Would you use a FRAM filter if they were free?

[Auto-Union]

I have a Fram TG on with GC in my new RSX.

Good filtration
Silicone ADBV
Screen-over BPV
Five bucks

http://www.fram.com/products/oilFilters.php

 

[DINO_NO]

I just threw in a fram TG

 

[Blue_Goose]

In lookng at filters for the 2.2 Ecotec (cartridge type) I would use a Fram any day over the Purolater...what and awful looking put together excuse for a filter (Purolator which shocked me)

The Fram, Supertech and STP filter catridge all look like they are the exact seem thing made in the same shop in Bulgaria...price the only difference.



Goose

 

[Trucku]

I would. Never had an issue with one of them. I know the construction is cardboard and glue, but lots of things are.
I went to bike show and most of them had Fram filters on them.

 

[Pete C.]

Who came up with the CARDBOARD theory. They are in fact phenolic impregnated celullose fibers.

 

[MADMIKE]

Are "phenolic impregnated cellulose fiber" endcaps up to the task, especially for longer drain intervals? (say 6 months/12,000 miles) Are metal endcaps more durable and less likely to fail? Fram is the only filter not using metal endcaps--why?

 

[Cooper]

No, I would not use Fram filters even if they were free. What does an oil filter cost? $3-5 dollars unless you are buying Amsoil, Mobil 1, or K & N? I don't think that the average DIY would use a Fram Oil Filter if they new what they were made of. I know that my vehicle is worth more to me than that. Lets say that you put a $3 dollar filter on your car, change your oil every six months, you are only spending $0.50 a month, or aprox. 2 cents a day. Does anyone not have an extra 2 cents a day?

 

[wgtoys]

Sure I would. They flow well and filter well, at least in the few actual tests of filtration and flow I have been able to find. Yes, the construction is rather ugly and I don't generally buy Fram oil filters, but they are not the can of death many like to call them.

 

[wgtoys]

"Fram is the only filter not using metal endcaps--why? "

False. Champion Labs' ecore design uses a fabric endcap (Supertech, STP, etc.). Denso filters don't use any endcap at all. By volume sold there are probably more non-metal oil filters sold in the US than there are metal ones. Fram + Champion + Denso (Toyota, etc.) = a huge volume!

 

[Pete C.]

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Are "phenolic impregnated cellulose fiber" endcaps up to the task, especially for longer drain intervals? (say 6 months/12,000 miles) Are metal endcaps more durable and less likely to fail? Fram is the only filter not using metal endcaps--why?

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Yep they'll last for 12k miles. Are metal endcaps are more durable? Does it really matter NO. What does matter is the media adhesion to the endcap so that there is no bypass path. Why does Fram use this type of endcap? Because they can.

 

[MADMIKE]

Thanks Pete! I may use a Fram now! Was always afraid that the non-metallic and caps would weaken over time and possibly warp, begin to disintegrate and/or separate from the pleated paper medium in an extended OCI. Was never afraid that the media itself was any less durable than other common brands, it was the end cap material that I thought was the weak link.

 

[wantin150]

Never did "extended" OCI's with my 1993 Corolla but I used a FRAM PH4967 and Castrol Syntec 5w30 every 3k (and then every 5k somewhere in there) all the way out to 176,000 miles before I sold her. She is still on the road and has over 230,000 on her now.

I wouldn't use one now though for my new cars for a full length OCI. Doesn't mean they're bad, just not for me. If you gave me some, I would consider it for certain OCI's as in rinse or flush or whatever.

 

[farrarfan1]

Pete C. and Bob himself endorsing Fram's while all the self taught "experts" wouldn't be caught dead with them. Amazing. Simply amazing.

 

[Pete C.]

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Pete C. and Bob himself endorsing Fram's while all the self taught "experts" wouldn't be caught dead with them. Amazing. Simply amazing.

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Not really endorsing Fram, just trying to cut through the rhetoric and #@$%! that is flying around.

