what are you using for personal defense ammo?

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9mm Winchester "Law Enforcement" JHP. My XD passes it no problem. Is there something better I should be spending $25/50rds on?
 
Originally Posted By: Al
Plain 'ol .45 Auto 230 FMJ Winchester white box. Anyone who can survive a couple of those has earned the right to do me in.


STUDIES HAVE PROVEN THIS TO BE ABSOLUTELY TRUE (vs. smaller bore calibers) AND IT FEEDS BEST IN 1911's! Our boys in the Service use round nose 9 mm...

I know some guys that put a HP in the pipe and then round nose in the mag. Usually it's the first shot that saves your day and you are less likely to have feeding issues.

A 230 gr round-nose also called ball ammo will usually sell at this time for $20.00/50 and will do as well or better than many HP's out there in lesser calibers especially through heavy clothing. 230 ball does not over-penetrate like 9 mm and .40 round-nose can and will.

Having said that Winchester's new Ranger PDX1 Bonded Ammo expands to .73" and is razor sharp and always retains all of it's weight. BUT at this time it's about $70.00/50 and very hard to get.

Gold Dot HP's feed best in all guns especially the 1911's if feeding is an issue for you.

"Designer" hollowpoints are so over-rated. Plain Winchester White-Box Hollowpoints for $ 30.00/50 are just as good also.
 
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Originally Posted By: Tempest
I just bought some .45 Golden Saber.


.45 ACP HydraShocks and Hornady can have feeding issues especially in 1911's.

Winchester and GS are "good feeding"

Speer Gold Dots are the best overall feeding ammo for any gun.

Feeding matters a lot to me
wink.gif
 
Originally Posted By: BearGator56
Cor-Bon 135 gr JHP+P in my Glock .40 :)


Fast and light 135-155's are the way to go in a .40 S&W or lack of penetration will be a potential problem in this caliber.
 
As I have said serveral times and I know I am in the minority on this. I do not subscribe to the magic-bullet theory but rather proficiency with your firearm and use of "quality" reliable ammo.
 
Originally Posted By: Pete591
Originally Posted By: BearGator56
Cor-Bon 135 gr JHP+P in my Glock .40 :)


Fast and light 135-155's are the way to go in a .40 S&W or lack of penetration will be a potential problem in this caliber.

Based on what? Heavier bullets tend to penetrate better than do lighter bullets.

Quote:
.45 ACP HydraShocks and Hornady can have feeding issues especially in 1911's.

All of my 1911's feed lead SWC without problems.
 
Originally Posted By: Onmo'Eegusee
9mm WWB 147gr. JHP from W-M as that was all I could get. Looking for a suitable replacement now that is not all Im limited to.

Went with 124gr +P GDHP in my USP.
 
Originally Posted By: Pete591
Originally Posted By: Al
Plain 'ol .45 Auto 230 FMJ Winchester white box. Anyone who can survive a couple of those has earned the right to do me in.


STUDIES HAVE PROVEN THIS TO BE ABSOLUTELY TRUE (vs. smaller bore calibers) AND IT FEEDS BEST IN 1911's! Our boys in the Service use round nose 9 mm...

I know some guys that put a HP in the pipe and then round nose in the mag. Usually it's the first shot that saves your day and you are less likely to have feeding issues.

A 230 gr round-nose also called ball ammo will usually sell at this time for $20.00/50 and will do as well or better than many HP's out there in lesser calibers especially through heavy clothing. 230 ball does not over-penetrate like 9 mm and .40 round-nose can and will.

Having said that Winchester's new Ranger PDX1 Bonded Ammo expands to .73" and is razor sharp and always retains all of it's weight. BUT at this time it's about $70.00/50 and very hard to get.

Gold Dot HP's feed best in all guns especially the 1911's if feeding is an issue for you.

"Designer" hollowpoints are so over-rated. Plain Winchester White-Box Hollowpoints for $ 30.00/50 are just as good also.


You mind posting these "studies"??

A lot of what you wrote is wrong. But whatever. It's up to people to do there homework.
 
Originally Posted By: Pete591
Our boys in the Service use round nose 9 mm...[/b]




This is done because the U.S. military follows the Hague Convention of 1899, which specifically prohibits any type of expanding (softpoint, hollowpoint) ammo.

It's not done because FMJ bullets "kill 'em deader".
 
Originally Posted By: rg200amp
Originally Posted By: Pete591
Originally Posted By: Al
Plain 'ol .45 Auto 230 FMJ Winchester white box. Anyone who can survive a couple of those has earned the right to do me in.


STUDIES HAVE PROVEN THIS TO BE ABSOLUTELY TRUE (vs. smaller bore calibers) AND IT FEEDS BEST IN 1911's! Our boys in the Service use round nose 9 mm...

I know some guys that put a HP in the pipe and then round nose in the mag. Usually it's the first shot that saves your day and you are less likely to have feeding issues.

A 230 gr round-nose also called ball ammo will usually sell at this time for $20.00/50 and will do as well or better than many HP's out there in lesser calibers especially through heavy clothing. 230 ball does not over-penetrate like 9 mm and .40 round-nose can and will.

Having said that Winchester's new Ranger PDX1 Bonded Ammo expands to .73" and is razor sharp and always retains all of it's weight. BUT at this time it's about $70.00/50 and very hard to get.

Gold Dot HP's feed best in all guns especially the 1911's if feeding is an issue for you.

"Designer" hollowpoints are so over-rated. Plain Winchester White-Box Hollowpoints for $ 30.00/50 are just as good also.


You mind posting these "studies"??

A lot of what you wrote is wrong. But whatever. It's up to people to do there homework.




