Viscosity Grade recommendation for Death Valley

[cptbarkey]

Hey look I don’t doubt anything these young wipper snappers are doing now. I mean hey they are changing genders and making people Believe they are the opposite sex. They are changing the whole body, you don’t think they can change physics.

Fascinating insight. Are you drunk?

 

[OilUzer]

I fully agree, interesting information in this thread that went in a direction most threads here don’t. I only said your mind was made up from the start because your replies to suggestions and ideas indicate you already know what you want to do.

I would say for the most parts yes, and you are 95% correct!

The other 5% :
This is the internet and if we were chatting, others would have known that there is more to the story and I was considering driving down to Vegas (annual trip to visit relatives) with a thin oil. No MOFT, no trip. lol so I was kind of on the fence!

Last year we purchase a new car still running on free dealer 0W-20. I have no issues with it doing local drives ... I was trying to decide if I should drive with 0W-20 to Vegas or use one of our older cars currently running on Valvoline EP 5W-30, M1 EP 10W-30 and one on either Kirkland 5W-30 or Castrol GTX Magnatec 10W-30 (I can't recall) but all are "Full Syn" or that's what the jugs say.

---

I have M1 Euro 5W and 0W-40 in the garage but hate to dump the fresh 0W-20 (less than 500 miles) and take that car.

Concerned with thin oil combined with the fact the the new car did NOT come with a roof rack or even any horizontal rails (manufacturers are getting cheaper and cheaper) made me change my mind. I didn't want to rush and buy a new roof rack. And don't like to dump the fresh 0W-20 for 0W-40.
So currently the plan is to drive down with M1 EP 10W-30 car since last year I also changed the coolant and all other fluids in this car.
So basically, I was on the fence for using the 0W-20. Well, kind of.
It would have been interesting if this car had a rack. Can't tell what I would've done! Maybe dump the 20 grade for 40 or flip a coin or re-read this thread! lol

Now the bigger question is how much HP does a horse have?

"The horsepower unit derives from a marketing gimmick devised by James Watt. When attempting to sell his newly invented steam engine in the 1770s, Watt realised that many of his customers would use the machine to replace horses, so he set out to measure the power delivered by a horse."

 

[Highlander 1459]

This is an amazing thread. Changing physics.

personally I find it groundbreaking... some are't changing physics, they are revoltionizing them with the promotion of string horsepower theory.

 

[Highlander 1459]

All of this because someone thinks they need a higher grade oil to drive where it's hot.

and what was the common concensus on that?

 

[TiGeo]

and what was the common concensus on that?

Jury is out. I say no. Others say yes. A true conundrum.

 

[Highlander 1459]

Jury is out. I say no. Others say yes. A true conundrum.

I tend towards thinking the people who designed the cars tested it at higher temperatures than in Death Valley, and colder temps than you normally get in International Falls, so whatever they recommend is probably good enough.

 

[Astro14]

Jury is out. I say no. Others say yes. A true conundrum.

A conundrum which could easily be solved by monitoring the actual oil temperature of the vehicle in question.

Without that - it’s all just guessing.

Guessing that higher ambient temperature leads to higher oil temperature without taking into account cooling system performance or oil cooler (if any) performance.

Which is really guessing.

Meanwhile, the guy who actually lives there, uses 0W20 in his Toyota.

 

[svenson]

This video was posted in the other thread about, "What Makes A European Formula Oil?" Someone in that thread questioned where that piston came from?

It's almost identical to the damaged piston in the lower video short, that states it came from direct injection pre ignition. Has anyone had this happen to them, or know someone that has?

In Dave's short video, he mentions using a additive to help keep the injectors clean, so the fuel completely atomizes, and this doesn't happen. It's obviously a real problem because he's holding the results of it in his hand.

I wonder what the best additive is for this? I've been using Gumout Multi System Tune Up. But I wonder if there is a better product?

