VW class action lawsuit on MK7/MQB water pumps finally paid out!

[Torrid]

My daughters friend was over one time and she had her check engine light on in her old focus (maybe 20-teens so like 2015 or something). I said I would take a look, turned out it was just the 02 sensor...sucker had 189k miles on it. Shocked she changed the oil at all but according to her every time the light came on she would "take it to the mechanic" to change the oil. She has no idea what was going in or out of the engine. But this time she said "The light wouldn't go away" lol. Different light.

My father was a mechanic and at one point he did the same. Just quit. Mechanics are interesting, they know how to do much more than work on cars, so not like he was out of work. Bought a Toyota Avalon, and it runs.

That is why I got my Si. Its salvage title, but easy rear end fix and it became my fun car/track car for under 10k USD. (But then you know, new turbo, new brakes, new wheels, new tires, and that just added up to the price of a new one).

I've had two vehicles that had me shunning Fords. One was a 2004 Lincoln LS that became mechanically totaled with only 60k miles due to lack of parts. No aftermarket to replace and FMC no longer made the part. What got me most what it was an emissions module. The car was only 13 years old. I'm pretty sure most modern Fords have the OCI reminder light. That's definitely why they did it. Even knowing and working on cars I find some of the costs annoying and I do have a tendency to follow the most restrictive maintenance schedules, so I can only imagine what the more normal car user that doesn't care about all this thinks when service comes up.

The second was a 2014 Ford Edge. It was the vehicle that replaced the Lincoln. Braking system completely failed 3 times in 11 months. Brake pedal would fall to the floor. There was a TSB about the issue. Somehow my VIN fell out of the range. Total spent to fix was $3k. The third time when it was fixed I immediately sold it to Carvana and ended up buying the Tesla. I really hope it treats the next owner well, but I didn't trust private selling it after how it was for us. My F150 was great, but it was missing some tech I wanted and I was less than pleased with the fuel economy once my driving needs basically doubled the miles I was covering. That's when I bought the GTI. I would not consider another Ford just because of the LS and the Edge.

 

[TiGeo]

99% of my friends are BMW or Audi fans haha, and they always try to justify their expenses by "Well I bought it salvage and fixed it so even after all the money I throw at it I will break even/make money". But if I take all their constant expenses and overlay that over a new clean title vehicle and the depreciation, you are loosing money at such a fast rate that it isn't worth it. And its not like the car doesn't run, it just doesn't run well or leaks or has random sensors go bad or something.

I remember one time my friend was mad that he couldn't start his bmw because it was jacked up in the front, and if it wasn't level or something it wouldn't let him do anything. Hilarious. Why would I bother with a car that literally wants to make my life harder.

Please don't say they are like ford, that makes me think they are going down hill like ford is

To own an older BMW/Audi, you really need to be a maintenance freak. I've had a variety of vehicles/brands in my life with no real issues b/c....I just really take care of my things and fix things/do preventives before it gets more serious. Ford by meaning they are a pedestrian brand, not a lux brand. VW is literally "the people's car". My instructor last weekend at the track was in an early '00s Audi S4, beast of a track car with the twin-turbo V6. I still can't believe I nearly daily my B5.5 Passat W8...been v. good once I caught up on all the typical bits that the previous owner(s) didn't do and the common failure points - it is over 20 years old....

 

[TiGeo]

My daughters friend was over one time and she had her check engine light on in her old focus (maybe 20-teens so like 2015 or something). I said I would take a look, turned out it was just the 02 sensor...sucker had 189k miles on it. Shocked she changed the oil at all but according to her every time the light came on she would "take it to the mechanic" to change the oil. She has no idea what was going in or out of the engine. But this time she said "The light wouldn't go away" lol. Different light.

My father was a mechanic and at one point he did the same. Just quit. Mechanics are interesting, they know how to do much more than work on cars, so not like he was out of work. Bought a Toyota Avalon, and it runs.

