0W20 Oil Choice Considerations ?

[yowps3]

0w20 must be an American thing.
Here in Australia it's an uncommon viscosity and the Corollas here recommend 5w30.

But i wouldn't hesitate to run thin viscosities oils as vehicles designed to run them have narrow oil passages which naturally should boost the pressure and stout oil cooling systems which keep the oil cool.

My friends Infiniti Q60 TTV6 that recomends 0w20 keeps the oil at 160F and it takes forever to reach that temperature.
Where as my Kia Stinger TTV6 that recommends 5w30/5w40 runs the oil at 212F and it takes just 10 minutes of driving to reach operating oil temp.

 

[Shel_B]

Actually it’s not I’ve taken an engine down to the block compared to the old ones they are definitely smaller.

Are you describing the A-25 engine?

 

[ChrisD46]

0w20 must be an American thing.
Here in Australia it's an uncommon viscosity and the Corollas here recommend 5w30.

But i wouldn't hesitate to run thin viscosities oils as vehicles designed to run them have narrow oil passages which naturally should boost the pressure and stout oil cooling systems which keep the oil cool.

My friends Infiniti Q60 TTV6 that recommends 0w20 keeps the oil at 160F and it takes forever to reach that temperature.
Where as my Kia Stinger TTV6 that recommends 5w30/5w40 runs the oil at 212F and it takes just 10 minutes of driving to reach operating oil temp.

*Good reply - very helpful to see what countries like Oz represent for same vehicle oil . Even in my Hyundai Sonata the OM mentions going up a grade of oil for higher temps (summer her in the USA) , for towing or extended high speed driving is desirable . Not sure if the Toyota Corolla OM mentions similar - however US Pennzoil Platinum 5W30 is a "thin" 30 weight oil (cSt 9.8) so it might be able to be used in the heat of US summer without doing damage to the Corolla engine ... My goal is to put this Corolla into the 200K mile club with the best oil choice I can buy off of the shelf locally .

 

[AutoMechanic]

Are you describing the A-25 engine?

Haha

 

[ARCOgraphite]

*Good reply - very helpful to see what countries like Oz represent for same vehicle oil . Even in my Hyundai Sonata the OM mentions going up a grade of oil for higher temps (summer her in the USA) , for towing or extended high speed driving is desirable . Not sure if the Toyota Corolla OM mentions similar - however US Pennzoil Platinum 5W30 is a "thin" 30 weight oil (cSt 9.8) so it might be able to be used in the heat of US summer without doing damage to the Corolla engine ... My goal is to put this Corolla into the 200K mile club with the best oil choice I can buy off of the shelf locally .

Tried most 0w20 and 5W20 in the Subaru FB2.5 and 2.0. The Crosstrek, surprisingly, likes a very thin 0W20, so the Idemitsu Subaru Professional Use oil fit the bill. I have multiple UOA posted for a "2017 Subaru Crosstrek" that show much less wear metal in solution/suspension than the universal ave and this is with the OCI extended by 50-60% to ~9K miles.
I also ran Valvoline Advanced 0W20 with a top off of Magnatec 5W20. The Valvoline ran a bit sticky in the Subaru until a little Maggie went in on top, then the engine ran super smooth. Just a Casual - though professional - observation

There is no need for 0W20 in GA. A 5W20 would do fine, esp on a flat-plane crank engine. The Valvoline Advanced that you run in your Hyundai is an excellent 5w30 formulation - best out there IMHO on the Walmart shelves.; but formulations are changing.

Synthetics are not synthetic so there is no " Synthetic vs Conventional" argument to be made on PCMO anymore.

As far as Europe and Asia and So America vs. NO. America, the ECU programming on VVTi engine will vary with the
oil choice ( KV100) and in open loop where the cams can Advance and Retard many degrees, there is no precise hydraulic control other than the anticipate KV 100 viscosity range.
More viscous oil = higher line/drill pressures will equal more intake cam retard at any given rpm which will push the VE upwards in RPM possibly out of operating range and make the engine feel sluggish and have deleterious and cascading effect on other control systems like ECAT programming, EGR (if external), emission and heat loading, K sense, etc. In other words you don't want to go there on your DD except in special circumstances like High RPM ( 4500+) high load running ( Read "fast and furious" adventures)

I would just break the thing in with Motorcraft 5W20 or QS green bottle the first OCI after the FF
Absolutely no need for the best stuff to be employed right off the bat during wear in;
and keep that FF in there for ~3K miles/6mo. !

- Ken

 

[ka9mnx]

There is no need for 0W20 in GA

As far as Europe and Asia and So America vs. NO. America, the ECU programming on VVTi engine will vary with the
oil choice ( KV100) and in open loop where the cams can Advance...

Agree with most everything you said but there is no reason you cannot use 0w-20 in Georgia.

Also, don't you mean closed loop?

 

[blufeb95]

There is no need for 0W20 in GA. A 5W20 would do fine, esp on a flat-plane crank engine. The Valvoline Advanced that you run in your Hyundai is an excellent 5w30 formulation - best out there IMHO on the Walmart shelves.; but formulations are changing.

Synthetics are not synthetic so there is no " Synthetic vs Conventional" argument to be made on PCMO anymore.

