The difference in the amount of oil isn't worht worrying about.
Trust the dipstick level?
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Originally Posted By: tarbasd
I guess the theory is that your oil pump doesn't have to work as hard, so the engine has less load.
I never did that myself, so I don't really know. It's entirely possible that it doesn't work.
That is a bunch of baloney .How would the oil pump work less? Think about it.
I guess the theory is that your oil pump doesn't have to work as hard, so the engine has less load.
I never did that myself, so I don't really know. It's entirely possible that it doesn't work.
That is a bunch of baloney .How would the oil pump work less? Think about it.
Take the car for a drive, park it on level ground and check the oil in the morning. If it calls for 5.7 qts with a filter 6 qts isn't going to hurt anything. I've been adding 5 qts to a 4.5 qt Ford 3.0L sump for the entire time I owned it. I have put about 115,000 miles on it since I bought it, it still runs just fine.
Frank D
Frank D
Originally Posted By: Steve S
Originally Posted By: tarbasd
I guess the theory is that your oil pump doesn't have to work as hard, so the engine has less load.
I never did that myself, so I don't really know. It's entirely possible that it doesn't work.
That is a bunch of baloney .How would the oil pump work less? Think about it.
I don't think it has anything to do with the oil pump. There are some extreme fuel economy measures advocated by some people, including removing everything unnecessary from your car like floor mats and roof rack cross bars, keeping as little gas in the tank as you can to save weight, reducing all the other fluids to their minimum levels to save weight, turning off lights and unnecessary accessories, etc. It's an extreme measure. Keeping your oil at the minimum level probably yields some immeasurably small benefit, but I personally wouldn't do it. Driving with fuel economy in mind and keeping your car maintained according to the manufacturer's recommendations will yield far more benefits than screwing around with fluids. Whether "overmaintenance" leads to lower overall costs in the long run is debatable. I don't think it does, but I have no arguments one way or the other. It's just an opinion.
Originally Posted By: tarbasd
I guess the theory is that your oil pump doesn't have to work as hard, so the engine has less load.
I never did that myself, so I don't really know. It's entirely possible that it doesn't work.
That is a bunch of baloney .How would the oil pump work less? Think about it.
I don't think it has anything to do with the oil pump. There are some extreme fuel economy measures advocated by some people, including removing everything unnecessary from your car like floor mats and roof rack cross bars, keeping as little gas in the tank as you can to save weight, reducing all the other fluids to their minimum levels to save weight, turning off lights and unnecessary accessories, etc. It's an extreme measure. Keeping your oil at the minimum level probably yields some immeasurably small benefit, but I personally wouldn't do it. Driving with fuel economy in mind and keeping your car maintained according to the manufacturer's recommendations will yield far more benefits than screwing around with fluids. Whether "overmaintenance" leads to lower overall costs in the long run is debatable. I don't think it does, but I have no arguments one way or the other. It's just an opinion.
These 3.4L Toyotas always take 6 qts with a filter change. The 5.7 always shows half way on the dipstick dots. Your stick is fine. Most domestics want the oil to the full line, whereas Toyota sees fit to come up half way between add and full? The extra few ounces you add to get to full won't harm a thing.
Several of my cars consistently take a bit more than the manual calls for to refill. I think it might be partly because I put the car on ramps to change the oil, thus putting the pan on a slight slop towards the drain plug. Also, I let the oil drain longer than your typical "lube tech" does. Finally, I remove the oil filter with the drain plug still out. Sometime this oddly results in another glug of oil coming out the drain plug.
I suspect that the factory refill procedure might count of more residual oil still being in the car than my procedure allows for. Generally I fill the oil about 2/3rds of the way between the add and full lines, then recheck the car cold the next morning in my garage and top it off a bit to sneak up on the full line.
I suspect that the factory refill procedure might count of more residual oil still being in the car than my procedure allows for. Generally I fill the oil about 2/3rds of the way between the add and full lines, then recheck the car cold the next morning in my garage and top it off a bit to sneak up on the full line.