From what I saw working in an inner-city ER major trauma hospital in Detroit...then it was murder capitol of the world..still not far from it...so many GSW's that came in with multiple 9 mm's even to the head "survived"...shotgun victims were not so lucky.

However.. in looking at the "expanded HP's most never came close to opening so very nicely as you see in geletin but rather busted up to pieces after hitting bone .. and under penetration is what likely saved the victim. I never saw a .45 ACP in the chest or head walk away. So I am biased.

Just a story based on experience.
 
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Originally Posted By: jsharp
9mm - WW 115g Silvertips.
.40 S&W - Original WW 180g Black Talons.


I need to revise my previous post. I scored 3 boxes of Winchester 9mm law enforcement ammo at a pistol course I took a few weeks ago.

So I shot up the old Silver Tips and now have these - http://www.winchester.com/lawenforcement/doc.aspx?doc=LEDocs%2fRA9124TP+revised.doc

Winchester 124g +P Ranger T series.

The best part is that the ammo was FREE!
 
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Originally Posted By: rg200amp
Originally Posted By: Pete591
Al said:
Plain 'ol .45 Auto 230 FMJ Winchester white box. Anyone who can survive a couple of those has earned the right to do me in.


STUDIES HAVE PROVEN THIS TO BE ABSOLUTELY TRUE (vs. smaller bore calibers) AND IT FEEDS BEST IN 1911's! Our boys in the Service use round nose 9 mm...

I know some guys that put a HP in the pipe and then round nose in the mag. Usually it's the first shot that saves your day and you are less likely to have feeding issues.

A 230 gr round-nose also called ball ammo will usually sell at this time for $20.00/50 and will do as well or better than many HP's out there in lesser calibers especially through heavy clothing. 230 ball does not over-penetrate like 9 mm and .40 round-nose can and will.

Having said that Winchester's new Ranger PDX1 Bonded Ammo expands to .73" and is razor sharp and always retains all of it's weight. BUT at this time it's about $70.00/50 and very hard to get.

Gold Dot HP's feed best in all guns especially the 1911's if feeding is an issue for you.

"Designer" hollowpoints are so over-rated. Plain Winchester White-Box Hollowpoints for $ 30.00/50 are just as good also.


You mind posting these "studies"??


(A lot of what you wrote is wrong. But whatever. It's up to people to do there homework.




I am saying this to clarify a bit more:

-.45 ACP Round nose is more effective than 9 mm or .40 S&W round nose all things being equal.... period.

-Autopsy reports often show that HP's do not expand...may bust to pieces after hitting bone and limit penetration to vital organs. A .45 round nose won't do that and penetration is always good..over-penetration not the issue as it is with 9 mm and .40 S&W round nose. +1 for .45 ACP ball ammo.

-If you are lucky.. in real life.. a 9mm Hp expands to .40" or .40 S&W HP will reach expansion of around .45". A .45 ACP can and will reach .47" which is nearly a 50 caliber. Wound channel size is critical.

(From my many years of experience in a Major Trauma Center ER in Detroit... this is typical real life stuff...the fancy tests in denim covered gelatin has been proven to be mis-leading in real life LE situations over and over. Gotta add in a sternum/rib cage/muscle/tendons etc and these are all point blank straight on shots to the test material. Remember the FBI said they were done testing (9mm bad to the 10 mm good) (officers lost with 10 mm)...then the .40 S&W ( still not happy) FBI SWAT all have .45 ACP's. I am not out here alone. US Elite forces use .45 ACP.)
wink.gif


Did some additional research on several forums:

I stand corrected on what the consensus of the best feeding ammo in a 1911 HP is and that is Golden Sabre' and they now offer this in bonded as well.

Bonded ammo "levels the playing fieled" and Winchester PDX! Ranger LE and Golden Sabre' Bonded gives outstandin results in all calibers. It's new and won't bust to pieces and has the "potential" to expand better than previous non-bonded ammo.

Bonded Golden Sabre' 230 +P looks like a winner.

...just my .02

LLet me know your feelings...
wink.gif



 
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"I know some guys that put a HP in the pipe and then round nose in the mag"

Yes, I will admit that I do this. The decision to do so is from a purely reliability stand point.
 
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Do people really have that much trouble with different types of .45 ammo in 1911 pattern guns? My stock Series 70 Commander would feed about anything reliably. Now that's it's been "worked on" it will still feed anything including empties.

I typically shoot SWC's through it and it's as reliable as any other pistol I own. So is this "problem" more imagined than real?
 
Originally Posted By: jsharp
Do people really have that much trouble with different types of .45 ammo in 1911 pattern guns? My stock Series 70 Commander would feed about anything reliably. Now that's it's been "worked on" it will still feed anything including empties.

I typically shoot SWC's through it and it's as reliable as any other pistol I own. So is this "problem" more imagined than real?



Throated barrels/polished ramps/extractor tuning..etc..WORK!

If any 1911 feed casings it will most likely feed anything.
 
i'm a fan of winchester ranger t ammo.9mm 147 grain,.45 acp 230 grain.whoever said that the "old" black talon was outdated,they don't know what they are taling about.i compared a impromptu penetration/expansion water jug test and the 10 year old black talon looked meaner than the supposedly improved ranger t series.though the ranger t series was no slouch the black talons claws appeared to be thicker and did not open too far as compared to the rangers.if i would have only known back before they were pulled from the shelf i would have bough a pile of them.
 
Im using Speer Gold Dots in my Steyr M9 (9mm 124gr) and my Beretta 8040 (40S&W 155gr) carry guns.

In my CAR-15 I am using Hornady TAP 55gr.

In my AK I have just some plain Wolf 7.62x39mm 122gr Hollow Points at the moment, but will be putting in some Hornady TAP when the local shop gets it in.
 
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