I have read alot of posts on this site. One thing I don't understand is why would you change the weight of an oil from what the manufacturer recommends? I am in Texas so I don't deal with extreme colds but it does get very hot here in the summer. I see why you would go to synthetics in the very cold for protection at startup but what other reasons would you change? I maintain a 2000 chevy mailibu, 2001 honda crv, and my 2003 dodge cummins diesel. I run 5w-30 in both the malibu and the crv because that is what is recomended. I run 15w-40 in the diesel by cummins recommendations. Is there something I need to be doing different on these cars? Is a certain oil better for the summer? Thanks in advance....
why change oil from what is recommended?
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I'm sure this will spark a debate, but I'll say it anyway. I prefer to thicken up the oil when temperatures climb. The hotter an oil gets, the thinner it gets (and the opposite occurs when cold). Speaking for myself and my vehicle, I'm more comfortable with a thicker film of oil between the metal surfaces in my engine. Thicker, and resistant to thermal breakdown which means I use full synthetic. Personally, I haven't owned a car that stated in concrete "XW-XX ONLY". There's always been a chart in the owner's manual offering alternatives depending on your conditions. You'll notice in these charts that their options are thicker oils as temperatures rise. I'm in agreement with them, and step up a notch or two when summer arrives in Texas. I drop back down to the recommended viscosity when fall arrives (which has been 5W-30 on every vehicle I've owned in the past 6 years). It's a personal choice, one that may or may not help you sleep at night if you care at all for your vehicles.
I like to thicken as well because I don't believe manufactures have the same mind set for oils as I might have. By that I mean they might have the MPG as top priority and not the longetivity of my engine. I have tried all different viscosities in my engine and I prefer a little thicker. Plus when a manufacture stamps on the oil cap 5w30 its hard for me to believe that someone that lives in Alaska has the same requirments as someone like me in Florida.
I've seen those oil grade/outside temp charts in older vehicle service manual. My 84 camaro said not to use 5W30 above 60F. Recommended 10w30, 10w 40 or 15w40.
So it is RTS 5W40 for me. Oil Cap says 5W20 on my 4.6L F150.
Texas scorcher 100+ weather...
No worrys!
So it is RTS 5W40 for me. Oil Cap says 5W20 on my 4.6L F150.
Texas scorcher 100+ weather...
No worrys!
My Mazda 3 came with 5W-20 factory fill, and for break-in purposes, I did my first oil change at 1000 miles. I was horrified at how that oil resembled water. I know there are plenty of testimonials on this board about the protection offered by 5W-20 oils, but I can't wrap my mind around that when it seems like nothing more than oil scented spring water draining from my pan. I can't, with any good conscience pour something like that into an engine that's going to be facing my driving style in 105 degree heat.
So should I go to a 10w-30 in the summer for the malibu and crv? Do I have this right?
There are some threads on this board that have chart of thicknesses at certain temperatures. I didn't really read them all that closely, as I'm happy with the products I'm using. You might want to search and find these 10w-30s that are allegedly thinner than 5W-30s at temperature. I guess that's possible between different brands, but unlikely within a single brand.
Synthetics are better in the hot weather than a slightly thicker dino. I'd consider staying in grade but switching to a good group III full synth.
Hot weather, heavy oil is best. Just ask the Old Timers. Don't trust auto manufacturers that tell you to use thin oil. If your engine breaks, you have to buy a new car. Ask yourself: "Who profits?"
Does the outside ambient temperature really have much of an affect upon the internal temperature of an engine?
Whether it's 10 below zero or 100 degrees... my water temp gauge registers the same temperature.
I can not fathom how the outside air temp. is affecting my oil.
Please correct me about my doubts about needing a thicker oil when the AIR temperature is high in regards to how our bodies sense temperature.
Whether it's 10 below zero or 100 degrees... my water temp gauge registers the same temperature.
I can not fathom how the outside air temp. is affecting my oil.
