Why are there so many AWD cars now?

[97prizm]

Agreed. It's a marketing scam to seller higher profit margin vehicles. The public has been convinced AWD is required and life saving in many scenarios.

The biggest thing is the price difference. There used to be a considerable price difference, now not so much. The efficiency has gone up tremendously along with the capability.

 

[Blueshound]

Do you install a backup generator in a Manhattan apartment on 30/F?

Interesting analogy. And the answer is "yes, definitely."

Not sure what you mean by "install" but to me, backup power in a city would be even more important than in the country. Lots of apartment buildings have their own backup generators. Even so, if my apartment had either a balcony or garden, I might consider a propane powered generator and as many 20 lb tanks as I could manage. More likely, the biggest battery backup(s) I could get. Preferably a power wall or similar.

But I'm the type that always wants to be prepared for contingencies. That's why my vehicles have AWD or 4WD.

 

[Greasymechtech]

My FWD 2gr vehicle spins tires too easily and suffers from excessive wheel hop. Not all of us drive boringly. My 4wd/awd 2gr's never had an issue, which includes rain/snow/slush at intersections, slippery boat ramps, and accelerating while towing something heavy.

My FWD turbo'd cars loose traction easily when turbo kicks in. Not an issue with awd.

I do like the pseudo awd hybrid tech that Toyota uses, even though early versions were not great in blizzards. Not sure how good they are now but the Rav4/Venza hybrids are on the list to consider again.

I rotate tires regularly and have never experienced any wheel sensitivity with various awd systems. I also replace all 4 tires when needed.
From what I understand, Subaru was on the way to bankruptcy and slimmed their plants, options, which included AWD only years ago. They survived.

I see Mazda has done the same with the Cx5 and wonder how their financials are....

I don't have any issue with maintenance or extra parts. So, pick your automaker wisely. Some have a history of failure.

 

[Al]

I think some who dislike AWD feel their perceived "superior driving skills" allow them to navigate through treacherous weather conditions on 2 WD just like others use AWD. News Flash: They cant

 

[Brett776]

I live in Florida, very flat no snow. Every SUV I’ve bought for the family was either a true 4x4 or AWD. Current Jeep GC is full time AWD. I like the better handling in our heavy rains or tropical storms. We get the occasional flooding and mud and muck on dirt roads that lead to trails I walk. It has saved me a few times visiting a cabin in the blue ridge mountains that has a steep incline. Overall I’m sure I could do without it 90% of the time, but I like the peace of mind and it seems to help resale value. My other car is front wheel drive. I’ll always have at least one 4x4 or AWD in the household.

 

[supton]

I grew up in the snow and don't miss it. However if you really need AWD to get through the snow, then you likely should just stay home because the rest of the clown show will be running into things - like you - left right and center.

I’m going to have to disagree with you here, at least a bit—first, I think we’d all like to know that doctors, nurses, fire, EMS are making it to work, assuming the storm wasn’t predicted to be so bad that they had to bunk at the job. Follow that up with those who might be pulling second shift plowing the roads, or heading into the power plants to keep the lights on. Also, if you live in an area where weather like this is routine… shouldn’t you routinely drive in it, so as to keep one’s skills sharp?

I get the sentiment, I do. I’d rather stay home and shovel my driveway, and take advantage of WFH, rather than slip and slide around with everyone else. But while I can do WFH there are people working jobs that can’t do that—who gets to take it on the nose for work not getting done? the employer or the employee? Should the employee be paid to stay home, or should the employee take a pay cut for the day?

[Insert obligatory remarks about how snow tires are more important than AWD, and that you still can’t drive 80mph even with snows&AWD.]

 

[cmarshall78]

No difference in having a 4wd truck. I wouldn't own one without it. Doesn't get used that often, but I was sure glad I had it when I drove across Nevada in a snow storm in I80 last month.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

AWD is better in the snow, all else being equal. It's irrefutable math. Assuming equal weight and power distribution, you get 25% of the available friction coefficient/resultant acceleration rate from each driven wheel. Even on a level or near-level surface, trying to leave a stop sign at an intersection with a polished packed snow/ice surface and one or two driven wheels is a miserable experience.

