Why Do Knowledgeable Folks on Here use 20 wt Oil

[Al]

Yes we understand that the differences in UOA analysis between 20 and 30 wt oil are slight. But we also know 30 wt protects better. The 3 factor Bearing Graph says that.

We also know that 20 wt. oil was first considered 20 years ago to improve gas mileage. It was shown that engines at that time would not last to 150 K miles as they would be required. So they lowered that requirement. And fast forward engines were redesigned with larger bearings and bearing surfaced to provide for less wear.

Still in light of this there is every reason to suspect that an engine will last longer over the longer haul and/or use less oil over that period by using 30 wt. oil. So do knowledgeable folks value the fact that engines will give 3% to 6% better mileage??

 

[Jeffrey Behr]

Might have something to do with warranties on new cars; I'm glad Ford requires 5W-30 in my Explorer's 400HP EcoBoost V6, and I use full-synthetic Kirkland oil in it.

 

[JoelB]

Oil weight isn't killing cars, that's the way I see it anyway.

 

[supton]

I only plan to go to say 200k on my car and then move on. It's a great thought to run to 300k+ but after 10 years I'm kinda ready to move on, and the car has other issues that tend to make me want to move on too. So 0W20 vs 5W30... it's a nice discussion and all, but not convinced that it matters in a gently driven highway hauler.

I did bump our CRV from 5W20 to 5W30 but it's already lost its camshaft and is burning oil, both of which seem to be tamed a bit by the oil bump. Would it be in better shape had it always used 5W30? dunno, it saw lots of cold starts and short trips for much of its life, and all of that was prior to my ownership. Thinner may have been better for it for those early years for all I know.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Yes we understand that the differences in UOA analysis between 20 and 30 wt oil are slight. But we also know 30 wt protects better. The 3 factor Bearing Graph says that.

We also know that 20 wt. oil was first considered 20 years ago to improve gas mileage. It was shown that engines at that time would not last to 150 K miles as they would be required. So they lowered that requirement. And fast forward engines were redesigned with larger bearings and bearing surfaced to provide for less wear.

Still in light of this there is every reason to suspect that an engine will last longer over the longer haul and/or use less oil over that period by using 30 wt. oil. So do knowledgeable folks value the fact that engines will give 3% to 6% better mileage??

20 grades were introduced in the 1950's and 60's. Engine design plays an important roll in terms of wear.

 

[RooflessVW]

I've been running 0W-20 HM in my Honda since new.

Why?

It was really cheap. 0W-20 isn't going to reduce the engine life by any measurable amount.

 

[Ausfahrt]

I live in a state that has cold weather and we all know that much of the wear in an engine occurs at start up. Thinner oils flow better at low temps and may help my engines last longer.

 

[CKN]

Yes we understand that the differences in UOA analysis between 20 and 30 wt oil are slight. But we also know 30 wt protects better. The 3 factor Bearing Graph says that.

We also know that 20 wt. oil was first considered 20 years ago to improve gas mileage. It was shown that engines at that time would not last to 150 K miles as they would be required. So they lowered that requirement. And fast forward engines were redesigned with larger bearings and bearing surfaced to provide for less wear.

Still in light of this there is every reason to suspect that an engine will last longer over the longer haul and/or use less oil over that period by using 30 wt. oil. So do knowledgeable folks value the fact that engines will give 3% to 6% better mileage??

Here we go again. "Thick vs. Thin" just worded another way.
I have a 2023 Silverado w/the 5.3. I tow (5,000 pound travel trailer) more at elevation in 90plus degree weather than most on this board.
Last trip was up to Leadville, Colorado-the town is close to 10,000 feet. It's was hot (90 degrees)-when I pulled in.
The truck never hesitated.
It has a powertrain warranty out to 100,000 miles.
I run 0w/20 because that what the manual calls for.

 

[demarpaint]

Here we go again. "Thick vs. Thin" just worded another way.
I have a 2023 Silverado w/the 5.3. I tow (5,000 pound travel trailer) more at elevation in 90plus degree weather than most on this board.
Last trip was up to Leadville, Colorado-the town is close to 10,000 feet. It's was hot (90 degrees)-when I pulled in.
The truck never hesitated.
It has a powertrain warranty out to 100,000 miles.
I run 0w/20 because that what the manual calls for.

Yep, just another one of many different plays on the words.

 

[BISCUT]

20 grades were introduced in the 1950's and 60's. Engine design plays an important roll in terms of wear.

I admit I lean a little to the heavier side but from everything I've learned here majority of engines speck'd for 0/5-20 sure don't seem to suffer long term by its use. I ran 0-20 in my F150 when new but moved to 5-30 and saw ZERO difference in mileage or anything else for that matter. UOA's haven't recognized a difference either.

IDK with certainty but it sure appears to be a matter of changing it as you should with a decent oil and filter means more for longevity than the difference of a 20 v 30wt.

 

[JavierH19]

Because it's thicker than 0w-16 which is thicker than 0w-12 which is thicker than the 0w-8 on the oil cap. Don't you know how thick 0w-20 is?

 

[buster]

Because that's what the OEM says and warranty.

