their trucks if they needed oil even though Ford calls for 5W-20 and GM 5W-30. They were assuming worst case scenario even though the DoD and VVT systems were designed around a certain range of oil viscosities. Then again, not everyone checks the oil and coolant levels on a U-Haul even though it states in the rental agreement and near the fuel cap that it's the renter's responsibility to check fluid levels.
The Japanese are ambiguous with oil recommendations. I wouldn't hesitate to use a xxW-20/16 in a modern Japanese car but there are always problem children *cough*Subaru*cough*
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Thanks for sharing this,I didn't know they are known to blow the head gasket. People want crazy money for these vehicles with high miles.
How is the Gen 2 engine?
How is the Gen 2 engine?
Originally Posted by KrisZ
Thanks for sharing this,I didn't know they are known to blow the head gasket. People want crazy money for these vehicles with high miles.
How is the Gen 2 engine?
Reliable, but likes to drink engine oil. The Gen 2 has a lot of annoying, small issues that are very DIY'er repairable (combo meter, inverter pump, abs module, etc). The Gen 3 is shockingly reliable until 150k-ish, then things hit the fan.
Thanks for sharing this,I didn't know they are known to blow the head gasket. People want crazy money for these vehicles with high miles.
How is the Gen 2 engine?
Reliable, but likes to drink engine oil. The Gen 2 has a lot of annoying, small issues that are very DIY'er repairable (combo meter, inverter pump, abs module, etc). The Gen 3 is shockingly reliable until 150k-ish, then things hit the fan.
Originally Posted by PimTac
The number 0 has a triggering effect on some.
Doesn't 0W-xx mean the watery stuff has no viscosity?
The number 0 has a triggering effect on some.
Doesn't 0W-xx mean the watery stuff has no viscosity?
Originally Posted by CR94
Originally Posted by PimTac
The number 0 has a triggering effect on some.
Doesn't 0W-xx mean the watery stuff has no viscosity?
0 means that there should be 0 "eff's" given when trying to start the engine in frigid temperatures.
With a 5 that means some "effs" should be considered before starting in the same conditions.
The higher the number the more "eff's" should be given.
Why do they use a "W" instead of an "F", because the "W" stands for "With this consideration in mind" on the "eff's" given scale of cold weather performance.
Originally Posted by PimTac
The number 0 has a triggering effect on some.
Doesn't 0W-xx mean the watery stuff has no viscosity?
0 means that there should be 0 "eff's" given when trying to start the engine in frigid temperatures.
With a 5 that means some "effs" should be considered before starting in the same conditions.
The higher the number the more "eff's" should be given.
Why do they use a "W" instead of an "F", because the "W" stands for "With this consideration in mind" on the "eff's" given scale of cold weather performance.
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Originally Posted by Trav
Originally Posted by StevieC
Raidin, it's because of the "fear thin low HTHS" crowd here...
When 0w20 was first introduced it was sold in Germany at the Toyota dealers as an oil especially for hybrids, so no surprise here. It makes sense though, a small liquid cooled engine used in low performance application with less than a 100% duty cycle, its perfect for that use.
0w-20 is recommended for, and doesn't seem to be causing problems in, Toyota's 5.7L V-8 engine. . .
Originally Posted by StevieC
Raidin, it's because of the "fear thin low HTHS" crowd here...
When 0w20 was first introduced it was sold in Germany at the Toyota dealers as an oil especially for hybrids, so no surprise here. It makes sense though, a small liquid cooled engine used in low performance application with less than a 100% duty cycle, its perfect for that use.
0w-20 is recommended for, and doesn't seem to be causing problems in, Toyota's 5.7L V-8 engine. . .
Originally Posted by StevieC
Originally Posted by CR94
Originally Posted by PimTac
The number 0 has a triggering effect on some.
Doesn't 0W-xx mean the watery stuff has no viscosity?
0 means that there should be 0 "eff's" given when trying to start the engine in frigid temperatures.
With a 5 that means some "effs" should be considered before starting in the same conditions.
The higher the number the more "eff's" should be given.
Why do they use a "W" instead of an "F", because the "W" stands for "With this consideration in mind" on the "eff's" given scale of cold weather performance.
I like that description of oil grades. Lol
Originally Posted by CR94
Originally Posted by PimTac
The number 0 has a triggering effect on some.
Doesn't 0W-xx mean the watery stuff has no viscosity?
0 means that there should be 0 "eff's" given when trying to start the engine in frigid temperatures.
With a 5 that means some "effs" should be considered before starting in the same conditions.
The higher the number the more "eff's" should be given.
Why do they use a "W" instead of an "F", because the "W" stands for "With this consideration in mind" on the "eff's" given scale of cold weather performance.
I like that description of oil grades. Lol
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