That is why I got my Si. Its salvage title, but easy rear end fix and it became my fun car/track car for 10k USD. (But then you know, new turbo, new brakes, new wheels, new tires, and that just added up to the price of a new one).

My '13 Focus is the most reliable/cheapest to own car I've ever had - bought it new, SE trim but all possible options so actually pretty nice. 10 years and counting and only a few things I've replaced. I did however opt for the 5-speed as the DCT was a huge pile of steaming dung on that one. My oldest at college has it now and he autocrosses it. Great little car. Handles well with some basic mods.

 

[VTECOverRated]

To own an older BMW/Audi, you really need to be a maintenance freak. I've had a variety of vehicles/brands in my life with no real issues b/c....I just really take care of my things and fix things/do preventives before it gets more serious. Ford by meaning they are a pedestrian brand, not a lux brand. VW is literally "the people's car". My instructor last weekend at the track was in an early '00s Audi S4, beast of a track car with the twin-turbo V6. I still can't believe I nearly daily my B5.5 Passat W8...been v. good once I caught up on all the typical bits that the previous owner(s) didn't do and the common failure points - it is over 20 years old....

View attachment 187695

I have seen that meme before its definitely a human thing. But I guess old for BMW is over 3-4 years old and 50k miles.

 

[bowlofturtle]

are we supposed to "maintain" coolant or do any silly thing to keep the water pump from leaking?

Our Tiguan is not part of this class action, as they "should have fixed it by 2020" but you know it goes, I don't want to hear that I declined a coolant flush at 60k, and that caused my pump to leak. I think most coolants are good for 10y/100k if not longer.

 

[TiGeo]

are we supposed to "maintain" coolant or do any silly thing to keep the water pump from leaking?

Our Tiguan is not part of this class action, as they "should have fixed it by 2020" but you know it goes, I don't want to hear that I declined a coolant flush at 60k, and that caused my pump to leak. I think most coolants are good for 10y/100k if not longer.

No maintenance beyond using the appropriate coolant is listed in the owner's manual. That's all I showed/signed something saying I maintained it.

 

[Torrid]

are we supposed to "maintain" coolant or do any silly thing to keep the water pump from leaking?

Our Tiguan is not part of this class action, as they "should have fixed it by 2020" but you know it goes, I don't want to hear that I declined a coolant flush at 60k, and that caused my pump to leak. I think most coolants are good for 10y/100k if not longer.

I think that would only be a problem if that was a scheduled interval for the coolant and you decided to skip it. Personally I like to change the coolant every 4-5 years. Mine had it done at the dealer at the end of last year because the heater core had to be replaced.

I'd have to look, but I don't think VW has a coolant change interval which is funny because they have one for literally everything else in the car and at least for the 6 speed DSGs they had the shortest gearbox fluid mileage recommendation I've seen on a modern car.

 

[TiGeo]

I think that would only be a problem if that was a scheduled interval for the coolant and you decided to skip it. Personally I like to change the coolant every 4-5 years. Mine had it done at the dealer at the end of last year because the heater core had to be replaced.

I'd have to look, but I don't think VW has a coolant change interval which is funny because they have one for literally everything else in the car and at least for the 6 speed DSGs they had the shortest gearbox fluid mileage recommendation I've seen on a modern car.

As I said above...no coolant interval.

 

[MCompact]

I wish I knew the BMW “experts” in this thread back in 1983. 12 BMWs and 1 Mercedes-AMG later I’m now living in a cardboard box under an inner city overpass…

 

[4WD]

I wish I knew the BMW “experts” in this thread back in 1983. 12 BMWs and 1 Mercedes-AMG later I’m now living in a cardboard box under an inner city overpass…

Best hope Xi Jinping is not about to visit

 

[xgmad]

Is dodging such repair responsibilities common at VW?

Yeah, at least for me is why i waive warranties in the first place.

