$20 budget oil choice.

[GW.]

You can't make any relative quality conclusions based on this video. 3 rips on the dyno and a $30 used oil analysis means nothing. Just entertainment.

Exactly. Ranking oils based solely on wear is ridiculous. Not only are all these oils within the margin of error of eachother, oils don’t just prevent wear. What about engine/piston cleanliness, shear stability, oxidation resistance, turbo deposits, viscosity retention etc. etc. Lakes testing in HPL’s lab covers a lot more of the other important tests(still not all). He was even a little shocked between some of the differences in performance within the M1 lineup alone.

This is not a dig at Lakes technical abilities or experience. He’s just not providing all the data needed in this vid(but it gets clicks). In other vids he digs deeper.

No NFL coach goes to the compound and chooses the best quarterback only based on who jumps the highest….

 

[ATex7239]

I think NAPA Synthetic is the same oil as Valvoline Extended Protection Full Synthetic. That was moderately expensive until recently. It's now regular price $26 for 5 quart jug at Walmart. Last time I looked, NAPA Synthetic was $29 for 5 quart jug.

So NAPA Synthetic isn't a low cost oil. Never has been. I don't know why Lakespeed thinks it's low cost.

NAPA does weird stuff with their pricing. One day FS will be $29 then the next day it will be on “sale” for ~ $20. The blend is the same way, it would be $18 one day and $25 the next. It’s still a budget oil when on sale. A few bucks isn’t a huge delta though.

 

[Wireman1987]

NAPA does weird stuff with their pricing. One day FS will be $29 then the next day it will be on “sale” for ~ $20. The blend is the same way, it would be $18 one day and $25 the next. It’s still a budget oil when on sale. A few bucks isn’t a huge delta though.

haven't seen the days of 18.99 in a few years last time I stocked up it was around 20.99 per 5 Qt. I fail to check my local NAPA we get a generous discount with them via my job since our fleet dept does heavy business with them.

 

[GW.]

haven't seen the days of 18.99 in a few years last time I stocked up it was around 20.99 per 5 Qt. I fail to check my local NAPA we get a generous discount with them via my job since our fleet dept does heavy business with them.

I remember the $18.99 days! Used their oil for a good 5 years. Also a couple times per year 50% off oil filters!

 

[TnT_M]

What is FVP?
Thanks.

Available at Menards

FVP oil

 

[ATex7239]

haven't seen the days of 18.99 in a few years last time I stocked up it was around 20.99 per 5 Qt. I fail to check my local NAPA we get a generous discount with them via my job since our fleet dept does heavy business with them.

I picked up some NAPA FS a few months back for $5.39 a single quart (only needed a few quarts) and typically Supertech Full Synthetic is right at $5. Sure, the NAPA was almost $2 more than ST for that purchase, but that isn’t something to be concerned about one way or another IMO.

Nothing against Supertech (it’s in my daughter’s Hyundai right now) but I’m not in love with it as the end all and be all oil like some folks seem to see it as.

 

[tired]

I did not have a preconceived bias about NAPA oil. I had no opinion about NAPA oil at all. I also have no reason to doubt Lakesspeed's video.

It wasn't until after I watched that video that I researched NAPA Synthetic oil's specs and learned that it (appears to be) the same oil as Valvoline Extended Protection Full Synthetic. If it had the Valvoline Extended Protection Full Synthetic label on the jug, which is a big name oil, would you have the same opinions/assumptions?

Also, if you have no respect for Lakespeeds trilbology education, certification, and decades of job experience, then lets apply that thinking to other professions to show the absurdity of your "authority fallacy" idea/attitude.

If you're a passenger on a plane, do you want the pilot to have training, experience, and a pilot's license? Or is respecting those things just authority fallacy? Should we just let any random passenger blowhard with enough unfounded confidence/narcissism try their hand at flying the plane? Would you want to be a passenger on that plane?

