Why aren't we geek'n out on Microgreen Oil Fiters?

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Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: harry j
I'd like to see the UOA with particle counts on this filter.


Agreed. It might be something for extended OCIs, but for my car (which is still under warranty), the filter is $29.99. I can get Bosch Premiums for under $5.

It might be "nice" to get all those smaller particles out, if the claims are taken at face value, but given the cost and the fact that engines tend to outlast everything else, unless one is doing extended OCIs, where's the return on investment?


The filters all come in 2-packs, so I assume that you mean that the filter is $15 (which is on par with Mobil 1 or Royal Purple).

Return on investment? I'm not sure there is one. I will say that using these filters much (but not all) of the time, my Prius with 102,000 miles isn't burning a significant amount of oil (I don't have to add any between 10,000 mile changes).

Besides, many folks on this site aren't quite so interested in return on investment.

Oh - I have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the folks who sell these filters - I'm NOT a shill!
 
Originally Posted By: Artem
Originally Posted By: MicroGreen
The microGreen® filter is similar to developments in spark plugs and radiator coolant fluid. Those products used to be changed quite often, requiring maintenance several times per year.

Nevertheless, end-users desired less frequent maintenance and technology was finally developed to match their demands. Now spark plugs are changed at around 50,000 miles and radiator fluid can be used 3 years or longer.


I never understood why many "technologically" advanced companies produce such fine products, hinting at the fact that they might know a thing or two about automobile maintenance and then ruin it with silly comments like this.

Today's Iridium spark plugs are made to go 100,000 miles + before needing to be changed.

They're promoting 30k OCIs yet still live in the past with 50k spark plug changes
33.gif
i don't get it.


2011 Hyundai Sonata 2.0T factory mandated sparkplug interval is 30K severe, 45K miles normal (double iridium)
 
Originally Posted By: kohnen
The filters all come in 2-packs, so I assume that you mean that the filter is $15 (which is on par with Mobil 1 or Royal Purple).


Thanks for the correction. I missed that. That being said, it's an expensive filter, but not outrageously so. It's certainly more attractive than the multi-hundred dollar screen filters, then.
wink.gif


Originally Posted By: kohnen
Return on investment? I'm not sure there is one.


Well, I don't think you're a shill, but I do think there could, at least potentially, be a return on investment using these filters with extended OCIs. Some people run bypass filtration for extended OCIs. If this is more convenient or cost effective, then that's worth something.

For those who simply use a P1 or a Bosch Premium or Wix for extended OCIs, then perhaps not. Nonetheless, it's an interesting idea. For factory mandated or even mildly extended OCIs, I couldn't see myself using the filter. If I was going much longer, it might be something worth looking at.

If I was still running the old propane taxi fleet, it would probably have been worth a shot. With zero fuel dilution and engine oil always at temperatures, it might have been interesting to move from conventional and 6,000 mile OCIs to synthetics and much longer.
 
Originally Posted By: LineArrayNut
Originally Posted By: Artem
Originally Posted By: MicroGreen
The microGreen® filter is similar to developments in spark plugs and radiator coolant fluid. Those products used to be changed quite often, requiring maintenance several times per year.

Nevertheless, end-users desired less frequent maintenance and technology was finally developed to match their demands. Now spark plugs are changed at around 50,000 miles and radiator fluid can be used 3 years or longer.


I never understood why many "technologically" advanced companies produce such fine products, hinting at the fact that they might know a thing or two about automobile maintenance and then ruin it with silly comments like this.

Today's Iridium spark plugs are made to go 100,000 miles + before needing to be changed.

They're promoting 30k OCIs yet still live in the past with 50k spark plug changes
33.gif
i don't get it.


2011 Hyundai Sonata 2.0T factory mandated sparkplug interval is 30K severe, 45K miles normal (double iridium)



that is because it has so much hp
 
Originally Posted By: LineArrayNut
Originally Posted By: Artem
Originally Posted By: MicroGreen
The microGreen® filter is similar to developments in spark plugs and radiator coolant fluid. Those products used to be changed quite often, requiring maintenance several times per year.

Nevertheless, end-users desired less frequent maintenance and technology was finally developed to match their demands. Now spark plugs are changed at around 50,000 miles and radiator fluid can be used 3 years or longer.


I never understood why many "technologically" advanced companies produce such fine products, hinting at the fact that they might know a thing or two about automobile maintenance and then ruin it with silly comments like this.

Today's Iridium spark plugs are made to go 100,000 miles + before needing to be changed.

They're promoting 30k OCIs yet still live in the past with 50k spark plug changes
33.gif
i don't get it.


2011 Hyundai Sonata 2.0T factory mandated sparkplug interval is 30K severe, 45K miles normal (double iridium)


That's only because Hyundai sucks and they're still in the 90s with maintenance schedules.

If the iridium plugs are only good for 30k miles, I wonder how long the regular el cheapo plus will last in their piece of junk motors... 10k miles before going bad and needing replacement?
lol.gif


come on, my 98 Toyota Camry has longer intervals then quoted in the green filter's site.
 
meh I'm not ready to throw microgreen under the bus yet. I would like to see particle counts and a cut open pic thread :P
 
I ordered 4 to geek out on. The hyundai runs the synthetics dead black in 3K+ miles. I'll send one to anybody to tear into after 4800 this summer. Gonna run 3 qts RT6, 1qt MX4T, 1 qt Red Line 0W30. In case no one knows, severe OCI is 3K, normal is 4.8K miles.
 