 

[dgunay]

So happy I don't do VW's. Leaks, seals, random gremlins.
The spectrum for me personally is
Koreans - S tier failures, just garbage mechanically
Americans - A tier failures, good v8's and garbage everything else
Germans - B tier failures, hot or miss by engine family or year, hit or miss, flip a coin and find out
Japanese - C tier - too reliable to have fun, makes them slower and more boring but at least my wallet and time is saved 99.9% of the time.
Toyota - F tier - take it to war zone.

I jest. I know TiGeo swears by VW's so if it runs it runs (yet everyone in my family loves VW's yet every single one of them is either in the shop or getting out of warranty repair on literally everything except the block lol).

I don't think I have even needed to keep a record on my japanese cars. Light comes on, change oil, get 250k miles, and go wow...that happened.

Too much generalization in one post.

It's important to remember even Japanese brands are no longer as reliable as 10-20 years ago, Toyota may be an exception. 1.5T Honda engines (you own one of them) has severe oil dilution issues. Earlier models have head gasket issues as well. 2012-2017 is the worst era for Honda, there were a lot of problems. They tried to hide most mechanical/engineering issues with software updates including 1.5T engines, or torque converter issues in my '14 CR-V which I sold few months ago.

Koreans get great reliability ratings, the biggest issue is service quality for them. Their dealers suck, and corporate doesn't give a f** about it. I'm not a fan of them anyways, but it doesn't change the fact that their cars have come a long way.

If you own a German car, you treat it like a German car. Follow OCI or ideally keep it shorter, use the right spec oil and other parts. You can't get the cheapest oil from Walmart and dump it every 15k - but most people just don't care. If you treat it like a Toyota, there will be issues.

 

[VTECOverRated]

Too much generalization in one post.

It's important to remember even Japanese brands are no longer as reliable as 10-20 years ago, Toyota may be an exception. 1.5T Honda engines (you own one of them) has severe oil dilution issues. Earlier models have head gasket issues as well. 2012-2017 is the worst era for Honda, and there were many issues.

The "S tier" Korean brands according to your post get great reliability ratings, the biggest issue is service quality for them. Their dealers suck, and corporate doesn't give a f** about it. I'm not a fan of them anyways, but it doesn't change the fact that their cars have come a long way.

If you own a German car, you treat it like a German car. Follow OCI religiously or keep it shorter, use the right spec oil and other parts. You can't get the cheapest oil from Walmart and dump it every 15k - but most people just don't care. If you treat it like a Toyota, there will be issues.

As someone who works on honda,s even the "worst" honda's outlast the average german make. Can one make a german car last a long time? 100%. I have friends who exclusively drive BMW's and have them tuned to the moon and back, and they have hundreds of thousands of miles on them. But these are people who 1) know how to work on them 2) know how to maintain them and 3) know how to not break them. The average honda toyota owner goes to a dealership that has a 18 year old out of highschool do oil changes on it at 10k intervals and they still go 100k miles without an issue, without needing plugs, coolants, brake fluids, and the rest of the massive list of "mandatory german preventative maintenance". The point is, that even the worst honda, requires very little work to stay on the road. Do some of them blow a head gasket? Yes, a very small amount, very, very small amount of them do. My 1.5 is pushing almost double the factory output on completely stock internals, without a single issue even on track! So no, I don't know, dilution be ****ed, with regular oil changes its not a big concern since the wear is minimal, as many UOAs here prove. The average toyota owner probably doesn't even change the oil on time even at 10k intervals, and they just keep chugging along. Unless its driver error, honda's and toyota's factually outlast the germans, on average. I didn't say there aren't bad apples, but when a honda burns oil its deemed to be a feature, not somethign that needs fixing right away. Every single make is also prone to "new mode' syndrome, where a brand new engine has faults in the very early units, which are very quickly sorted out, and here is the real trick, considering how many toyota's and honda's are sold, and mind you, VW sells about 300k cars COMBINED PER YEAR where as the civic ALONE outsells the entire company in the US. Heck, the corolla and civic combined probably outsell ALL GERMAN CARS IN THE USA COMBINED. So considering how few issues they do have, over a percentage, its what, 0.01% of them fail? Its impressive and straight up guarantees that you will have a great ownership experience buying one.

