Which Is Better

[motorguy222]

Hey guys.

Which is better for a car/truck that is an older model?

Moly or zinc,especially in tight spots such as oil pumps and in areas that have high shear/loads and in areas that dont yet have pressure at start up.

Zinc seems to be the favorite of some but some like having a lot of moly.

Tell me wich you like and why and any information as to why you feel as you do.

 

[sciphi]

How old? If it's made in the last 20 years, it doesn't matter a whole lot. Engine technology has advanced enough to not matter then.

 

[motorguy222]

Late 70's to early 90's.

 

[Brons2]

ZDDP higher than SM/SN limits is desirable for vehicles with high spring loading on flat tappet cams, as noted by the cam manufacturers.

However, for a stock vehicle, off the shelf dino is probably fine.

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: Brons2
ZDDP higher than SM/SN limits is desirable for vehicles with high spring loading on flat tappet cams, as noted by the cam manufacturers.

However, for a stock vehicle, off the shelf dino is probably fine.


+1.

Would want enough ZDDP to offer some protection in concert withthe newer add types, then moly for fm purposes.

 

[motorguy222]

Let me word it another way.

Since SN has come about and you will get around 800ppm of zinc,give or take,how much moly should be needed to make a difference?

 

[ckmarsh]

In my 1968 F-250 with a inline 6- 300 ci motor that has a low end cam not a stock motor I use one can of moly in it when i sold it had over 350K and the motor was fine but this was a motor with the big crain low end cam so half a can of mos2 should be fine for your stock motor.

 

[CharBaby]

IMHO, these older engines are perfect candidates for High Mileage Motor Oils. Not newer engines just because they have 75,000 miles or more. Older engines that may have some leaks/burning and/or with different designs such as engines with solid rocker arms(not roller rockers) or cam & or lifter & or valve spring designs. I didn't say all of that correctly but you get my point!

Originally Posted By: motorguy222
Late 70's to early 90's.

 

[A_Harman]

Late 70's to early 90's encompasses API ratings SE to SH. During those years, the maximum allowable phosphorous content was 1200ppm. Since SJ, the API has been ratcheting down the max allowable P, first to 1000ppm, and then to 800ppm in SM. I advocate that an oil that is as close as possible to what was originally specified be used. The only widely-available SH oil that I know of is Valvoline VR1, which is available in 10w30 and 20w50 multigrades, and 30, 40, 50 & 60 monogrades. It has 1300ppm Phosphorous, so I don't really know how they can even call it SH, but there it is.

There was a thread here in the last couple of weeks that discussed Moly content based on a PowerPoint presentation by Infineum, who makes "trimer" organic moly additives. They say that 200ppm of their additive is about optimum for wear protection. Other monomer and dimer additives probably require higher concentrations to develop the same effect. The organic moly additives work by breaking down in the heat of operation to plate moly disulfide on wear surfaces. It is not the same thing as just adding MoS2 directly to the oil, which is relatively ineffective because much of the moly will get caught in the filter.

 

[cmf]

Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Late 70's to early 90's encompasses API ratings SE to SH. During those years, the maximum allowable phosphorous content was 1200ppm. Since SJ, the API has been ratcheting down the max allowable P, first to 1000ppm, and then to 800ppm in SM. I advocate that an oil that is as close as possible to what was originally specified be used. The only widely-available SH oil that I know of is Valvoline VR1, which is available in 10w30 and 20w50 multigrades, and 30, 40, 50 & 60 monogrades. It has 1300ppm Phosphorous, so I don't really know how they can even call it SH, but there it is.

There was a thread here in the last couple of weeks that discussed Moly content based on a PowerPoint presentation by Infineum, who makes "trimer" organic moly additives. They say that 200ppm of their additive is about optimum for wear protection. Other monomer and dimer additives probably require higher concentrations to develop the same effect. The organic moly additives work by breaking down in the heat of operation to plate moly disulfide on wear surfaces. It is not the same thing as just adding MoS2 directly to the oil, which is relatively ineffective because much of the moly will get caught in the filter.


Valvoline VR1 synthetic 10w30 is API certified SL. Conventional VR1 10w30 is SH and 20w50 is SM.

Conventional VR1

 

[A_Harman]

Yes, the VR1 Synthetic has lower P than VR1 conventional. It has 1000ppm, so it fits in the SL classification. (Some people have pointed out here that VR1 Syn is just Synpower with more zddp.) VR1 20w50 is SM because for 40-weights and above, limits on Phos don't apply.