My Sunfire is four quarts exactly (how much simpler can it get?), and my Yaris is 3.7 quarts with a new filter, bang-on like the manual states.
Embarrassing - but true - stories...
1) I changed the oil on my mom's Lincoln. By the time I filled it, it was dark out. I kept pouring in oil, but never saw it reach the proper level on the dipstick. After going more than a quart over, I grabbed the dipstick and took it inside with some bright lights. Turns out the oil was so clear, that I never noticed it on the dipstick and had now way OVER filled it. Ooops.
2) Changed the oil on my wife's Altima. I had 5qt bottles of Pennzoil conventional, and it takes 4.75qts, so I just put in slightly less than the full bottle. No oil on the dipstick - anywhere. I had to add another full quart to get it to register right, so I was freaking out. Only after about another 15 minutes did I notice that I had picked up GALLON (4qt) bottles of Pennzoil conventional this time around. Doh!
1) I changed the oil on my mom's Lincoln. By the time I filled it, it was dark out. I kept pouring in oil, but never saw it reach the proper level on the dipstick. After going more than a quart over, I grabbed the dipstick and took it inside with some bright lights. Turns out the oil was so clear, that I never noticed it on the dipstick and had now way OVER filled it. Ooops.
2) Changed the oil on my wife's Altima. I had 5qt bottles of Pennzoil conventional, and it takes 4.75qts, so I just put in slightly less than the full bottle. No oil on the dipstick - anywhere. I had to add another full quart to get it to register right, so I was freaking out. Only after about another 15 minutes did I notice that I had picked up GALLON (4qt) bottles of Pennzoil conventional this time around. Doh!
Originally Posted By: Zhukov
Embarrassing - but true - stories...
1) I changed the oil on my mom's Lincoln. By the time I filled it, it was dark out. I kept pouring in oil, but never saw it reach the proper level on the dipstick. After going more than a quart over, I grabbed the dipstick and took it inside with some bright lights. Turns out the oil was so clear, that I never noticed it on the dipstick and had now way OVER filled it. Ooops.
2) Changed the oil on my wife's Altima. I had 5qt bottles of Pennzoil conventional, and it takes 4.75qts, so I just put in slightly less than the full bottle. No oil on the dipstick - anywhere. I had to add another full quart to get it to register right, so I was freaking out. Only after about another 15 minutes did I notice that I had picked up GALLON (4qt) bottles of Pennzoil conventional this time around. Doh!
Yeah, been there done that (almost). 1)I always find it challenging to read the DS with new oil also. 2)It's funny how some oils come in 4Q jugs, and some come in 5Q jugs.
Embarrassing - but true - stories...
1) I changed the oil on my mom's Lincoln. By the time I filled it, it was dark out. I kept pouring in oil, but never saw it reach the proper level on the dipstick. After going more than a quart over, I grabbed the dipstick and took it inside with some bright lights. Turns out the oil was so clear, that I never noticed it on the dipstick and had now way OVER filled it. Ooops.
2) Changed the oil on my wife's Altima. I had 5qt bottles of Pennzoil conventional, and it takes 4.75qts, so I just put in slightly less than the full bottle. No oil on the dipstick - anywhere. I had to add another full quart to get it to register right, so I was freaking out. Only after about another 15 minutes did I notice that I had picked up GALLON (4qt) bottles of Pennzoil conventional this time around. Doh!
Yeah, been there done that (almost). 1)I always find it challenging to read the DS with new oil also. 2)It's funny how some oils come in 4Q jugs, and some come in 5Q jugs.
I have a motor home on a 1992 Chevy P-30 with a 454 big block. One of the manuals that came with it stated that the dipstick on some units was inaccurate. The sump holds seven quarts and if you go by the dipstick, it will be about a quart low. Instructions were given as to how to correct the error by remarking the dipstick. Mine was inaccurate so I corrected it. If I had not read the manuals I guess I would have run it at least a quart low for 85,000 miles.