Considering my employer, that's 'nuff said for now.

 

[Virtuoso]

I don't use Fram anymore, but I find it relatively amusing how many people bash the 'cardboard' endcaps.

Now, I'm not saying we don't have a reason to do so. They are half the reason I don't use them anymore. But when making a comparison between Fram and other filters, it's often brought up that the others use metal endcaps. This is thought to be a weakness and point of failure.

But the filter medium isn't metal and it holds up just fine, so why are we bickering over an endcap that's probably still tougher than the media?

Just a thought

 

[unDummy]

If it was free, sure I'd use it. Who is giving them away?

My issue with the 'ph' filter is that they ALWAYS rewarded my engines with the cold start noise every morning. Most other filters required 3-5 days to make the same noise. I guess ADBV performance is lacking. Whether a few seconds of morning clatter will reduce the life of the engine is for you to debate. I just don't care to hear it.

Engines do enough of a job cluttering up oil. Particle counts will show that even if a filterless UOA looks good. For really short OCI's, then a filter may not really be necessary. But, who changes their oil weekly? Most OEM's are pushing longer and longer OCI's where better filtration can only help.

BPV, if working, is there to make sure oil flow is acceptable. My personal experience is that an overly restrictive filter can cause noise. Whether that noise translates into more wear is also unknown. The TG and competitor Pureone seem to be common culprits.

My other issue with Fram is, do we really need PTFE, TRT/HM and other silly marketing?

 

[farrarfan1]

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Pete C. and Bob himself endorsing Fram's while all the self taught "experts" wouldn't be caught dead with them. Amazing. Simply amazing.

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Not really endorsing Fram, just trying to cut through the rhetoric and #@$%! that is flying around.

Considering my employer, that's 'nuff said for now.

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Endorsing was a poor choice of word on my part. Your explanation is what I was trying to say, just didn't come out the way I meant.Because of your contribution's here I've become a Wix user.

 

[wgtoys]

Interestingly enough, metal is hard to glue to as compared to any paper type stuff. It is possible that the Fram design might be more secure than some of the paper to metal end cap bonds of other makers. The inside of an oil filter is a harsh environment for an adhesive.

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:

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Interestingly enough, metal is hard to glue to as compared to any paper type stuff. It is possible that the Fram design might be more secure than some of the paper to metal end cap bonds of other makers. The inside of an oil filter is a harsh environment for an adhesive.

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I tend to agree that the cardboard would be easier to bond to than a metal ..but we're faced with the majority of the filter manufacturers opting not to go this route. Why is that? I'll speculate that although it may require the use of different or more adhesive to form the bond to metal, that the features/characteristics of a cardboard endcap offer too much compromise in the performance and/or integrity of the filter for their standards of either durability or reliability.

There has to be a reason that all of the major filter manufacturers don't adopt this cost saving technique if it has no discounting in performance. Donaldson doesn't do it. Wix doesn't do it. Purolator doesn't do it. Champion doesn't do it. This is limited, to my knowledge, only to Fram.

There's one foreign filter manufacturer who uses some molded polymer end cap that's molded/injected/formed with the media embedded in it. This is pretty advanced ...and Champion's Ecore, with few incidences of issues, appears to function fine with its unique process/technique.

The main objection to Fram, aside from the typically lame ADBV and mediocre filtration performance, is that there's no reason to pay for NASCAR/NHRA/etc. ad campaign budgets for the cheapest made filter on the market ..when the same money can buy one that is of far better construction and reliability. The cost of a filter is probably well under a buck ..yet Fram is relatively expensive in its quest to shave another dime/quarter in costs with cheap innards.

 

[MADMIKE]

I've also noticed that Fram, Purolator and Wix appear to use a similar if not the same black colored adhesive to bond the pleated medium to the end caps, while Champion uses an almost clear, yellowish/brown adhesive (and it's often sloppily applied I might add)--Pete C.---do you know if one is better than the other or has significantly different properties for durability?