Redline SI-1 or Gumout Regane are also good complete fuel system cleaners. Not sure if Gumout Regane is better than the Gumout Multi System Tune Up.

i have been in trouble with my direct injection system and my injectors.i replaced them twice.i did open a topic telling you guys my adventure and perhaps find a solution, even though i knew that the answer was that this part was problematic and nothing out here will make it work without trouble.
and a member with a german flag confirmed this to us .so what i learned is that if your injectors are problematic the only thing you can do is to delay their failure.
but for whom ever concerns about the best ones, here in Europe we use mostly wurth which is very cheap and liqui moly.and we the bmw owners use the one from the factory which i am sure is made by Techron, bcs of its shape.
but me searching on the ineternet weeks ago i found an interst thread on reddit about a guy who explains everything.i dont know if what he claims is true about the PEA chemical , but you can have a look:

 

[OilUzer]

and what was the common concensus on that?

You must be new! lol

Typically no consensus when it comes to thin vs. thick threads!
But they end up being some of the most interesting and informative threads imho! For example they got you explaining HP and T ...

Best summary (short and to the point as always) by an expert:
Read post #211 by @MolaKule

 

[svenson]

Jury is out. I say no. Others say yes. A true conundrum.

hey i am still between , its the emotional thing,phycologists say that to find the truth you must expell all your former prototypes about the thing you are thinking

A conundrum which could easily be solved by monitoring the actual oil temperature of the vehicle in question.

Without that - it’s all just guessing.

Guessing that higher ambient temperature leads to higher oil temperature without taking into account cooling system performance or oil cooler (if any) performance.

Which is really guessing.

guess educated or not ,when it comes to science and arguments is the worst !

thats what i was about to suggest to oiluzer. monitor your oil temp going 2 trips with same speed through the death valley with the same load and find the truth. procedure of science: theory,experiment,result,proof of science, announcement! why make it difficult for you?

 

[svenson]

Redline SI-1

thats what the guy from the video suggest,says it has the most PEA ,the best cleaner chemical for that use.but not gumout.

Haven’t been to Death Valley in a while, but living in Lizard Spit isn’t much better. When I spoke with the HPL rep., and based on my driving application, he recommended 5w40 and I’ve been using that ever since. That’s what they use in all the border patrol units, so if it’s a good enough for them…

you got some very interesting names in your country to describe some places
going to 5-40 its not a big deal to argue for 16 pages! but you said the magic word :

driving application

 

[Glenda W.]

A conundrum which could easily be solved by monitoring the actual oil temperature of the vehicle in question.

Without that - it’s all just guessing.

Guessing that higher ambient temperature leads to higher oil temperature without taking into account cooling system performance or oil cooler (if any) performance.

Which is really guessing.

Meanwhile, the guy who actually lives there, uses 0W20 in his Toyota.

100%. This is the only way IMO. My Outback always shows higher oil temps on hotter days. I live in mountainous terrain so I’m always in severe service.

 

[Astro14]

100%. This is the only way IMO. My Outback always shows higher oil temps on hotter days. I live in mountainous terrain so I’m always in severe service.

I retrofitted a Volvo factory oil temperature gauge in my 1985 240 Turbo. It had an extra spot in the dash for an optional gauge, an easy install and factory parts. It was wonderful.

I sure do miss it!

 

[OilUzer]

A conundrum which could easily be solved by monitoring the actual oil temperature of the vehicle in question.

Without that - it’s all just guessing.

Guessing that higher ambient temperature leads to higher oil temperature without taking into account cooling system performance or oil cooler (if any) performance.

Which is really guessing.

Meanwhile, the guy who actually lives there, uses 0W20 in his Toyota.

I listed a delta temp many pages ago. iirc, 12F increase in oil temp for 27F increase in ambient (64 to 91F). With no load and speed 60mph and under ...

btw, I see a lot of 30 and 40 viscosity grades in your signature!
What's up with that? lol just teasing you.