Besides your last sentance proves my entire point, treat it like a german car. That ** is an instant *** for most buyers because they can't take care of ANY car, let alone a german one with an asterisk.

Toyota/Honda have blessed us with tanks bound for syria in comuter car form. Why buy anything else unless you are bored? I don't mind, buy what ever you want and I pray it serves you well and long and doesn't go bad. Seriously. But If someone asks me what car they should buy and they don't really know much past oil changes, I will just say Honda/Toyota.

This doesn't even factor in that they are easier to work on for a newbie. Many young kids back in the day cut their teeth on honda's because of how forgiving they were to work on, and it didn't break the bank.

PS

I think you mixed up my korean point, Go re-read. I said "S Tier Failures". Which is the opposite of reliable.

Cheers

 

[dgunay]

As someone who works on honda,s even the "worst" honda's outlast the average german make. Can one make a german car last a long time? 100%. I have friends who exclusively drive BMW's and have them tuned to the moon and back, and they have hundreds of thousands of miles on them. But these are people who 1) know how to work on them 2) know how to maintain them and 3) know how to not break them. The average honda toyota owner goes to a dealership that has a 18 year old out of highschool do oil changes on it at 10k intervals and they still go 100k miles without an issue, without needing plugs, coolants, brake fluids, and the rest of the massive list of "mandatory german preventative maintenance". The point is, that even the worst honda, requires very little work to stay on the road. Do some of them blow a head gasket? Yes, a very small amount, very, very small amount of them do. My 1.5 is pushing almost double the factory output on completely stock internals, without a single issue even on track! So no, I don't know, dilution be ****ed, with regular oil changes its not a big concern since the wear is minimal, as many UOAs here prove. The average toyota owner probably doesn't even change the oil on time even at 10k intervals, and they just keep chugging along. Unless its driver error, honda's and toyota's factually outlast the germans, on average. I didn't say there aren't bad apples, but when a honda burns oil its deemed to be a feature, not somethign that needs fixing right away. Every single make is also prone to "new mode' syndrome, where a brand new engine has faults in the very early units, which are very quickly sorted out, and here is the real trick, considering how many toyota's and honda's are sold, and mind you, VW sells about 300k cars COMBINED PER YEAR where as the civic ALONE outsells the entire company in the US. Heck, the corolla and civic combined probably outsell ALL GERMAN CARS IN THE USA COMBINED. So considering how few issues they do have, over a percentage, its what, 0.01% of them fail? Its impressive and straight up guarantees that you will have a great ownership experience buying one.

Besides your last sentance proves my entire point, treat it like a german car. That ** is an instant *** for most buyers because they can't take care of ANY car, let alone a german one with an asterisk.

Toyota/Honda have blessed us with tanks bound for syria in comuter car form. Why buy anything else unless you are bored? I don't mind, buy what ever you want and I pray it serves you well and long and doesn't go bad. Seriously. But If someone asks me what car they should buy and they don't really know much past oil changes, I will just say Honda/Toyota.

This doesn't even factor in that they are easier to work on for a newbie. Many young kids back in the day cut their teeth on honda's because of how forgiving they were to work on, and it didn't break the bank.

PS

I think you mixed up my korean point, Go re-read. I said "S Tier Failures". Which is the opposite of reliable.

Cheers

Can't talk about the other Germans, but I'd rather have fragile water pump with my gen 3/4 EA888 than oil dilution issues with the Honda's "reliable" 1.5T engine. Not to mention people get 400+ horsepower with minimal mods and been driving for 100-150k miles reliably with the gen 3 EA888.

I used to be a Honda guy, always bought Hondas for the last 15 years before switching VW, not because VW is more reliable (it's not) - but I've had issues with 2014 CR-V and decided not to buy any other Honda (with the exception of the Type-R.). If I'm having issues anyways, might as well switch to the "dark side" and enjoy more refined (and fun) driving experience instead of suffering in a tin can.