- Ken

I beg to differ, especially for 0w20, at least in Mobil1's case the base Mobil1 uses mostly GTL for the base oil and EP uses mostly PAO, even in the same product lines 5w20 may be made mostly from hydrocracked crude while the 0w20 is "full synthetic," so I'm not sure that 5w20 is necessarily definitely a better oil than 0w20 since the 0w20s seem to use better base oils than their 5w20 counterparts.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

I beg to differ, especially for 0w20, at least in Mobil1's case the base Mobil1 uses mostly GTL for the base oil and EP uses mostly PAO, even in the same product lines 5w20 may be made mostly from hydrocracked crude while the 0w20 is "full synthetic," so I'm not sure that 5w20 is necessarily definitely a better oil than 0w20 since the 0w20s seem to use better base oils than their 5w20 counterparts.

Yes this has been discussed - though with GTL availability I wouldn't trust the old Korean SDS anymore.
And majority PAO give you good power, clean piston ring land, longer OC interval possibilities - but not necessarily better service life.

I have used EP in the Wife's car but it was not appreciated there. - Then there is the "Subaru hate M1 formulations" talk.

 

[kschachn]

Probably because it could be warmer but I would not chance it. I know we had a customer blow an engine up in one using 20W-50 so I don’t trust anything but 20 in these.

Unless the winter rating was inappropriate for the starting conditions then the 50-grade oil did not “blow” the engine. Plain and simple.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Agree with most everything you said but there is no reason you cannot use 0w-20 in Georgia.

Also, don't you mean closed loop?

Yes sir! Good catch!

I'm Still waking up !

AFA 0W20 v. 5W20 I would Pick the best oil regardless of Winter number- though that may take trial and error

5W20 seem to be push right up to the 30 grade SAE KV100 margin - esp compared to Asian formulations.

 

[AutoMechanic]

Unless the winter rating was inappropriate for the starting conditions then the 50-grade oil did not “blow” the engine. Plain and simple.

It was the only thing that could have. Just like one certain brand did on one of my other customers cars. The oil ports were too small for a 50 weight.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Unless the winter rating was inappropriate for the starting conditions then the 50-grade oil did not “blow” the engine. Plain and simple.

It was the only thing that could have. Just like one certain brand did on one of my other customers cars. The oil ports were too small for a 50 weight.

Not unless it was real cold. 5W20 is thick as honey in the cold.

How cold was it when she blew?

And why in tarnation did somebody put a "fitty" in her ?
_____________________________

I almost blew a Fiat engine with a 20W50 when the temp took a dive below 15F one afternoon.

I was dumb kid running a "racy" Castrol 20W50 That engine knocked for a good 10 seconds before she got lube.

 

[AutoMechanic]

Not unless it was real cold. 5W20 is thick as honey in the cold.

How cold was it when she blew?

And why in tarnation did somebody put a "fitty" in her ?
_____________________________

I almost blew a Fiat engine with a 20W50 when the temp took a dive below 15F one afternoon.

I was dumb kid running a "racy" Castrol 20W50 That engine knocked for a good 10 seconds before she got lube.

It was about 21 or 22 degrees out it was the middle of December it came in on a wrecker the families son had changed it with the 20W-50 oil. The car was 2 years old at the time 2017 Camry in December 2019. They were furious the oil had damaged it but I was assigned the job of putting an engine in and me and the rest of the tech’s investigated and determined the oil was the cause because it was too thick for those conditions.

 

[kschachn]

It was about 21 or 22 degrees out it was the middle of December it came in on a wrecker the families son had changed it with the 20W-50 oil. The car was 2 years old at the time 2017 Camry in December 2019. They were furious the oil had damaged it but I was assigned the job of putting an engine in and me and the rest of the tech’s investigated and determined the oil was the cause because it was too thick for those conditions.

Those temperatures are acceptable for an oil with a 20W winter rating. Again it wasn't the oil despite everyone's assumption it was.

 

[AutoMechanic]

Those temperatures are acceptable for an oil with a 20W winter rating. Again it wasn't the oil despite everyone's assumption it was.

View attachment 49161

Then what could it have been then? The piston come through the oil pan because of lack of lubrication.

 

[PimTac]

I don’t understand the thinking that a 20w50 will be better than a 0w20 that is specified for a car.

The owners made a expensive mistake.

 

[kschachn]

Then what could it have been then? The piston come through the oil pan because of lack of lubrication.

Who knows, that was the mechanic's duty to diagnose.

 

[kschachn]

I don’t understand the thinking that a 20w50 will be better than a 0w20 that is specified for a car.

The owners made a expensive mistake.

It wasn't the oil.

The thinking was not that it was necessarily better but not that it was unacceptable.

 

[PimTac]

It wasn't the oil.

The thinking was not that it was necessarily better but not that it was unacceptable.

I’ve seen and heard of people moving up a grade but this was way beyond that.

I am old fashioned. If the engine is running quiet and smooth then I am satisfied. As the Mazda is my first engine to run 0w20 I have stick with that and I find it to be quiet and smooth. So I don’t see the need to change anything.

Older car engines that tended to burn oil later in life improved somewhat with a jump in grade but leapfrogging to a 20w50 is extreme. Generally, moving from a 30 to a 40 grade was enough. The best solution of course was to get the engine fixed. I am speaking of the old V8s.

 

[Jackson_Slugger]

The small oil ports on 0w-20 engines is BS.

Sometimes yes and sometimes no. The older 1.8L Toyota engines were known to coke up and had insufficient pin holes for draining causing excessive burning. User thicker oils only exacerbated the problem. My nephew's Celica was a prime example where 10W-40 PGB burned more than any 5W-20...