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I think what Microgreen is trying to do is allow the savings to be acquired through the extended drain. The filter is changed every 10k miles, but the filtration properties allow you to keep the sump for 30k. Since the add packs don't deteriorate as quickly...you can keep the oil longer. That could add up to some potential savings even at the $15 price tag.
 
Originally Posted By: Hannibal
I think what Microgreen is trying to do is allow the savings to be acquired through the extended drain. The filter is changed every 10k miles, but the filtration properties allow you to keep the sump for 30k. Since the add packs don't deteriorate as quickly...you can keep the oil longer. That could add up to some potential savings even at the $15 price tag.


That's their intended use.

I'm not comfortable leaving oil in there for 30k miles. As others have pointed out, there's more to worn out oil than containing lots of particulates.

But I'm perfectly happy using it as a very high performance filter to use for my 10k mile oil changes.

This board has a bypass oil filter section, so at least someone likes the idea of really good filtration.
 
I'm willing to try the filter but don't like the thought of them having only like 5 different models of different sizes that fit 100s of vehicles with different needs. I'll wait until they got mainstream and have a filter that's designed for my particular engine and it's needs.... kinda tempted to try it now though...
35.gif
 
kohnen,
Just wondering if you'll be doing a used oil analysis with the use of the Microgreen filter? I'll be using this filter on all my cars in the spring. After reading about bypass filtering, a 30k oci isn't all that much. Microgreen did do used oil analysis using mostly petroleum based oils with good results and synthetics should do at least as well. All the best.
 
Originally Posted By: Quest
1) tests confirmed that anything less than 10microns or less is not harmful to engine, so making a 2 micron filtration is, IMHO, unnecessary (what next? 0.5 microns?!)

What is the thickness of the lubricant film formed by the oil in your engine? Is it 10 microns or thicker?

If it is only 2-microns thick, then maybe you should be buying microGreen filters.

If you don't like microGreen filters, there is the Amsoil by-pass filter that also boasts a 2-micron filtering capability. The Frantz by-pass filter boasts a 1-micro filtering capability and that filter is made in the USA.

Let's see your test.
 
Originally Posted By: pjf
Originally Posted By: Quest
1) tests confirmed that anything less than 10microns or less is not harmful to engine, so making a 2 micron filtration is, IMHO, unnecessary (what next? 0.5 microns?!)

What is the thickness of the lubricant film formed by the oil in your engine? Is it 10 microns or thicker?

If it is only 2-microns thick, then maybe you should be buying microGreen filters.

If you don't like microGreen filters, there is the Amsoil by-pass filter that also boasts a 2-micron filtering capability. The Frantz by-pass filter boasts a 1-micro filtering capability and that filter is made in the USA.

Let's see your test.


If it's unnecessary, then why do so many companies sell the by-pass filtration systems? Its very clear that if the oil is filtered very well of any particles, it will last longer, hence the super long OCIs they recommend.

For the average joe, sure it's not needed but don't say that the actual filtration down to 2 microns isn't needed because 10+/- is "fine".
 
Originally Posted By: Artem
Originally Posted By: pjf
Originally Posted By: Quest
1) tests confirmed that anything less than 10microns or less is not harmful to engine, so making a 2 micron filtration is, IMHO, unnecessary (what next? 0.5 microns?!)

What is the thickness of the lubricant film formed by the oil in your engine? Is it 10 microns or thicker?

If it is only 2-microns thick, then maybe you should be buying microGreen filters.

If you don't like microGreen filters, there is the Amsoil by-pass filter that also boasts a 2-micron filtering capability. The Frantz by-pass filter boasts a 1-micro filtering capability and that filter is made in the USA.

Let's see your test.


If it's unnecessary, then why do so many companies sell the by-pass filtration systems? Its very clear that if the oil is filtered very well of any particles, it will last longer, hence the super long OCIs they recommend.

For the average joe, sure it's not needed but don't say that the actual filtration down to 2 microns isn't needed because 10+/- is "fine".


Given how far a Modular will go in LEO and taxi service I'm thinking there are more important things to engine longevity than ensuring your oil is filtered down to the 2-micron level. I'm sure most of those cars get whatever cheap filter their service departments got on special.
 
I get the argument about not making the engine last longer, based on your LEO and taxi service impressions. However, the brief time I took to read their site did not give me the impression that they were saying the engine would last longer. I got the idea they were saying the oil would last longer, thereby saving costs in the long run.

Not arguing for or against, just giving my impression.
 
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Your oil film should be as thick as the metal particles allowed by your filter. If your filter allows 10-micron particles, then your oil wear protection film should be 10-microns thick.

As an example, here's what Chevron oil claims in its PDS: "Tests have proven that Delo Gear Lubricants ESI provide a wear protection film 3 to 5 times thicker than the conventional sulfur-phosphorus antiwear film." So we need to know how thick our antiwear film is. Until we figure out the thickness of our wear protection films, we do not know the size of the metal particles that we should filter out.

Oil change intervals (OCI) should be based on the holding capacity of the filter. A "microfilter" that screens particles as small as 2-microns will clog up pretty fast and will need to be replaced more frequently. The Frantz and Amsoil bypass filters that screen 1-micron or 2-micron particles are quite large compared to the microGreen filter.

Let's consider large filters that screen the smallest abrasive particles so we can keep our engines performing at peak compression longer and be less dependent on expensive wear protection additives in our oil that may be hard to dispose of safely.
 
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