VTM-4 fluid vs Dual Pump II fluid ?

[UncleDave]

My Ridgeline differential calls for Dual Pump II fluid, but I see Honda/Acura VTM-4 being substituted quite frequently.

Even dealers seem to believe either can be used, but no one can give me a reason why it is or isn't ok.

I have answered to others prior to use Dual Pump - but only because Im following the letter of the law in the manual.

Can anyone offer anything concrete on the subject?

Thanks!

 

[slacktide_bitog]

Was Dual Pump superseded by VTM-4?

 

[hrv]

My Ridgeline differential calls for Dual Pump II fluid, but I see Honda/Acura VTM-4 being substituted quite frequently.

Even dealers seem to believe either can be used, but no one can give me a reason why it is or isn't ok.

I have answered to others prior to use Dual Pump - but only because Im following the letter of the law in the manual.

Can anyone offer anything concrete on the subject?

Thanks!

The Acura version is safe and is the same stuff...

 

[UncleDave]

Was Dual Pump superseded by VTM-4?

No

Both products are available today.

 

[UncleDave]

The Acura version is safe and is the same stuff...

The gallon of new VTM4 in my garage really likes hearing that........

I bought it then got caught up in the dual pump / vtm4 debacle ..and went with the dual pump - at least while under warranty.

Its been sitting waiting for a home somewhere- my differential would be the ideal place.

Any specific experience or info regarding your input?

 

[UncleDave]

Interesting the dealer uses them interchangeably....

 

[UncleDave]

Looks close but not identical - close enough for government work though....

Took the risk and swapped - fluid ran perfectly clear. Should have waited.

Running in mountains exclusively and based on manual I should shorten the interval so Im being conservative

The diff is overdriven a low % and the clutches consume themselves but are good for a " lifetime".

 

[UncleDave]

Other evidence of interchangeability....

 

[UncleDave]

From the ridgeline forum -

 

[meep]

The ridgeline should use the vtm fluid - that rear axle is basically a spool with electromagnetic wet clutches to either axle. It’s a different architecture than the dual pump differential used in the crvs. The service interval on the trhe dual pump system is quite short - if memory serves the Gen 1s were every 15000. We had a Gen 1 mdx with the VTM system (sh-awd) and I think the interval in that was more like 40k? And yes, VTM fluid came out pretty nice, whereas DP fluid looked beat up, every time.

 

[The Critic]

I have never seen any official info suggesting that the two are interchangeable. All of my service info states the 17 Ridgeline should only be using Honda Dual Pump fluid (or the Acura version, since the Honda one has been on b/o for a while).

 

[meep]

I have never seen any official info suggesting that the two are interchangeable. All of my service info states the 17 Ridgeline should only be using Honda Dual Pump fluid (or the Acura version, since the Honda one has been on b/o for a while).
View attachment 99298

@The Critic, that surprises me - (that the ridgeline calls for DP fluid). Does it use the Dual Pump AWD gearbox, or the same gears used in the mdx?

 

[The Critic]

@The Critic, that surprises me - (that the ridgeline calls for DP fluid). Does it use the Dual Pump AWD gearbox, or the same gears used in the mdx?

Honestly not sure.

 

[UncleDave]

@The Critic, that surprises me - (that the ridgeline calls for DP fluid). Does it use the Dual Pump AWD gearbox, or the same gears used in the mdx?

Im pretty sure the 2017 and up - IVTM4 spec's is the same as acuras SH/AWD and both spec Dual pump II/ DPSF.

After looking at it again for the 100nth time I'm pretty sure I have a differential filled with the wrong oil.

The overdrive on on the electronically clutched SH/AWD - Ridgeline is 2.8% constant vs .8 for the older style ball and ramp differential.

Im going to go source some Dual pump II and ditch it......although Im guessing its a little like putting different oil in a crankcase in that it wont do much if any harm.

 

[KlubMarcus]

Honestly not sure.

The 2017 Honda Pilot Elite AWD manual recommends Dual Pump II, but the Honda dealership ran out and is selling Acura brand "All-Wheel Drive Fluid" instead. Pilot and Ridgeline are on the same platform. No problems to report since the rear diff fluid change over a year ago.

 

[tbm5690]

Re-opening this debate as I am soon due for an SH-AWD fluid swap. Last time I was due and went down this rabbit hole there was enough conflicting information regarding whether or not Acura AWD Fluid (DPSF) was the same as the Honda DPF II. At that time don't believe VTM-4 fluid was a thing, so now that even further muddies the waters. Last D&F I bought the Acura DPSF for peace of mind, and honestly I don't expect the price difference to be that much different between the Acura and Honda fluids but in the event that I can pay less and buy at my local Honda dealer (no local Acura dealer) vs shipping from an online Acura site I'm interested in getting to the bottom of this.

My understanding on the various systems is:

-Acura SH-AWD = Honda VTM-4 (hardware, that is)
SH-AWD came first and was exclusive to Acura, but then the redesigned 2016 Pilot brought VTM-4 which is SH-AWD for the Honda line. Acura AWD DPSF specified for Acura, and now VTM-4 specified for Hondas?

-Honda "standard" (non torque-vectoring) AWD found in the CR-V specifies the Dual Pump II?

If I'm wrong please set me straight!

 

[rszappa1]

Re-opening this debate as I am soon due for an SH-AWD fluid swap. Last time I was due and went down this rabbit hole there was enough conflicting information regarding whether or not Acura AWD Fluid (DPSF) was the same as the Honda DPF II. At that time don't believe VTM-4 fluid was a thing, so now that even further muddies the waters. Last D&F I bought the Acura DPSF for peace of mind, and honestly I don't expect the price difference to be that much different between the Acura and Honda fluids but in the event that I can pay less and buy at my local Honda dealer (no local Acura dealer) vs shipping from an online Acura site I'm interested in getting to the bottom of this.

My understanding on the various systems is:

-Acura SH-AWD = Honda VTM-4 (hardware, that is)
SH-AWD came first and was exclusive to Acura, but then the redesigned 2016 Pilot brought VTM-4 which is SH-AWD for the Honda line. Acura AWD DPSF specified for Acura, and now VTM-4 specified for Hondas?

-Honda "standard" (non torque-vectoring) AWD found in the CR-V specifies the Dual Pump II?

If I'm wrong please set me straight!

Its the same...I have used both with no issues in my suv....

 

[GSCJR]

Let me confuse everyone further; I use ATF in the Honda diffs I've serviced.