....

Remember the differential - a bad design that sends power to the wheel with the least traction - on the front and rear axles.. So you effectively have only two wheel drive - One front and one rear. I found out the hard way in the dry a couple months ago in my Ford EcoSport. Dropped a front tire right into a soft shoulder at an "odd" intersection and lifted the rear wheel diagonally opposite the front. Car wouldn't move. I had to radically "rock" my fat carcass in the seat to get a loose wheel to bite for a sec and move the car out of the predicament. The Good deal with AWD is you are powering a rear axle on hills, when there is a great amount of weight transfer off the front driven axle - and subsequently the front tire(s).

Probably why I was able to get around in the winter in the 70's and 80's with rear wheel drive. Problems came with front wheel drive. Worst offender? My new 1998 Nissan Maxima GXE 5-speed manual V6 FWD. That car went nowhere in the snow. But I do blame the tires for 80% of that situation. Car had flat and hard seats also. Slid backward down my drrivewat across the street into an icy snow banl and crunched the rear bumper and smashed the evap emissions canister for the fuel tank that was hanging down. Some blatant and inexcusable "partial engineering" on these Japanese cars.

Best in snow? RWD with engine behind the rear wheels.

 

[edyvw]

I think some who dislike AWD feel their perceived "superior driving skills" allow them to navigate through treacherous weather conditions on 2 WD just like others use AWD. News Flash: They cant

With good tires, it is fine.
AWD is more relaxing to drive. It is more capable if it has snow tires, but I will take FWD or RWD with snow tires over AWD wit AS or AT tires any day.
Difference comes if things get super nasty and I mean nasty where you must have snow tires on AWD too.

 

[John105]

What I don’t think anyone has brought up is the marginal benefit v marginal cost.

We just drove our AWD car to karate. The marginal benefit was zero. The marginal cost was thousands I think, it was 12 years ago so don’t know the actual number

 

[MSCH]

Interesting analogy. And the answer is "yes, definitely."

Not sure what you mean by "install" but to me, backup power in a city would be even more important than in the country. Lots of apartment buildings have their own backup generators. Even so, if my apartment had either a balcony or garden, I might consider a propane powered generator and as many 20 lb tanks as I could manage. More likely, the biggest battery backup(s) I could get. Preferably a power wall or similar.

But I'm the type that always wants to be prepared for contingencies. That's why my vehicles have AWD or 4WD.

backup power in the city is more of a luxury than in the country... generally people in the city have pressurized clean water whereas in the boonies if you don't have a generator you aren't running your well. Being a resident of hurricane country and having had my power out for about 18 days cumulative in the last 5 years( Hurricane Irma, Ian and one massive brush fire) will teach you that if you don't have electricity, you might be kind of bored or uncomfortable but if you go 15 or 20 days days without water it really sucks.

 

[dogememe]

One thing negative about subarus. They come with the crapiest tires found on the planet.

I had Michelin CrossClimate 2 Tires. Man what a difference.

And the stock batteries on Subarus are a joke. My aunt's 2015 Subaru came with like a 390 CCA battery. It died at less than three years, but was out of the 36K mile warranty. I don't even want to know how these weak batteries do in places where it actually gets cold. My aunt's car never left the SF Bay Area. Compared to the stock battery's 390 CCA even a cheap battery like a 35 Economy at O'Reilly has 500 CCA.

 

[PimTac]

What I don’t think anyone has brought up is the marginal benefit v marginal cost.

We just drove our AWD car to karate. The marginal benefit was zero. The marginal cost was thousands I think, it was 12 years ago so don’t know the actual number

Did you buy the vehicle for the AWD or for other reasons and the AWD came with it?