Here is my thread: https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/any-cars-you-regret-buying-my-14-cr-v-experience.348005/

 

[VTECOverRated]

Can't talk about the other Germans, but I'd rather have fragile water pump with my gen 3/4 EA888 than oil dilution issues with the Honda's "reliable" 1.5T engine. Not to mention people get 400+ horsepower with minimal mods and been driving for 100-150k miles reliably with the gen 3 EA888.

I used to be a Honda guy, always bought Hondas for the last 15 years before switching VW, not because VW is more reliable (it's not) - but I've had issues with 2014 CR-V and decided not to buy any other Honda (with the exception of the Type-R.). If I'm having issues anyways, might as well switch to the "dark side" and enjoy more refined (and fun) driving experience instead of suffering in a tin can.

Here is my thread: https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/any-cars-you-regret-buying-my-14-cr-v-experience.348005/

Honda has put out like what, 2-3 million 10 million 1.5 turbos in the last 10 years? And how many have had issues? 100? 1000? heck 10,000?, heck, 50,000? That is still tiny compared to the over all volume sold, considering that like I said before, that is more than ALL german makes combined, across all models, are outsold by ONE engine.

Point closed, you have no idea what you are talking about. Mechanically losing a water pump = immediate engine failure and overheating. Fuel dilution can be mitigated by simply changing the oil on time. You are delusional.

Your own post summarizes that you have buyers remorse for no reason at all other than you live in canada and get shafted by the pricing. So go cry else where? I have zero sympathy for you anymore lol. You can't even compare quality correctly. Tin can? Every VW was a tin can in 2014, just like every honda. Go drive a 2021 crv to compare to your "new" vw. Jesus I have to explain how to use brain cells? The atlas is 60k CAD while the honda is over 20k cheaper. How are you even trying to argue this?

 

[dgunay]

Honda has put out like what, 2-3 million 10 million 1.5 turbos in the last 10 years? And how many have had issues? 100? 1000? heck 10,000?, heck, 50,000? That is still tiny compared to the over all volume sold, considering that like I said before, that is more than ALL german makes combined, across all models, are outsold by ONE engine.

Point closed, you have no idea what you are talking about. Your own post summarizes that you have buyers remorse for no reason at all other than you live in canada and get shafted by the pricing. So go cry else where? I have zero sympathy for you anymore lol.

Why so mean?

Just because Honda sells more cars, it doesn't mean it is better. It means people can afford a Honda or Acura, not a BMW, Mercedes-Benz, etc. They are different products for different audience. Your argument is pointless.

VW is an exception. Their North American models were not a good fit and they failed competing from 2000-2015, they sell more cars in Europe and in Asia than here.

I drive all of the cars you mentioned on a weekly basis as I do car reviews, so I have an idea what I'm talking about. Honda is not the Honda from 10 years ago. Just stop being a butthurt fanboy.

 

[VTECOverRated]

Why so mean?

Just because Honda sells more cars, it doesn't mean it is better. It means people can afford a Honda or Acura, not a BMW, Mercedes-Benz, etc. Your argument is pointless.

I drive all of the cars you mentioned on a weekly basis as I do car reviews, so I have an idea what I'm talking about. Honda is not the Honda from 10 years ago. Just stop being a butthurt fanboy.

Thanks you're making me laugh really hard mate. I'm dying here

 

[dgunay]

Thanks you're making me laugh really hard mate. I'm dying here

We'll talk when you have a chance to drive other cars than a Honda and Toyota.

 

[dgunay]

Honda has put out like what, 2-3 million 10 million 1.5 turbos in the last 10 years? And how many have had issues? 100? 1000? heck 10,000?, heck, 50,000? That is still tiny compared to the over all volume sold, considering that like I said before, that is more than ALL german makes combined, across all models, are outsold by ONE engine.

Point closed, you have no idea what you are talking about. Mechanically losing a water pump = immediate engine failure and overheating. Fuel dilution can be mitigated by simply changing the oil on time. You are delusional.

