Why Do Knowledgeable Folks on Here use 20 wt Oil

[millerbl00]

Some timing chain tensioners and VTEC solenoids and other engine components require 20w to work properly.

 

[CKN]

What's that oil temperature hitting on those hill climbs?
They recommend 0w-20 because they know around 90% of new truck buyers aren't going to run their truck any harder than getting a few bags of potting soil from the hardware store.
Does the manual say that or does the oil cap say to use 0w-20?
I would be one egg that if you find the part of the manual about towing a 5,000lb travel trailer up a mountain in the summer at interstate speed it wouldn't be telling you to use a 20 weight.
Maybe the 5.3L engines have a really amazing oil cooler and the oil never gets above 220f. But I doubt it.

There are many of us that use trucks for "truck stuff". There are plenty of these things in fleets, city, state, and federal uses that are actually used as trucks.
I had the transmission temperature brought up on my DIC (on that Colorado trip)-it never went past 170 degrees.
Wasn't concerned about the engine oil temps-so I can't answer your question.
Never got a message to "pull over-your hot" or whatever it is.
I know the message can come up if for some reason you are over heating.

 

[OVERKILL]

Some timing chain tensioners and VTEC solenoids and other engine components require 20w to work properly.

So they all fail catastrophically in Winnipeg when it's -40C?

 

[CKN]

Yet another thick vs. thin thread, complete with most all the same misconceptions and inaccurate assumptions as the rest of the 200+ threads.

THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

[millerbl00]

Its long term use of non recommend weight of oil that can cause a problem

 

[CKN]

Perhaps it is time for BITOG to split into two separate sites: BITOGthin.com and BITOGthick.com. There is no resolution to this question. Whaddaya think of the two-state solution?

I kind of like it.......................

 

[SwampSurvivor]

Oil weight isn't killing cars, that's the way I see it anyway.

For me it's roadsalt ...

 

[cptbarkey]

Really stirring the pot on this click bait thread @Al
Nothing really to see here or of value.

 

[OVERKILL]

Its long term use of non recommend weight of oil that can cause a problem

Can you describe these problems in detail?

A 20 grade is only a 20 grade at 100C, at temperatures below 100C, it's heavier, at temperatures above 100C, it's thinner. So if you are in Winnipeg and your oil never gets to 100C, you are never reaching that viscosity.

Let's take M1 EP 0W-20 for example, it's 8.8cSt @ 100C. However, if it's winter, and your oil temps never get above 70C, you are driving around with oil that's 17.41cSt, which is deep into SAE 50 grade territory.

 

[TomYoung]

Huh? What engines got larger bearings with the change to 20 wt?

That was a total retcon. We certainly watched Toyota move from 0 W 30 all the way to O W 8 on the same engine, and then make wildly different recommendations elsewhere in the world. (I said that like a thickie, which was not my intention).

It is a great point. Nobody can show us SBC bearings getting bigger over time as oils get thinner. Beyond that, surely some of the fuel economy value would be negated by the friction of a larger bearing.

That idea, like so much in the thick v. thin debate, was simply made up by somebody.

 

[millerbl00]

I agree let's make two separate sites: BITOGthin.com and BITOGthick.com

Put 100w in yours if you want. I am using what the manufacture recommends

 

[MNgopher]

Good grief - its like the old days when recommendations for xw20 oils started coming out.

I ran three F150's out to over 190,000 miles before I sold them using 5w20 oil. The '04 had issues with the timing chains, but no issues with bearings...

 

[kschachn]

Its long term use of non recommend weight of oil that can cause a problem

Surely you have some technical data to back this up?

 

[millerbl00]

good grief. The thicker oil causes the tensioner not to operate properly when the tensioner is designed for thinner oil

I'm out of here........

 

[Klutch9]

Death, taxes, and thick vs thin threads.

 

[OVERKILL]

That was a total retcon. We certainly watched Toyota move from 0 W 30 all the way to O W 8 on the same engine, and then make wildly different recommendations elsewhere in the world. (I said that like a thickie, which was not my intention).

It is a great point. Nobody can show us SBC bearings getting bigger over time as oils get thinner. Beyond that, surely some of the fuel economy value would be negated by the friction of a larger bearing.

That idea, like so much in the thick v. thin debate, was simply made up by somebody.

It wasn't made up, it was in a paper from Honda that @Shannow shared on here years ago. This was back when Toyota, Honda and Nissan were all messing around with oils with an HTHS below 2.6cP. The paper noted that in order for wear to be kept to acceptable levels on, for example, 0W-12, they had to widen the bearings, which increased friction, but the reduction in overall pumping and frictional losses from the thinner oil, more than made up for it in fuel economy gains.

Toyota, and Honda, having been playing with this for decades, would have baked those accommodations into their engine designs, allowing them to back-spec the same design to thinner and thinner lubricants as they became commercially available.

 

[kschachn]

good grief. The thicker oil causes the tensioner not to operate properly when the tensioner is designed for thinner oil

I'm out of here........

Again, where do you see this?

And as Overkill has noted, oil viscosity isn’t constant and is highly dependent on temperature. Here in the Great North I’ll guarantee you there are many vehicles that never reach normal operating temperature on some trips. What happens then? Do those tensioners fail? What a design fail that would be. Two of my vehicles have timing chains and tensioners, will they fail due to this phenomenon? Because one was “designed for” 20-grade and I have used all the way up to a 50-grade.

Oil grades in the manual are recommendations not requirements.

 

[CKN]

Death, taxes, and thick vs thin threads.

I miss the days when guys could brag about buying a beater for $5,000.00 and how they were going to drive it for 300,000 miles.
THOSE were the days!

 

[Hall]

as the rest of the 200+ threads.

Come on, list 20 of 'em for us ! Love it when you do that !

 

[oil pan 4]

There are many of us that use trucks for "truck stuff". There are plenty of these things in fleets, city, state, and federal uses that are actually used as trucks.
I had the transmission temperature brought up on my DIC (on that Colorado trip)-it never went past 170 degrees.
Wasn't concerned about the engine oil temps-so I can't answer your question.
Never got a message to "pull over-your hot" or whatever it is.
I know the message can come up if for some reason you are over heating.

If you get that message the engine is probably already toast.