 

[Astro14]

I listed a delta temp many pages ago. iirc, 12F increase in oil temp for 27F increase in ambient (64 to 91F). With no load and speed 60mph and under ...

btw, I see a lot of 30 and 40 viscosity grades in your signature!
What's up with that? lol just teasing you.

Clearly -
I am guessing!

In all seriousness, I use the specified grade. I use what the manufacturer recommended.

With one exception, and that is the Tundra. The Tundra owners manual specifies a 0W20, but then says, basically, in instances of hard use, a higher grade may give better protection. So, 5W30.

But, for every other car, I am using what the manufacturer recommended.

That includes the one Volvo running on 0W40. It is an “R” model and the manual says that a higher grade is appropriate to severe use, like driving in the mountains, and that’s where I drive that car. A lot.

 

[edyvw]

This thread taught me that I have not appreciated the rise in temps in bearings due to RPMs. I always thought the rise in oil temps was primarily due to combustion heat and oil interacting with the resultant "heat sink" in the chamber walls and pistons. I came to my old (incorrect) conclusion based upon how easy it is to turn a crankshaft by hand, surely the friction I felt couldn't create much heat....but that's only a few RPMs. Very different from a running engine.

Which brings me to an observation: My B48 engine runs at oh-so-low RPMs (it barely gets to 2000 RPM unless you encourage it to do so) for a 4 banger putting out over 300 HP and over 300 ft/lb of Torque. It's spec'd for 0w20. Therefore, as long as the RPMs are kept low, perhaps that 0w20 is sufficient for protection since the oil temps in the bearings stay relatively low. It's only those 4000+ RPM runs that really heat the oil.

I was already doing the reasonable thing by bumping up to 0w30, even if it was for the wrong reason! Now I know. Thanks for the education.

However, B48 has overkill cooling system (actually two). I personally would use LL01 or LL04, but BMW’s since F series that was introduced in 2011 have cooling systems that would cool off 18 wheeler.

 

[Glenda W.]

I retrofitted a Volvo factory oil temperature gauge in my 1985 240 Turbo. It had an extra spot in the dash for an optional gauge, an easy install and factory parts. It was wonderful.

I sure do miss it!

Im always keeping an eye out for another 240! Someday I will own one again.

 

[TiGeo]

I listed a delta temp many pages ago. iirc, 12F increase in oil temp for 27F increase in ambient (64 to 91F). With no load and speed 60mph and under ...

btw, I see a lot of 30 and 40 viscosity grades in your signature!
What's up with that? lol just teasing you.

I likely missed this as we are page 16. 1) Have you actually riven the car in Death Valley yet? 2) If so, what were the oil temps? Or is this speculation/"what if I drive it there"/here was my ambient/oil temp in lower temps? I can't see in any situation where your oil temps at 130 deg F ambient being driven normally would ever approach a temp at which grade became an issue (too thin). Based on my curve I generated for my car and seeing .3 deg in increase in oil temp for each deg increase in ambient and seeing ~223t 100 deg F, I would be in the mid-230s in those ambient temps which is just fine for a 20 grade oil. It's all about your oil temp, not ambient. Also, your ambient rise to oil temp rise curve may not be linear based on how the engine is cooling/heat exchangers etc. In that data you provided, what were the oil temps?

 

[edyvw]

Since I spend a lot of time in desert West, and have seen temperatures on the gauge as high as 127f, THE ONLY thing to me that is important when it comes to oil in the vehicle is MAX level!
But as I stated before, the focus should be cooling system, not oil. People live in places like that. People who think of oil only when the have to change it.

 

[userfriendly]

Actually, 100 HP at 1600 rpm is more torque than 100 HP at 2,000 rpm. There would be more torque in the crankshaft in the 1600 rpm version.

I figured 262 lbs of torque @ 2,000 and 328 @ 1,600 rpm.
The math hasn’t changed since Woodstock.