Your own post summarizes that you have buyers remorse for no reason at all other than you live in canada and get shafted by the pricing. So go cry else where? I have zero sympathy for you anymore lol. You can't even compare quality correctly. Tin can? Every VW was a tin can in 2014, just like every honda. Go drive a 2021 crv to compare to your "new" vw. Jesus I have to explain how to use brain cells? The atlas is 60k CAD while the honda is over 20k cheaper. How are you even trying to argue this?

I'm not sure if you are trolling or if you are dumber than a rock, because everything you said is wrong.

Let me explain one last time and will try to simplify it to a 6-year old:

1) Honda is the 4th bestseller in North America, VW is 6th bestseller. VW sells TWICE as many vehicles globally. 2022 numbers are 8.2 million vehicles for VW, second bestseller right after Toyota (9.5 million), the number is 4.1 million vehicles for Honda. Get your facts straight before wasting people's time here.

2) EA888 water pumps do not fail, they just slowly leak. You can just top up and continue driving. If it happens early, people go to dealer and change it for free (warranty). If you are out-of-warranty, you can choose an aftermarket water pump with metal housing for a permanent fix. Do not talk if you don't know what it is.

3) Fuel dilution is harmful to the engine, even if you change it early. Gasoline is a solvent and kills the oil. It is a poorly engineered motor, period. 1.5T engine is a failure from the beginning and Honda put a bandaid to an engineering/mechanical problem with a software update globally.

I even talked to Honda reps/engineers, I was told the only reason why 1.5T exists is that K20/K24 engines were unable to keep up with the emissions, otherwise they would have kept and upgraded the K-Series as the mainstream choice. 1.5T is here because Honda had no choice but to get rid of a perfectly capable and versatile drivetrain and had to replace it with a sub-par platform exists because of a necessity, thanks to your government.

The worst part is that they put that poor engine to a "performance-oriented" SI, which is shredded by everyone in its segment LOL. Poor guy trying to keep up with base Mazda 3s with that HDMI port-like exhaust tips

You can replace a water pump, but you cannot fix a poorly engineered motor, simple as that.

4) Atlas is not a direct competition with the CR-V. Are you really that ignorant? The more you talk, the more you sound you have no idea about cars. Let me teach you: Atlas is a 3-row SUV that competes with the Pilot, CR-V competes with Tiguan. I think the new CR-V is better than the Tiguan, I drove both and that's my conclusion. I'm not a fanboy like you.

5) Atlas' interior (updated 2024 MY) is not comparable with the CR-V and/or Pilot, it is so much better, and costs less than top trim CR-V, let alone the Pilot.

I bet you didn't even sit in any of the models, but talking here. I've been driving every mainstream/premium/luxury vehicle available in North America for the last 6 years, not a 10-minute test drive on a dealer lot. I've been driving each vehicle for 1 to 4 weeks depending on availability. So just shut up and don't tell me which car or interior is better.

6) Speaking of Honda Pilot: The interior sucks, they just put that tiny 7" screen with bunch of cheap plastics and monochromatic interior and called it a day. The worst part is, this is a brand new platform and the interior looks old from the day 1. Yes, I drove that too, also will drive another one with different trim again in February. Oh, did I mention I do car reviews?

7) Do not talk if you have no knowledge or if you haven't driven the vehicles you listed. It makes you look dumber.

 

[Rand]

Let's see...

'18 VW Sportwagen (1.8 TSI) - water pump at 73K (subject of this post)
'18 VW Atlas (3.6 VR6) - water pump at 37K (warranty)
'00 VW Jetta - (2.0) - water pump around 130K if memory serves
3 Hondas - no issues
2 Toyotas - no issues
2 Fords - no issues

VWs and water pumps....like peas and carrots! Really, BMWs had a thing for the entire cooling system being effectively a maintenance items if you kept them long enough (E36/46, E39). Whatever....love German cars!

Did VW design the cruze cooling system... A friend wants to know.