If you're a patient undergoing surgery, do you want the doctor to have training, experience, and a medical license? Or is respecting those things just authority fallacy? Should we let anyone who claims to know what they're doing do surgery on a patient? Would you want to be that patient?

You're advocating perpetuating the democratization of knowledge, which means any overconfident schmuck off the street that has an opinion would be considered equally qualified in a specialized field as a certified expert in that field just because the schmuck says so.

So yes, I have a problem with that. The man is certified in tribology and has decades of job experience in that field. I respect that.

I doubt any oil company (or piston ring company) would hire you to do what he does.

They wouldn't hire me to do it either because I'm not qualified. The difference between you and I is that I know I'm not qualified to do his job, and I know enough to respect that he is qualified, certified, and experienced.

I guess you are blinded by his title and cannot see past that to critique his testing methods, even when he puts out a turd of a video. That is how it appears. However, others here with significant knowledge and experience have rightfully critiqued this video. I suppose you missed all those discussions.

Based on the rest of your post, I don’t think you understand what an appeal to authority fallacy is. Here is more reading. It does not mean mistrust of authority. If my pilot crashed the plane in the ditch when taxiing to the runway, I would no longer trust his ability to take off and land. If my surgeon didn’t know basics of anatomy in discussing surgery with me, I would no longer trust his ability to operate safely. I hope that helps. Lake crashed the plane on taxiing in that video. This isn’t astrophysics here man. You don’t need a PhD in chemistry and two decades of experience to understand that 3 rips on a dyno and a used oil analysis can’t tell you the relative quality of different oils. I’m glad you have respect for authority. I think we have a lack of that in society today. But in this case, it’s easy to criticize this video.

You should also read about the tu quoque fallacy.

 

[Wireman1987]

I picked up some NAPA FS a few months back for $5.39 a single quart (only needed a few quarts) and typically Supertech Full Synthetic is right at $5. Sure, the NAPA was almost $2 more than ST for that purchase, but that isn’t something to be concerned about one way or another IMO.

Nothing against Supertech (it’s in my daughter’s Hyundai right now) but I’m not in love with it as the end all and be all oil like some folks seem to see it as.

for the majority of us on here that love changing oil and filters out a quality oil like Kirkland's signature full synthetic and Walmart's Super Tech full and advanced synthetic make lots of sense for 5-7,500k oci's or even 1 year depending on vehicle. I cant speak and not dogging those that want to spend boutique coin to push 25,000 mile oil changes. oil and filters are too readily available and the cost is less than eating fast food for two. and I do splurge when prices are right on Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy or Castrol Edge. Yes that NAPA is great oil and awesome when it's priced around the super tech price range.

 

[ATex7239]

for the majority of us on here that love changing oil and filters out a quality oil like Kirkland's signature full synthetic and Walmart's Super Tech full and advanced synthetic make lots of sense for 5-7,500k oci's or even 1 year depending on vehicle. I cant speak and not dogging those that want to spend boutique coin to push 25,000 mile oil changes. oil and filters are too readily available and the cost is less than eating fast food for two. and I do splurge when prices are right on Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy or Castrol Edge. Yes that NAPA is great oil and awesome when it's priced around the super tech price range.

To each his own. I like NAPA for using electronic rebate gift card purchases mostly. Spent the $30 Pennzoil Ultra Platinum rebate there and I’ll probably spend the $10 Edge rebate there when it comes in. So in that regard I’m getting the name brand oil at regular price from Walmart and getting the store brand oil from NAPA pretty much free with in store pick up.

 

[JTK]

I keep wavering back/forth between ~$20 5qt jugs of Walmart Supertech and ~$30 jugs of Valvoline Restore and Protect. I don't take any of my fleet beyond a 5K mile OCI.

 

[GW.]

I keep wavering back/forth between ~$20 5qt jugs of Walmart Supertech and ~$30 jugs of Valvoline Restore and Protect. I don't take any of my fleet beyond a 5K mile OCI.

