14 Mazda 3, 14 Accord, [other new cars]Manual Only

[Bladecutter]

Originally Posted By: dareo
Mazda 3 doubts i have: Did they lighten the skyactiv too much to be long term reliable? How about the lightening of its 6 speed manual?


I'm not sure what that really means.
Can you make your question a bit clearer?

Anyway, the 2.0 liter SkyActiv engine has been available in the US market for several years now, in the Mazda 3, and the CX-5. The 2.5 liter SkyActiv engine has been on the market for just over a year in the CX-5 and the Mazda 6.

So far, I haven't heard of any suspicious failures as of yet with any part of the SkyActiv engines or transmissions, and I've been driving a Mazda since early 2011, and have been watching Mazda forums very intently since then.

Quote:
Why does it not have cruise control on the base model?


Chances are Mazda USA's flawed research on USA customer's buying habits has pointed that people who buy the base model version of a car in that price range are willing to live without features like cruise control in order to hit that low price point. It's the same flawed research model that told them that customers in the USA that buy manual transmissions in their vehicles only buy them in Black, Grey, or Silver. Argghh.

Quote:
A driveable mazda 3 really costs $19,240. Only 2,000 less than an Accord LX can be haggled to. Accord wins in brand reputation and theoretical resale value to the point that those 2,000 dollars are not significant.


You can't compared a stripped down Honda Accord with a Fully Loaded Mazda 3 on anything except price, and the fact that both vehicles have 4 tires that touch the ground.

Quote:
Nissan is supposed to have improved the 2014 sentra suspension and it will be offered with a manual. I'm not a fan but it could come close to 15k since Nissan wheels and deals to make sales.


Nissan lost their way many years ago with the Sentra.
Now it is severely underpowered, to the point that a Corolla can outrun it in many instances. You shouldn't even attempt to compare a Sentra with a Mazda 3. That would be similar to comparing a new Maserati with a used Oldsmobile.

Quote:
My point is, the 3 is expensive.


Don't buy one, if you think it's too expensive.

Quote:
CX 5 is on the table as well, but i prefer the 3's price, weight, MPG, and handling over it.


Maybe you should tell us exactly what your wife's needs are for a car?
Better yet, maybe your wife should tell you exactly what her needs are in a car, and you can transfer that information over to us.
I think there's a lot being added or missed that she probably would care as much about as you do.

BC.

 

[supton]

Originally Posted By: Bladecutter

Chances are Mazda USA's flawed research on USA customer's buying habits has pointed that people who buy the base model version of a car in that price range are willing to live without features like cruise control in order to hit that low price point. It's the same flawed research model that told them that customers in the USA that buy manual transmissions in their vehicles only buy them in Black, Grey, or Silver. Argghh.


Probably research gained by polling just dealerships. Who would never ever lie about such things.

Probably simpler than that. More money for everyone by corralling people into higher optioned cars. Probably costs $10 to add the CC stalk/buttons on the production line, but you can mark it up 10x easily; easy money for all (save the consumer).

Heck, for all I know the base model is sold at at loss (relatively speaking, and moreso for the manufacturer), with the expectation of making money on the more upscale models. But you can advertise a lower price. Wouldn't want to sell too many base models then.

New car sales is all about convincing people to buy something they want, not so much about what they need.

 

[SteveSRT8]

^^^That last line is GOLDEN!!!

Of course it's all about driving sales into the profitable category. That can't surprise anyone.

But the uncontrollable nature of a manual shift is still a major headache for advanced vehicles with fancy suites of equipment controlling stability, braking, and other advanced features. This will eventually lead to their complete disappearance from our market.

I can't imagine looking at a new economy minded car without at least considering Mazda. Their unique focus on driving pleasure deserves more sales...

 

[Vikas]

A "stripped Accord LX"? I would love to hear about your definition of stripped model. I don't own an Accord or a Mazda but I am really curious as to the list of missing features from the Accord LX vs the Mazda 3.

 

[dareo]

She just needs a 4 door sedan that looks good to her. She drives a lot for work, school, army reserve, ect. MPG, reliability, cost, power, handling are all important. I drive it when we both go somewhere or on road trips so it must appeal to the car geek as well.

Any base model is fine unless they omit cruise control.

To Bladecutter:

By lightening i mean they did a lot of friction reducing and weight reducing things in the engine. There are many articles that explain it better than i, but it is theoretically possible that they could come at the expense of engine longevity. Won't really know till we see many cars over 100,000 miles.

The Mazda 3 must be at least an iSport to have cruise control, that starts at 19,240 with destination. Accord LX i would not call stripped down as it actually has really good equipment included, like the exotic cruise control! Plus alloy wheels, rear view camera, bluetooth. Its value is as strong as the 178whp dyno pulls its "earth dreams" engine produces. All for a TMV price of $21,418. Only thing we don't like is how everyone else will have one too, 300,000 Accords already sold this year.

