What's the diff between these two oils?

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted by 1JZ_E46
I agree that 0W-40 is more "form over function." It sounds sexy and is a universal fill for any climate, but the base oil in 0W-40 is as thin or thinner than 0W-20!


Depends on the 0w-20. A predominantly PAO-based 0w-40 will use a heavier base blend than a Group III 0w-20 for example. We love to make generalizations on here but there really is quite a bit of nuance because base oil selection varies wildly.

Mobil 1 Extended Performance 0w20 for example, is likely, due to being entirely PAO-based, based heavier than Mobil 1 Full Synthetic 0w40, which uses GTL and PAO.
On the other hand, TGMO 0w-20 likely uses a lighter base with a ton of VII (hence the VI) because it is entirely Group III based, which is the case for most 0w-20's on the market.

Castrol Edge 0w-40, also, with a significant amount of PAO in the base oil blend, would be a heavier base mix than most 0w-20's

The Pennzoil SRT 0w-40, having no PAO in it, will be very lightly based.

This is somewhat evidenced though the Noack volatility numbers and that can be a great barometer here. Light bases are inherently volatile, so looking for low Noack means you are looking for not only higher quality, but heavier bases. Mobil makes the Noack figures for their PAO's readily available, which can be of value here.

So, if you have a 10w-40 with a Noack of 12% and a 0w-40 with a Noack of 8%, the 0w-40 is going to have higher quality, and possibly heavier, bases.

I will add that this was one of the reasons I specifically sought out the Ravenol 0w-40, as its Noack of 8.5% and PAO base indicate a heavier cross section of bases used in the blend. This means significantly less VII than the SRT 0w-40.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted by ChristianReske
In the german Oil Forum was a discussion again. No 0w-40 for high performance engines. Use a proper 10w-40 instead!
Why? 0w shears down, to much VI Improvers, thin baseoil, low HTHS, it´s only Marekting by AMG + Porsche.....
I cant stand this discussion anymore. Uuugh.

BTW, the last used oil analysis from Ravenaol where all not good. Al showed that the oil thinned down out of Viskositiy range quickly.

Best german Oil manufacturer is still Liqui Moly and Rowe. The used oil analysis look very good. I dont undertsand the constant bashing of Liquy Moly here in this forum. It is just proper, decent oil. Best selling brand in Germany. But, yes, maybe not worth the high import prices in the USA.

I'm so confused. So if LiquiMoly sells a 0W-40 that caries a required approval or certification, I should avoid it and buy a 10W-40 instead? What If there is no 10W-40 offered that has the required approval?

 

[OVERKILL]

Prime example of what I'm talking about:

Quaker State Defy 10w-40 has a 13% Noack. Ravenol SSL 0w-40 has an 8.5% Noack. Want to bet which has the lighter and cheaper bases?

 

[ChristianReske]

@ Overkill: Yey, spurios Assumptiums. 90% of the members in the german forum are on the "10w- offers mor protection beacuse of the thicker base oil" and "Vi Improvers are bad!" train.
Therefore, the consensu is: No 0w-40 for high performance engines.

The Ravenol oil dont have much fuel in it. PM me if you like to have the links to the used oil analysis.

@kscahcn: In the german forum, they will recomend you a Penrite 10-tenths 10w-40 or Gulf 10w-40 Racing oil.
Cold start wear dont exist, manufactuerer approvals dont exist after the car is older = out of gurantee.
It´s all about the thick base oil that offers protection and VI improvers are to avoid at all cost!

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted by ChristianReske
@ Overkill: Yey, spurios Assumptiums. 90% of the members in the german forum are on the "10w- offers mor protection beacuse of the thicker base oil" and "Vi Improvers are bad!" train.
Therefore, the consensu is: No 0w-40 for high performance engines.

The Ravenol oil dont have much fuel in it. PM me if you like to have the links to the used oil analysis.

@kscahcn: In the german forum, they will recomend you a Penrite 10-tenths 10w-40 or Gulf 10w-40 Racing oil.
Cold start wear dont exist, manufactuerer approvals dont exist after the car is older = out of gurantee.
It´s all about the thick base oil that offers protection and VI improvers are to avoid at all cost!


With a VI of 171 and a pour point of -33C, that Gulf 10w-40 certainly has VII in it.
With a VI of 164, the Penrite also has VII in it, albeit less. Flashpoint of 206C indicates a reasonably light base oil blend.

AMSOIL's VII-free 10w30 has a VI of 146, flash point of 226C, Noack of 4.2% and pour point of -37C.

Any Noack data available for those two oils? The Penrite at least appears to be PAO/Ester based, which they claim, and it is backed by the MSDS.

 

[1JZ_E46]

Thanks Overkill, very informative!

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted by 1JZ_E46
Thanks Overkill, very informative!


You are quite welcome

 

[benjy]

be assured the oils made + sold MUST use real synthetic base oils, BUT what we get in the USA could by law be either!! for a better car i would use a top of line true synthetic, for me in the USA thats Redline please!!