Consumers studies have shown that one of the biggest reasons for buying a crossover/SUV is the increased ride height and visibility. Also the functionality of the cargo area. AWD is a secondary reason.

 

[Nick1994]

Because they are excellent, affordable, economical family vehicles with insane resale value. A completely financially prudent decision to purchase one of those.

Did the entire point of this thread go over your head?

AWD = All Wheel Drive. What does that have to do with being excellent, affordable, economical, and having insane resale value?

And why do financially prudent people need it in Phoenix? Do financially prudent people have sandy or snowy driveways in Phoenix?

 

[TiGeo]

Because how else would I be able to use launch control in the snow?

 

[Jay73]

My first AWD car ever was my 2016 Honda HRV. Was nice to not have the wheel slip in snow/rain so I stuck with AWD on my next car which was a Mercedes. Traded the Mercedes in last year and same deal got a Mazda CX-5 Grand Touring Reserve with the turbo motor and AWD. So for me after having AWD in 2016 I honestly see no reason to buy anything without it now. CX-5 has some good HP/Torque on premium 256/320 for a 4 banger turbo so nice to floor it in the rain and no slip.

If I lived in Florida I'd go back to my younger days of muscle cars and RWD but since I see snow here AWD doesn't hurt.

 

[PimTac]

Did the entire point of this thread go over your head?

AWD = All Wheel Drive. What does that have to do with being excellent, affordable, economical, and having insane resale value?

And why do financially prudent people need it in Phoenix? Do financially prudent people have sandy or snowy driveways in Phoenix?

Maybe they go skiing up at Flagstaff?

 

[UG_Passat]

I think some who dislike AWD feel their perceived "superior driving skills" allow them to navigate through treacherous weather conditions on 2 WD just like others use AWD. News Flash: They cant

Actually on long steep hills, gravity and snow/ice will defeat FWD, even with the best friction studless tires. Then I bought chains to make it home. Then I bought a AWD cute-ute

I’m going to have to disagree with you here, at least a bit—first, I think we’d all like to know that doctors, nurses, fire, EMS are making it to work, assuming the storm wasn’t predicted to be so bad that they had to bunk at the job. Follow that up with those who might be pulling second shift plowing the roads, or heading into the power plants to keep the lights on. Also, if you live in an area where weather like this is routine… shouldn’t you routinely drive in it, so as to keep one’s skills sharp?

I get the sentiment, I do. I’d rather stay home and shovel my driveway, and take advantage of WFH, rather than slip and slide around with everyone else. But while I can do WFH there are people working jobs that can’t do that—who gets to take it on the nose for work not getting done? the employer or the employee? Should the employee be paid to stay home, or should the employee take a pay cut for the day?

[Insert obligatory remarks about how snow tires are more important than AWD, and that you still can’t drive 80mph even with snows&AWD.]

Back when I lived in the Northeast l, where I worked, if you signed a WFH agreement, on snow days you have to WFH. If you need time to shovel, then you need to request PTO, otherwise it’s time fraud

The rest of us suckers have the day off to shovel the driveway and enjoy the day off and get paid via administrative leave

 

[UG_Passat]

Did the entire point of this thread go over your head?

AWD = All Wheel Drive. What does that have to do with being excellent, affordable, economical, and having insane resale value?

And why do financially prudent people need it in Phoenix? Do financially prudent people have sandy or snowy driveways in Phoenix?

Does DemoFly live in Phoenix? Maybe he lives in an area that does see some snow and/or travels to the ski slopes every winter

 

[Al]

And the stock batteries on Subarus are a joke. My aunt's 2015 Subaru came with like a 390 CCA battery. It died at less than three years, but was out of the 36K mile warranty. I don't even want to know how these weak batteries do in places where it actually gets cold. My aunt's car never left the SF Bay Area. Compared to the stock battery's 390 CCA even a cheap battery like a 35 Economy at O'Reilly has 500 CCA.

I have never had problems with Subaru batteries. On my 07 Forester it lasted 7 years.