Originally Posted By: hate2work
OK, tarbasd, I have to ask...
How does running your oil at the minimum level give you better fuel economy?
Well, wet sump means crank splashes in oil. Less oil = less resistance = more HP & less foaming.
That is why my 911 is dry sump. It has two pumps and separate oil tank. It has two drain plugs.
At least this is the theory as I understand. Race engine builders would know more.
OK, tarbasd, I have to ask...
How does running your oil at the minimum level give you better fuel economy?
Well, wet sump means crank splashes in oil. Less oil = less resistance = more HP & less foaming.
That is why my 911 is dry sump. It has two pumps and separate oil tank. It has two drain plugs.
At least this is the theory as I understand. Race engine builders would know more.
If memory serves, the owner's manual for my four-cylinder '04 Tacoma says that the engine takes 5-point-something quarts with a filter. No matter what I do, no matter how long I let the oil drain, 4.5 quarts brings the oil right to the top of the Full mark on the dipstick, even with a Toyota filter. I suppose if I could pick up the truck and tilt it this way and that, more oil might come out. The owner's-manual specs for the differential and transmission are also off; neither takes precisely the amount of oil that the manual says. I don't worry about it.
Somebody (A few out there, actually) needs to check the wattage in the spare batteries, number of sheets left on the TP rolls and the halogen in the headlamps!
If the owner's manual says "Cap. = 5 quarts" and you put in 5 quarts you've done your job: mark the offending dipstick and keep it near that line and just sue the bstrds if your motor blows!
If the owner's manual says "Cap. = 5 quarts" and you put in 5 quarts you've done your job: mark the offending dipstick and keep it near that line and just sue the bstrds if your motor blows!
In Feb 05 I bought my brand new Nissan X-trail with the QR25DE, first year they were offered in Canada, it was the same engine as my previous 03 Altima except Nissan changed the torque for the AWD X-trail, the X-trail QE25DE was Japanese made in Japanese factory, the Altima version in the U.S.
The Altima engine called for 4.1 litres and the dipstick was calibrated exactly at the full mark with the 4.1 litre fill a OC.
I brought my new X-trail home the first day, parked it exactly on the spot I previously parked the Altima, the dipstick read a full 3/8 inch overfill. I drained to the full mark, called the dealership. The dealership checked the factory fill on every new X-trail on the lot, every X-trail showed the same overfill.
The Dealership called Nissan tech, Nissan tech said to put no less than 4 litres oil and go by the 3/8 inch overfill reading, the reading actually is the sharp bend in the dipstick, the bend which prevent splashing up the dipstick housing tube.
This freaked me out, the dealership too, dont always trust the dipstick reading. On would think a new $30K vehicle could come with a properly calibrated dipstick for oil, NO?
I dont know about Toyotas, but Nissan engines are extremely finicky for dipstick readings, they need exact level ground.
-40 cold temps will show lower reading of up to -1/4 inch on dipstick, I do NOT add oil at this point, I drive it and check it hot in those temps, the oil will actual contract in extreme cold and show lower reading, happens in my climate all the time. The oil of course expands for hot readings.
I find that if I check oil hot after ten minute park (Nissan manual instructions for oil dipstick reading) the oil level will show proper reading, I then find that when the oil cools to room temp on a summer day the reading will be exactly the same on dipstick too. My theory is this: when I check the oil hot the oil expands hot and shows proper reading but the oil is NOT fully 100% drained to sump, thus the compensation / when I check the oil cold (room temp) the oil contracts as it cools but the oil has mostly drained to sump, again a compensation. Thus both methods prove accurate for me in my Nissans and other vehicles I drive, this is my experience.
Cyprs
The Altima engine called for 4.1 litres and the dipstick was calibrated exactly at the full mark with the 4.1 litre fill a OC.
I brought my new X-trail home the first day, parked it exactly on the spot I previously parked the Altima, the dipstick read a full 3/8 inch overfill. I drained to the full mark, called the dealership. The dealership checked the factory fill on every new X-trail on the lot, every X-trail showed the same overfill.