Please correct me about my doubts about needing a thicker oil when the AIR temperature is high in regards to how our bodies sense temperature.
obbop
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Member # 4379
posted 19 July, 2006 07:39
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Does the outside ambient temperature really have much of an affect upon the internal temperature of an engine?
Whether it's 10 below zero or 100 degrees... my water temp gauge registers the same temperature.
I can not fathom how the outside air temp. is affecting my oil.
Please correct me about my doubts about needing a thicker oil when the AIR temperature is high in regards to how our bodies sense temperature.
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Posts: 763 | From: Texas | Registered: Jun 2004 | IP: Logged |
I agree with you bro 100%.
Member
Member # 4379
posted 19 July, 2006 07:39
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Does the outside ambient temperature really have much of an affect upon the internal temperature of an engine?
Whether it's 10 below zero or 100 degrees... my water temp gauge registers the same temperature.
I can not fathom how the outside air temp. is affecting my oil.
Please correct me about my doubts about needing a thicker oil when the AIR temperature is high in regards to how our bodies sense temperature.
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Posts: 763 | From: Texas | Registered: Jun 2004 | IP: Logged |
I agree with you bro 100%.
Well, I have to think that even though your COOLANT temps are the same, owing to the thermostat, fact is, the oil passes through a filter, and surely is affected by ambient temps. It sits in the pan, also subject to ambient temps. A car equipped with an oil cooler would give up even more heat from the oil to ambient.
In winter, say 20 degrees, or what the heck, 5 or 10 or 15, your oil starts out 70-100 degrees colder than right now (assuming your area has been affected by the recent heat wave), and it would certainly give up a lot of heat to said filter and pan and cooler while running and wouldn't reach the same temps as summer.
I don't have accurate numbers, but it follows that since there's no thermostat maintaining oil temperature, it MUST run somewhat cooler winter vs. summer.
Just a hunch, however..
In winter, say 20 degrees, or what the heck, 5 or 10 or 15, your oil starts out 70-100 degrees colder than right now (assuming your area has been affected by the recent heat wave), and it would certainly give up a lot of heat to said filter and pan and cooler while running and wouldn't reach the same temps as summer.
I don't have accurate numbers, but it follows that since there's no thermostat maintaining oil temperature, it MUST run somewhat cooler winter vs. summer.
Just a hunch, however..
Does the outside ambient temperature really have much of an affect upon the internal temperature of an engine?
Answer: Only when the engine has not be running. So lets say today the temp was 104F and engine needed to be started for the first time that day, what temp is it already.
A running engine does get hotter than the outside air.
However when the outside air temperature is up like this summer,one can use a higher viscocity range oil. I'm using my stash of RTS 5w40. If had none I would have just gotten some RT 15w40 and not worry about it.
Now if it were cold freezing weather I would have no problem using 5W20.
Answer: Only when the engine has not be running. So lets say today the temp was 104F and engine needed to be started for the first time that day, what temp is it already.
A running engine does get hotter than the outside air.
However when the outside air temperature is up like this summer,one can use a higher viscocity range oil. I'm using my stash of RTS 5w40. If had none I would have just gotten some RT 15w40 and not worry about it.
Now if it were cold freezing weather I would have no problem using 5W20.
When engines ware they get looser. So by this account you put in thicker oil to fill the space. The mfg's recommended viscosity is for a new tight engine below 75K. Both my Buick and GMC have high miles and they get better mileage than they did new. That's because I use MaxLife 10W-40 in both of them.
has far as thickness, i go buy what the cst rating is..i.e. redline 10w 30 vis cst @ 100c or 212f is 10.7 and for 10w 40 =14.6....that is this oil!!!
There are several factors that may justify a small viscosity adjustment.
Ambient temperature, especially low temperature on startup (winter) calls for lower viscosity. Honda recommends 5W30 for my CRV. For our extreme winter cold temps I am using 0W30 synthetic to help reduce startup wear. I am considering for the next winter mixing in 1qt of a xW20. I don't think this is a significant deviation from the recommended 5W30.