Mazda's 6 far outshines the 3 in value terms as well. TMV $20,987 for the base model (it has cruise) I love that 3 but they have over priced it.

I want to study all possibilities, decide, wait 3 months, re confirm decision, then buy. New Car Waiting Period i call it.

Anybody on here have a Chev Cruze Eco MT sedan?

 

[nitehawk55]

Funny the Mazda gets so much attention . My local Ford dealer has 4 used Mazda 3's and one 6 on his lot so I stopped in to ask him why they were traded in.

Told me buyers are going to the Focus hatchback and the Fusion , he has trouble getting enough in stock !

Has Honda's , Nissans and a Subaru as well so it seems Ford is offering some pretty good cars .

 

[bustednutz]

Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Funny the Mazda gets so much attention . My local Ford dealer has 4 used Mazda 3's and one 6 on his lot so I stopped in to ask him why they were traded in.

Told me buyers are going to the Focus hatchback and the Fusion , he has trouble getting enough in stock !

Has Honda's , Nissans and a Subaru as well so it seems Ford is offering some pretty good cars .



And you actually believed a car salesman?

 

[Spazdog]

Originally Posted By: Bladecutter

Quote:
Why does it not have cruise control on the base model?


Chances are Mazda USA's flawed research on USA customer's buying habits has pointed that people who buy the base model version of a car in that price range are willing to live without features like cruise control in order to hit that low price point. It's the same flawed research model that told them that customers in the USA that buy manual transmissions in their vehicles only buy them in Black, Grey, or Silver. Argghh.


GM's research is flawed as well. The Cruze LS does not have cruise control
Ford's research is too. Focus S has no cruise control
Toyota Corolla L? Cruise Control is not availiable.
I think you can add on cruise control to the Jetta S. But by the time you add in all the parts and labor, you are getting close to Jetta SE price.

 

[nitehawk55]

Originally Posted By: bustednutz
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Funny the Mazda gets so much attention . My local Ford dealer has 4 used Mazda 3's and one 6 on his lot so I stopped in to ask him why they were traded in.

Told me buyers are going to the Focus hatchback and the Fusion , he has trouble getting enough in stock !

Has Honda's , Nissans and a Subaru as well so it seems Ford is offering some pretty good cars .



And you actually believed a car salesman?


I know the owner and have for over 40 years . I have no reason to state fabricated facts , I see what he gets in on trades all the time .

 

[Spazdog]

Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: bustednutz
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Funny the Mazda gets so much attention . My local Ford dealer has 4 used Mazda 3's and one 6 on his lot so I stopped in to ask him why they were traded in.

Told me buyers are going to the Focus hatchback and the Fusion , he has trouble getting enough in stock !

Has Honda's , Nissans and a Subaru as well so it seems Ford is offering some pretty good cars .



And you actually believed a car salesman?


I know the owner and have for over 40 years . I have no reason to state fabricated facts , I see what he gets in on trades all the time .

For years, if you wanted to get the "good" Ford Focus, (ie: the then current European model chassis) you got a Mazda3 (or a Volvo S40). Now you can get the global platform Focus.

No question that the current Focus hatchback is better styled than the leering grin of the previous model Mazda3. I doubt that anyone has already traded in a 2014 Mazda3 on a Focus.

 

[bustednutz]

Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: bustednutz
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Funny the Mazda gets so much attention . My local Ford dealer has 4 used Mazda 3's and one 6 on his lot so I stopped in to ask him why they were traded in.

Told me buyers are going to the Focus hatchback and the Fusion , he has trouble getting enough in stock !

Has Honda's , Nissans and a Subaru as well so it seems Ford is offering some pretty good cars .



And you actually believed a car salesman?


I know the owner and have for over 40 years . I have no reason to state fabricated facts , I see what he gets in on trades all the time .



An astute Used Car Manager goes to auto auctions and will seek out what the hot selling vehicles are and bid on them with the hopes of winning. MANY vehicles on used car lots are not trade ins. A serious chunk of them come from auctions. They only want the top selling cars on their lot. Thats how they make money. Not by selling strictly Fords.
Regardless of how long you've known this guy, they don't go out of "salemanship" mode. Been in the biz myself for over 40 years. Know the game. If their lips are moving.....they're lying. Goes for both the customer and the sales staff.

 

[nitehawk55]

Originally Posted By: bustednutz
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: bustednutz
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Funny the Mazda gets so much attention . My local Ford dealer has 4 used Mazda 3's and one 6 on his lot so I stopped in to ask him why they were traded in.