The Dealership called Nissan tech, Nissan tech said to put no less than 4 litres oil and go by the 3/8 inch overfill reading, the reading actually is the sharp bend in the dipstick, the bend which prevent splashing up the dipstick housing tube.
This freaked me out, the dealership too, dont always trust the dipstick reading. On would think a new $30K vehicle could come with a properly calibrated dipstick for oil, NO?
I dont know about Toyotas, but Nissan engines are extremely finicky for dipstick readings, they need exact level ground.
-40 cold temps will show lower reading of up to -1/4 inch on dipstick, I do NOT add oil at this point, I drive it and check it hot in those temps, the oil will actual contract in extreme cold and show lower reading, happens in my climate all the time. The oil of course expands for hot readings.
I find that if I check oil hot after ten minute park (Nissan manual instructions for oil dipstick reading) the oil level will show proper reading, I then find that when the oil cools to room temp on a summer day the reading will be exactly the same on dipstick too. My theory is this: when I check the oil hot the oil expands hot and shows proper reading but the oil is NOT fully 100% drained to sump, thus the compensation / when I check the oil cold (room temp) the oil contracts as it cools but the oil has mostly drained to sump, again a compensation. Thus both methods prove accurate for me in my Nissans and other vehicles I drive, this is my experience.
Cyprs
I wonder what "capacity" means and if it means the same thing to every manufacturer. That is, if the manual says that an engine takes "4.0 quarts with filter," does that mean the manufacturer did an oil-and-filter change on a hot engine and measured precisely how much oil was needed to bring the level on the dipstick up to the full mark? If that's the method, then "capacity" means "not counting any old oil that remains in the engine after draining the oil pan."
Or does "4.0 quarts with filter" mean how much oil is needed for the initial fill of a new engine that doesn't have any oil clinging to parts and lying in little puddles here and there? If you then ran that engine, drained it, changed the filter, and filled the engine with exactly enough oil to bring the level to the full mark (with the filter also full, as it would be after starting the engine), wouldn't you use something less than 4.0 quarts?
Does anyone here know the answer? Is the answer the same for every engine maker?
Or does "4.0 quarts with filter" mean how much oil is needed for the initial fill of a new engine that doesn't have any oil clinging to parts and lying in little puddles here and there? If you then ran that engine, drained it, changed the filter, and filled the engine with exactly enough oil to bring the level to the full mark (with the filter also full, as it would be after starting the engine), wouldn't you use something less than 4.0 quarts?
Does anyone here know the answer? Is the answer the same for every engine maker?
Generally, an owners manual will give oil capacity as the amount of oil required to bring the oil level upo to the full mark starting with a new, dry oil filter. Sometimes they also give the amount of oil required if you don't change the filter.
Shop manuals often also list the total amount of oil required in a "dry" (rebuilt) engine.
Shop manuals often also list the total amount of oil required in a "dry" (rebuilt) engine.
I think the max oil in a wet sump should be where the oil level at the max does not reach the top of the oil pan and makes contact with the gaskets/seals at pan lip and at ends of crank. Engine is off much more than on and haveing? a wet gasket/seal may pull more oil thru via capillary suction. Crank throws just low enough in oil to get a little wet when off and after start oil levels drops~1/2 to 3/4 of a quart, I guess that the idling circulation level, and now the throws spin above this now lower oil level and won't drag thru oil. If you have a simple geometry pan you may be able to calculate the volume of same and determine the height of oil level in pan with the volume that you think you have in there. If it seems height of oil well above the oil pan /block interface I would say oil level to high.
In my case I try to trust the dipstick level. My car is parked in the garage, ready to go out. When I read it in the morning, it says full. If I park the car the other side, it says half-full.
If the car was running, I have to wait at least 1 hour the read properly the oil level. It takes so long for the oil to get to the oil pan.
If the car was running, I have to wait at least 1 hour the read properly the oil level. It takes so long for the oil to get to the oil pan.
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