Any oil consumption or signs of deposits?

 

[JTK]

Any oil consumption or signs of deposits?

No noticeable consumption between OCIs. Running Valvoline Restore and Protect makes me feel better, hoping it will keep my little 2021 GM 1.5T healthy and my 2021 3.6 tip top. All I really got is hope.

 

[burbguy82]

No NFL coach goes to the compound and chooses the best quarterback only based on who jumps the highest….

You are correct, but that is a bad analogy. Quarterbacks don't have to jump, they throw the ball. The most important function of oil is to prevent wear. So like choosing a QB on their throw, I would choose an oil based on wear rates over any other factor.

 

[kschachn]

Who has a tribology degree/certification and years of experience working with motor oil engineers and technicians in the motor oil industry, you or Lakespeed?

There is quite a difference between a relevant degree and a $695 certification they anyone can get.

 

[GW.]

You are correct, but that is a bad analogy. Quarterbacks don't have to jump, they throw the ball. The most important function of oil is to prevent wear. So like choosing a QB on their throw, I would choose an oil based on wear rates over any other factor.

Wear would not be my first choice as statistically a used oil analysis won’t show any difference even between conventional, syn blend, and synthetic of the same grade. Blackstone probably has one of the largest databases of used oil analysis. They have written on this very topic.

“So what does all of this tell us? Well, we're no closer to saying that one type of oil is better than another, that's for sure. We see much more variation in wear levels from the type of engine, the time on the oil, the viscosity, the use the engine sees, etc. Whatever differences exist from oil brand to oil brand, we don't see a lot of difference in terms of wear for most types of engines.”

 

[facility1]

interesting charts, how old is this information?, all ,engine oils seem to be in a virtually constant state of reformulations, and demanding new specs from the engine manuf epa etc . , now with the new SQ,,GF-7,etc this info. maybe outdated.,,,,,,,,,, Amsoil as good of a oil as it is does pick brands (by their choice & coupled by various API etc. Tests to in their favor) mostly often outdated comparison tables, though its fairly good information? what CURRENT licenses and approvals can be learned by this by a fair marginal up to date comparison ? in conclusion AMSOIL does make and market a fantastic product and inspite of this comparison would still consider them a excellent choice.

 

[MetalSlug]

Wear would not be my first choice as statistically a used oil analysis won’t show any difference even between conventional, syn blend, and synthetic of the same grade. Blackstone probably has one of the largest databases of used oil analysis. They have written on this very topic.

View attachment 300358View attachment 300359

“So what does all of this tell us? Well, we're no closer to saying that one type of oil is better than another, that's for sure. We see much more variation in wear levels from the type of engine, the time on the oil, the viscosity, the use the engine sees, etc. Whatever differences exist from oil brand to oil brand, we don't see a lot of difference in terms of wear for most types of engines.”

mobil 1 did bad.

 

[Zee09]

Mobil 1 is the loudest so it gets the most attention

 

[Japanese]

What part of the engine internals is iron?
Mobil 1 5W-30 recommended for the Corvette engine (C5, C6, C7) and having the HTO (Honda Turbo Oil) approval.
Interesting.

 

[tired]

interesting charts, how old is this information?, all ,engine oils seem to be in a virtually constate state of reformulations, and demanding new specs from the engine manuf epa etc . , now with the new SQ,,GF-7,etc this info. maybe outdated.,,,,,,,,,, Amsoil as good of a oil as it is does pick brands (by their choice & coupled by various API etc. Tests to in their favor) mostly often outdated comparison tables, though its fairly good information? what CURRENT licenses and approvals can be learned by this by a fair marginal up to date comparison ? in conclusion AMSOIL does make and market a fantastic product and inspite of this comparison would still consider them a excellent choice.

2017 I think.

https://www.blackstone-labs.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/Aug-17-ENG.pdf