Why does Honda recommed one filter for two OCI's?

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actually the real answer is to limit the dry starts.. I have been doing this since the 80's after the second change on a new engine.
I do not do that if the mileage exceeds 8000 miles
 
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Originally Posted By: bubbatime


WOW, that car is old!!


no, I don't own that car anymore.

yes, I still have that genuine, Jpn printed (in English) factory service manual.

Q.
 
Originally Posted By: randomhero439
Interesting...

My Accord V6
Normal: Oil @ 7500, filter @ 15000
Severe: Oil @ 3750, filter @ 3750

My Civic:
Normal: Oil @ 10000, filter @ 20000
Severe: Oil @ 5000, filter @ 10000

Thoughts?


That's mighty fine.

As a matter of fact: with my 07 fit running HAMP oil filter (yes, Toyo Roki ones made in Jpn), and just ordinary PYB 5W20, I typically do 2 OCIs before replacing my HAMP oil filter.

As for my wifey's camry: I do the same with WM supatech oil filters too, typically 5k on Qstate green or PYB 5W30 twice before replacing the oil filter once.

wifey's camry has passed 168k recently....and still going strong.

Q.
 
Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
actually the real answer is to limit the dry starts.



Most likely not. If dry starts were such an issue, all manu's would have filters oriented so that they could be nearly 100% pre-filled during the oil change, with specific directions/cautions in the owners/shop manual on how to pre-fill the filter.
 
The OCI and FCI for normal and severe conditions of various engines are recommended by manufactures based on extensive tests.

Manufactures spent millions dollars in testing various aspects of an engine before it is installed in production vehicles.

If you think your driving condition is not quite normal and it isn't severe, then modify the recommend OCI and FCI to suit your condition.
 
Originally Posted By: atoalson
So why does Honda recommend one filter for two OCI's?


Because data shows that engines run clean enough to warrant the use of a filter for that interval, and still sustain a safe operating margin.

The FCI would be predicated on a filter that meets/exceeds the OEM design criteria.


It's just that simple.
 
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Noise on the first startup after changing the filter doesnt mean anything unless you can prove it somehow results in damage to the engine........

True that. And if it's 'really' that important for whatever reason, why is the filter changed eached time at the Honda stealer despite the OM/MM rec. Same as the unproven opinion that oil filter flow is anything other than an insignificant consideration in pc use.

And what was done by GM 40 years ago means nothing in this discussion. Afaik, GM now recommends a filter every oci. So apparently as far as GM (and Ford and the majority of vehicle manufacturers) is concerned, what's old is still old.

Honda also recommends an owners manual initial automatic transmission fluid change at 120k miles or 6 years and 90k or 5 years thereafter on 3.0L V6's. They also have the V6 transmission filter as a non service/maintenance part.
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How many knowledgeable Honda owners follow those brilliant enlightened Honda AT maintenance recommendations? But Honda says it in black and white though so it must be so.
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As I said in my first post here lots of speculation, but no proof. But using the Honda AT maintenance recommendations as a prime example, lower cost of ownership is no less valid imo than any of the other unproven opinions presented.
 
Another interesting car
Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution
Normal: Oil @ 3k, filter @ 9k
Severe: Oil @ 3k, filter @ 6k

I believe the 3k OCI is because of the power dense 4-cylinder. This prevents any major shearing from the heat and fuel.
 
I have read all of these replies and all I see is speculation, guessing, or "because" answers. I did not see one answer from a Honda engineer or any other Honda engine designer as to why they recommend multiple OCIs on 1 filter.
But, keep the comments coming. They are very amusing to read.
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Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
I did not see one answer from a Honda engineer or any other Honda engine designer as to why they recommend multiple OCIs on 1 filter.


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... I think they have better things to do than hang out at BITOG.
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Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
I did not see one answer from a Honda engineer or any other Honda engine designer as to why they recommend multiple OCIs on 1 filter.


lol.gif
... I think they have better things to do than hang out at BITOG.
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True. But it sure would clear up the air. Maybe someone with some pull around here can conjure up a Honda engineer for a definitive answer.
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Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
True. But it sure would clear up the air. Maybe someone with some pull around here can conjure up a Honda engineer for a definitive answer.

Heck, you realize their practice could date from so long ago no one remembers any longer? I've seen Honda and Yamaha manuals from well over 30 years ago that say the same thing.
 
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
True. But it sure would clear up the air. Maybe someone with some pull around here can conjure up a Honda engineer for a definitive answer.

Heck, you realize their practice could date from so long ago no one remembers any longer? I've seen Honda and Yamaha manuals from well over 30 years ago that say the same thing.

Yet again, why? The engineers had to have a reason as to why, but all I see is speculation and yimmer-yammer replies.
We can get the most common reply, "because the manufacturer says so," but how many aftermarket parts are out there that exceed the OEM?
 
This is normal on heavy equipment and marine diesels. Filters are changed based on hours or restriction for fuel and air. The oil change interval may not be the same as the filter/s.

Porsche does this as well, the filter is only changed every other oil change.
 
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Yet again, why?

That was my point - it started so long ago no one remembers why.
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Ah, so it's like a "grandfathered" in thing?
 
I would like to think "no," but it's certainly possible. Look at how some of the wording in manuals has remained the same or been only edited piecemeal over the years. My G's manual makes all kinds of phantom references to higher and lower viscosity according to weather and driving conditions, yet explicitly requires only 5w-30 in SM/GF-4 or better. Looking at older manuals, all they did was change a word or two, delete the temperature chart, and update the API/ILSAC specification lettering.

So, it's quite conceivable that if Honda has been recommending one filter for two OCIs for a few decades and they haven't had any warranty issues due to that, there's no reason to change. Of course, that doesn't explain the original reason for one filter for two changes, either. For that, we're likely speculating. The original engineers are likely long retired and probably dead and there may be no records relating to it, unless engineers happened to pass some story down the years.
 
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