I drive slowly right away because I don't want to waste gas and a warm engine with the rest of the car being cold seems like a good way to do damage. However, I'm not sure what the reference to stripping away the oil means. If an engine can run safely when cold, what difference does it make TO THE ENGINE, NOT THE REST OF THE CAR if the car is sitting or moving?
Yes, warming up your car before driving in cold weather can damage the engine
- Thread starter BlueOvalFitter
- Start date
Real world data (wife) who does this in winter with her only 3 vehicles in life happened to bought new run to 150k(96 Civic), 240k(2005 Subaru Legacy turbo wagon) and currently at 125k(18 VW Tiguan). No problems!
On my truck it takes a half hour idling to get to temp or 10 minutes “driving “
It also adds +1000rpms onto shift points and is loath to shift into 3 and won’t enter 4 at all until it’s well past normal operating temp in very cold weather .
As such I do let it warm and idle while I’m clearing ice and snow but just drive, the first couple minutes I take it slow but the truck wants to race rpms no matter what so it’s sort of futile
Been like that as long as I’ve owned it, stupid design, why I miss having a manual transmission truck, get double to triple the fuel economy in cold weather
With carburated vehicles, I'd let them warm up for up to 15-20 minutes in real cold weather, because they seemed to stall easier if they weren't. Newer vehicles, maybe for a few minutes while I get everything else adjusted for comfort. I've always figured it was worse for the tranny fluid to run cold, than it was for the engine oil.
I think what they're saying is that when left to idle comparatively more fuel will wash down the cylinder walls vs driving off. There used to be some experiments which showed how quickly heat moves through an engine bloc on cold start. I don't know if this is valid today.
Last edited:
I lived in the Midwest for 38 Winters. I dealt with below zero temperatures every year. It's not a big deal. If you are that worried about it, you can install a block and oil pan heater.
If you don't, can't, or won't, you allow time for the oil to reach the top end after starting, then drive slowly, until the engine builds up some heat and begins to thin out the fluids. It's going to do that a lot faster by being driven under load, than it will by sitting and idling.
And even if you do, you're still going to have more problems with leaks and such, than that same vehicle will that is being driven in milder temperatures.
It all comes with the territory when you are forced to operate a vehicle in Artic like temperatures. It doesn't automatically mean the pistons are going to start swapping holes.
I could see that with some forty year old carburated car. Would think now that the engine would be under almost the same load whether idleing or moving slowly.
What exactly are you going to consider? Your wheel bearings are going to be driven COLD when you drive in a COLD climate. There is nothing you can do about it. Friction and dissipating brake heat will warm them slightly, but you have to drive the vehicle for that to happen.
Driving over potholes and railroad tracks in sub zero weather is going to cause shock absorbers to leak, because the seals are hard and brittle. And the fluid inside them is thick. There is no way to warm them up either.
The transmission, engine, along with everything else will warm up faster if the vehicle is being driven, not sitting and idling. Start the engine, wait for sufficient oil pressure, (2 or 3 minutes), and get underway slowly.
In below zero Winter temperatures you are going to have more leaks, period. Radiators, water pumps, heater cores, thermostat housings, etc. Having an engine constantly going from below zero, to over the boiling point, then back down to a block of ice several times a day, is going to cause constant thermal expansion and contraction. That will generate more leaks over time, than a car that resides in a constant warm or hot climate.
And to frost the cake and light the candles, you are most likely going to be dealing with road salt that is going to corrode and rust your car, regardless of how you baby it in cold weather.
Years of driving in Midwest Winters proved to me, that regardless of what you do, your vehicle is going to have a limited life, when compared to one being driven in a hot and dry climate. The only solution is to move. Ask me how I know.
Start, seat belt, turn radio on, off we go.
In Toyota I had to install block heater as that thing in these temperatures would be ice box for 20min.
In Toyota I had to install block heater as that thing in these temperatures would be ice box for 20min.
I suppose the wheel bearings will only warm up while driving, but consider that the transmission has cooling lines that route through the radiator and thereby when an engine is warmed then the warm coolant will begin to warm the transmission.