 

[TomYoung]

Perhaps it is time for BITOG to split into two separate sites: BITOGthin.com and BITOGthick.com. There is no resolution to this question. Whaddaya think of the two-state solution?

 

[oil pan 4]

Yes we understand that the differences in UOA analysis between 20 and 30 wt oil are slight. But we also know 30 wt protects better. The 3 factor Bearing Graph says that.

We also know that 20 wt. oil was first considered 20 years ago to improve gas mileage. It was shown that engines at that time would not last to 150 K miles as they would be required. So they lowered that requirement. And fast forward engines were redesigned with larger bearings and bearing surfaced to provide for less wear.

Still in light of this there is every reason to suspect that an engine will last longer over the longer haul and/or use less oil over that period by using 30 wt. oil. So do knowledgeable folks value the fact that engines will give 3% to 6% better mileage??

It depends on a lot.
Most off the shelf 20 weight oils are almost 30 weights.
Fuel economy for a typical off the shelf 20 weight verses a typical off the shelf 30 weight most people can't tell the difference.
Now if something like a Toyota dealership bulk 20 weight is compared to say an amsoil 30 weight there would be a prettygood difference in viscosity and then a driver might see the 5% difference in fuel economy.

 

[oil pan 4]

Perhaps it is time for BITOG to split into two separate sites: BITOGthin.com and BITOGthick.com. There is no resolution to this question. Whaddaya think of the two-state solution?

Make it BITOGthicc and I'm in.

 

[OVERKILL]

Yes we understand that the differences in UOA analysis between 20 and 30 wt oil are slight. But we also know 30 wt protects better. The 3 factor Bearing Graph says that.

UOA's can't be used for that purpose.

We also know that 20 wt. oil was first considered 20 years ago to improve gas mileage.

No, SAE 20 grade oils have been around since before WWII. I've seen Gray Marine engines with brass grade plaques on the final drive that listed SAE 20, SAE 30, SAE 40 and the intended temperature range for each grade in the engine.

It was shown that engines at that time would not last to 150 K miles as they would be required. So they lowered that requirement. And fast forward engines were redesigned with larger bearings and bearing surfaced to provide for less wear.

No, the wider bearing changes were made to accommodate oil grades BELOW the SAE 20 threshold; below the 2.6cP HTHS limit, which is where design changes need to be made. It was Honda, Toyota, Nissan...etc that were experimenting with grades that weren't even ratified in J300 at the time, but had HTHS viscosities below 2.6cP, that discovered the need for wider bearings, along with surface coatings and other mechanisms to keep wear to an acceptable level.

Still in light of this there is every reason to suspect that an engine will last longer over the longer haul and/or use less oil over that period by using 30 wt. oil. So do knowledgeable folks value the fact that engines will give 3% to 6% better mileage??

There isn't a 3-6% improvement in mileage going from an xW-30 to an xW-20, it would be much less than that, based on what Mobil shared with their AFE oils.

As long as oil temperature is properly controlled (and many applications that call for xW-20 have heat exchangers for the oil to keep it in a specific temperature range), xW-20 is generally safe (it is, after all, spec'd by the OEM). However, some applications, with fuel dilution and poor oil temperature control, I wouldn't feel safe running an xW-20.

So, for me personally, it comes down to application. Just like I prefer an additive package with non-neutered AW chemistry.

 

[oil pan 4]

Here we go again. "Thick vs. Thin" just worded another way.
I have a 2023 Silverado w/the 5.3. I tow (5,000 pound travel trailer) more at elevation in 90plus degree weather than most on this board.
Last trip was up to Leadville, Colorado-the town is close to 10,000 feet. It's was hot (90 degrees)-when I pulled in.
The truck never hesitated.
It has a powertrain warranty out to 100,000 miles.
I run 0w/20 because that what the manual calls for.

What's that oil temperature hitting on those hill climbs?
They recommend 0w-20 because they know around 90% of new truck buyers aren't going to run their truck any harder than getting a few bags of potting soil from the hardware store.
Does the manual say that or does the oil cap say to use 0w-20?
I would be one egg that if you find the part of the manual about towing a 5,000lb travel trailer up a mountain in the summer at interstate speed it wouldn't be telling you to use a 20 weight.
Maybe the 5.3L engines have a really amazing oil cooler and the oil never gets above 220f. But I doubt it.

 

[Hall]

It was shown that engines at that time would not last to 150 K miles as they would be required.

Where is this "data" ?

Just because a handful of people don't like thin oils doesn't mean there's anything wrong with them. There are hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of vehicles running on 20 weight oils and people aren't getting rid of them because of engine failures from "thin" oil. There are Toyotas out there running 16 weight oils with hundreds of thousands of miles and plenty running on 8 weights that will go just as long (if not already).

 

[kschachn]

Yet another thick vs. thin thread, complete with most all the same misconceptions and inaccurate assumptions as the rest of the 200+ threads.

 

[Chris142]

d fast forward engines were redesigned with larger bearings and bearing surfaced to provide for less wear.

Huh? What engines got larger bearings with the change to 20 wt?