Told me buyers are going to the Focus hatchback and the Fusion , he has trouble getting enough in stock !

Has Honda's , Nissans and a Subaru as well so it seems Ford is offering some pretty good cars .



And you actually believed a car salesman?


I know the owner and have for over 40 years . I have no reason to state fabricated facts , I see what he gets in on trades all the time .



An astute Used Car Manager goes to auto auctions and will seek out what the hot selling vehicles are and bid on them with the hopes of winning. MANY vehicles on used car lots are not trade ins. A serious chunk of them come from auctions. They only want the top selling cars on their lot. Thats how they make money. Not by selling strictly Fords.
Regardless of how long you've known this guy, they don't go out of "salemanship" mode. Been in the biz myself for over 40 years. Know the game. If their lips are moving.....they're lying. Goes for both the customer and the sales staff.


Listen , it's a family run dealership and I know them very well . They have enough trade ins that they NEVER have to buy used cars in fact they wholesale off quite a few of their used because there turnover is so big , they run a very successful business and there service is stellar . They have repeat customers and new ones come from miles away because they are well respected .

Don't lay down unknown facts about my friends in a blanket statement , you don't know these people or how they run their business....I do !

If you have problems with the integrity of dealerships/car salesmen/Ford products...whatever , go cry somewhere else .

 

[nitehawk55]

Originally Posted By: Spazdog
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: bustednutz
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Funny the Mazda gets so much attention . My local Ford dealer has 4 used Mazda 3's and one 6 on his lot so I stopped in to ask him why they were traded in.

Told me buyers are going to the Focus hatchback and the Fusion , he has trouble getting enough in stock !

Has Honda's , Nissans and a Subaru as well so it seems Ford is offering some pretty good cars .



And you actually believed a car salesman?


I know the owner and have for over 40 years . I have no reason to state fabricated facts , I see what he gets in on trades all the time .

For years, if you wanted to get the "good" Ford Focus, (ie: the then current European model chassis) you got a Mazda3 (or a Volvo S40). Now you can get the global platform Focus.

No question that the current Focus hatchback is better styled than the leering grin of the previous model Mazda3. I doubt that anyone has already traded in a 2014 Mazda3 on a Focus.


Where did I say they were 2014's ? , they are 2-4 years old I expect .

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: dareo

I want to study all possibilities, decide, wait 3 months, re confirm decision, then buy. New Car Waiting Period i call it.


I would add an extended test drive to your regimen. I like a minimum of a 3 day period to make sure you really like the car.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: nitehawk55

Don't lay down unknown facts about my friends in a blanket statement , you don't know these people or how they run their business....I do !

If you have problems with the integrity of dealerships/car salesmen/Ford products...whatever , go cry somewhere else .


Even the most jaded fanboy would admit that there are VERY FEW of these types of folks in the car biz!!!

 

[badtlc]

The lack of cruise control is actually GOOD research results. The manufacturers know full well that CC is a deal breaker for many people. They don't include it on a base model because they know that one feature alone is enough for people to jump up to the next model. Most people buy cars they want with the features they want, not necessarily the best features/price.

 

[k24a4]

Would be interested in a review if you and your wife test drive the Accord Sport MT and Mazda 6 MT back to back.

 

[glock19]

Originally Posted By: badtlc
The lack of cruise control is actually GOOD research results. The manufacturers know full well that CC is a deal breaker for many people. They don't include it on a base model because they know that one feature alone is enough for people to jump up to the next model. Most people buy cars they want with the features they want, not necessarily the best features/price.


Good observation, I never thought about it that way. I know personally all I would need for a commuter car is AC, heat, a radio, and cruise control. If they offered that in a base model care for 12K I would buy it. However, if any of those 4 are missing I'm jumping up the model spec until I get there.

 

[KrisZ]

I don't know about the new Mazda 3, but there is a thread on Mazda 3 forums somewhere about a guy, with a first gen MZ3, buying the whole steering wheel from some wreckers yard, that had the cruise control buttons and installing it in place of his old steering wheel. After that he had cruise control on his base model MZ3.

I would imagine that a lot of other makes would be similar as even the base model cars come pre-wired for all other options, even if they don't have them. Probably just the buttons would do it and not the whole steering wheel.

So, if a base model is all you need and you don't want to spend money on the next trim just to have cruise control, it's not a bad option to DIY. Of course you would have to wait a bit to find a suitable donor.

 

[MCompact]

On the early 2007 Mazdaspeed 3 it was possible to activate the trip computer on the Sport trim level(the computer only came in Grand Touring trim).
On the other hand, over on one of the Fiesta ST forums, one hapless soul has a new ST that lacks the standard ESC defeat button. His idiot dealer told him that the button only came on automatic STs- which don't exist...