But, more importantly please refer to post #82 which goes beyond the scope of just warming the engine.
And FWIW, I've been driving in the midwest winters for 41 years so, yes I do know by experience about how to drive in adverse road conditions.
The coldest I ever drove a car was -54C in Winnipeg, MB. When I picked up my rental car, a Dodge Caravan, I asked if it had a block heater, and she told me no, and I wouldn't need one. That concerned me.
The first morning, I went to start it, and it fired up after a few concerning slow cranks and the dash came up with a "too cold to operate" warning. That van ran for 30 minutes and the temp gauge never raised. It drove it another 10 minutes to the office, and had to crack a window due to frost formation inside the van. Same thing the next day, but I did use it to help jump another car with a dead battery and left the doors open to dry it out while doing that.
I fire up my cars and they only idle long enough for me to close the manual garage door, or scrape the windows if outside. Then I put it in drive and go. We don't have carburetors anymore, and my cars warm up quick enough that defrost keeps up just fine.
The first morning, I went to start it, and it fired up after a few concerning slow cranks and the dash came up with a "too cold to operate" warning. That van ran for 30 minutes and the temp gauge never raised. It drove it another 10 minutes to the office, and had to crack a window due to frost formation inside the van. Same thing the next day, but I did use it to help jump another car with a dead battery and left the doors open to dry it out while doing that.
I fire up my cars and they only idle long enough for me to close the manual garage door, or scrape the windows if outside. Then I put it in drive and go. We don't have carburetors anymore, and my cars warm up quick enough that defrost keeps up just fine.
Vehicles equipped with Air Fuel Ratio sensor(s) (wideband) only take a few seconds to go into closed loop.
Article says:
"Smart Motors Toyota says letting your car idle in cold temperatures can shorten the life of your engine by stripping away oil from the engine’s pistons and cylinders — two critical components that help your engine run, Stephen Ciatti, Ph.D., principal engineer for battery systems at PACCAR, told Business Insider in 2016."
That's about the dumbest thing I've read in awhile.
"Smart Motors Toyota says letting your car idle in cold temperatures can shorten the life of your engine by stripping away oil from the engine’s pistons and cylinders — two critical components that help your engine run, Stephen Ciatti, Ph.D., principal engineer for battery systems at PACCAR, told Business Insider in 2016."
That's about the dumbest thing I've read in awhile.
Parked in garage or outside in 10º F temperature with snow and ice ?
Maybe he should stick to battery systems.
This is the whole reason that I have RES.
Garage. But in mountains, outside.
If in mountains I clean vehicle, start it, radio, seat warmers, HVAC ALWAYS on cold, and off we go.
I started cars in the mountains at -42-43. Once engine starts, and pressure is there, there is no need to wait. Vehicle will warm up much faster if driven easily.
Only exception was Toyota I had. I would start that for 10min before driven if in mountains and I did not have access to outlet for block heater. I always carried in that car 50ft cable so I can hook up. That thing was so slow to warm up that it is crime.
My two other cars are super fast to provide heat. Best one was BMW X5 35d I had. It had PTC heater. You start car, heat is there immediately. Really miss that car in the winter.
Last edited:
You are right on about the wife statement one advantage would be that the car would be warm as you started your trip to the hospitalYep, but try telling that to the wife.
"You will have to drive in a cold car for 120 seconds before the heater starts blowing and the seats warm up, so we can get an extra 500 miles out of this car"
Let me know how that works out
'Extra wear' - I have no doubt.
Enough extra wear to make a measurable difference over the life of the car? Not so sure. Maybe if it was a chronic warmer upper that let the car run 30 min at idle every single day.
700k?
Egad! Someone should create an oil capable of protecting these engines at colder temperatures. Maybe that oil could have like, you know, multiple viscosities. So it could flow better when it is cold but also protect the engine while at operating temperature. It would probably be good idea to designate these multiple viscosity oils so we know what they are. Possibly with a “w” for winter or something like that… I don’t know, I’m just spilt balling ideas here.
Similar threads