Higher temperature may not be as big a problem as engine is far hotter when warmed up. Nevertheless, on my bike I see a difference. Below 20C engine (coolant) temp is steady just above cold level. These days at 30C it is slightly higher and any time I idle or increase RPM it rises much faster than when riding below 20. Of course, bikes have higher revs so might be more senstivie to ambient.
Another reason to increase viscosity is high load. My lawn tractor works hard, so I switched to 15W40 from default 10W30. Manual did recommend 15W40 for summer temperatures.
That being said, many people will tell you not to bother. We can get carried away with viscosity adjustments and complicate things more than necessary. So make adjustments when you have a solid reason.
In your case for hot summers going to 10W30 is a very minor and reasonable adjustment. As others mentioned these "10W30" and "5W30" are crude measures, so read the fine print. My "0W30" Esso XD-3 is almost as thick as xW40s when warmed up!
Ambient temperature, especially low temperature on startup (winter) calls for lower viscosity. Honda recommends 5W30 for my CRV. For our extreme winter cold temps I am using 0W30 synthetic to help reduce startup wear. I am considering for the next winter mixing in 1qt of a xW20. I don't think this is a significant deviation from the recommended 5W30.
Higher temperature may not be as big a problem as engine is far hotter when warmed up. Nevertheless, on my bike I see a difference. Below 20C engine (coolant) temp is steady just above cold level. These days at 30C it is slightly higher and any time I idle or increase RPM it rises much faster than when riding below 20. Of course, bikes have higher revs so might be more senstivie to ambient.
Another reason to increase viscosity is high load. My lawn tractor works hard, so I switched to 15W40 from default 10W30. Manual did recommend 15W40 for summer temperatures.
That being said, many people will tell you not to bother. We can get carried away with viscosity adjustments and complicate things more than necessary. So make adjustments when you have a solid reason.
In your case for hot summers going to 10W30 is a very minor and reasonable adjustment. As others mentioned these "10W30" and "5W30" are crude measures, so read the fine print. My "0W30" Esso XD-3 is almost as thick as xW40s when warmed up!
If you plan on keeping your vehicle for a long time it might make a difference. Say 300k or longer. The average person trades at a mileage that there isn't any concern since most new models if taken care of with recommended oil changes will last for an easy 200k. Does changing to a different weight other than what is recommended really matter?? Does anyone know the statistical count of how many vehicles had mechanical failures due to not running the recommened weight oil? I would say most failures are due to neglect more than anything like not changing the oil and filter as recommended or checking it and running on a low oil level. If you change your oil with the recommended weight/grade oil on the recommended schedule then from what I have seen it will last well past its usefull life of the average persons need for it before they trade on a new model.
Yea, the climate in Alaska is way different than the climate in Phoenix Az. Follow the manufactures maintenace guidelines and there shouldn't be any issues.
Again, anyone know of mechanical failures due to not running the recommened weight oil but still change the oil and filter at 3 to 4k intervals? I'm sure we all would like to know and to what manufacture that it happened too the most.
Yea, the climate in Alaska is way different than the climate in Phoenix Az. Follow the manufactures maintenace guidelines and there shouldn't be any issues.
Again, anyone know of mechanical failures due to not running the recommened weight oil but still change the oil and filter at 3 to 4k intervals? I'm sure we all would like to know and to what manufacture that it happened too the most.
I know in the summer my oil gets hotter than winter because I've used an infared temp gun. When ambient temps get below about 65 degrees out, the oil as measured at the oil filter is about 195 to 200 degrees (car idling in the driveway after just driving around town for a while doing errands). Coolent is usually at about 190 at the upper hose.
When the ambient temps get to 90 and above, oil will be about 215-220 and coolent about 195 at the upper hose with the rad fans going full tilt.
I sleep better with 1 quart of 20w-50 tossed in with my 10w-30 in the summer.
When the ambient temps get to 90 and above, oil will be about 215-220 and coolent about 195 at the upper hose with the rad fans going full tilt.
I sleep better with 1 quart of 20w-50 tossed in with my 10w-30 in the summer.
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