Those with 150000 miles or more on A/T check in

[John Ulrich]

326,000 Miles
'94 Merc Villager
Transmission filter changed once at 125,000. The balance of the time I'd drop the drain plug and refill every 25,000 or so.
Vehicle donated and I now have 65,000 on a '01 Villager.
145,000 miles on a '94 Lexus ES300....same program but I have not changed the filter yet.

Later,
JU

 

[PandaBear]

Norm,

Yeah, I agree in your opinion in that regard. You have to understand this is a FORD engineer, and probably one that worked on the Taurus before. We engineer have all the Not In House syndrom, that "everything not invented here suck", kind of like the opposite of "the grass is greener on the other side of the fence".

My Integra (also a Honda) has 160k miles and my auto tranny shift like new, with only drain and refill every 30k. My Corolla has 120k with Aisin 131L tranny but I saw leak and when I drop the pan, there a quite a few copper flakes in the filter. Shift ok but nothing like new.

It is definitely possible to build a good reliable tranny, but sometimes manufacture get aggressive in trying what they can get, some like early 90's ford try to cut cost, while some like Honda in the 00's try to cramp a 5spd in the size of a 4spd and get back fired on reliability problem. Some like Toyota and GM try conservative approach and get good reliability, but with large size or less speed (my corolla only got 3spd, in the 94-97 model).

 

[99]

My neighbor has a late 80s/early 90s model Ford Aerostar van with over 250K on it and it's all factory original AND his daily driver. The body will rot away before this thing has a major mechanical failure. I don't think Ford cut any costs in the Aerostar division.

 

[baomo]

i have 150k on my '97 VW, still pulls strong. changed the fluid/filter and final drive @ 100k and 140k.

 

[huffmuds9320]

As far as I know the 92 Toyota Camry 2.2L is still on the original transmission. Car has about 162,000 miles so does the transmission. Its been using regular Dexron III/Mercon ATF of different brands. Not sure what intervals the filter and fluid is changed, but I'm guessing its probably changed at least 4 times. It still shifts smoothly and no problems.

 

[JParrott]

I haven't seen one GM 4l60E or 4L80E in this list yet. I took my last 4L60E to 77,000. It was starting to shift hard on the 1-2.

That's reassuring.

 

[Pitbull]

What do you guys think about these new lifetime fill transmissions? I have a 2004 Toyota 4runner with the 4.7 V8 and the 5speed automatic transmission that doesn't have a transmission dipstick. They claim that the ATF never needs to be changed unless you tow, and then it should be serviced every 60K miles. They are using a new transmission fluid that is call "World Standard" ATFWS and is not compatible with any other ATF. The new 4runner also comes with 100K mile antifreeze. I plan on trading at 80K miles and figure I only need to do oil/filter changes and the diffs and transfercase. This makes the AWD 4runner one of the lowest maintance SUV's on the road, if you own it for 80K miles. But if you go past 90K miles it will cost, because you have to do the timing belt/water pump, ATF change and antifreeze change. But you would be good for another 90K miles

I sure like these new vehicles.

 

[Boaz]

Funny you should ask pitbull. I was at the toyota dealer today picking up sparkplugs for the 4 runner and asked this same question. The tech told me to get a UOA performed at or a little before 60k and go from there. My jaw dropped to the floor! I was like.. what a good idea! So thats my plan.. even though I got the V-6 and don't tow, I might drain the pan and refill at 60k when I get a sample of fluid.... then go from there.

BTW also got a quote on the timing belt/water pump replacement.... $269 parts and labor,for the V-6
$299 parts and labor for the V-8. THat was alot less than I expected!

 

[Pitbull]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Boaz:
Funny you should ask pitbull. I was at the toyota dealer today picking up sparkplugs for the 4 runner and asked this same question. The tech told me to get a UOA performed at or a little before 60k and go from there. My jaw dropped to the floor! I was like.. what a good idea! So thats my plan.. even though I got the V-6 and don't tow, I might drain the pan and refill at 60k when I get a sample of fluid.... then go from there.

BTW also got a quote on the timing belt/water pump replacement.... $269 parts and labor,for the V-6
$299 parts and labor for the V-8. THat was alot less than I expected!

---

I thought your V6 had a timing chain? That is a great price for a timing belt and water pump for a V8. I would expect closer to $1000. I'm still tempted not to do anything to the transmission if I don't tow and then trade it at 80K miles. I use to know this guy that was a big time consultant to the transmission industry and he claimed that if your transmission fluid was not burnt/over heated that it didn't do any good changing it, and if it was burnt that the odds are you won't know it and change it in time to save your transmission. This guy figured that most just change the fluid in the pan and filter if the trans has one, which I don't think ours does, and he said that it didn't do much to help just changing that much fluid. Now doing a complete fluid exchange would be a good thing and you would see what kind of condition your old fluid was in, but the problem I would have with that is if you contaminate this new WSATF with any other fluid it will screw up your transmission. So the dealer would have to be on their toes and flush the exchange machine with the expensive WSATF before they did the exchange (like that is going to happen). So you could have a nice clean sealed transmission and after the dealer does the ATF fluid exchange you end up with a contaminated transmission. If I end up having the transmission serviced it will be at 50K miles so I still have another 10K miles of drivetrain warranty to cover my butt incase the dealer screw-up.

 

[Pitbull]

Back on subject sorry guys. I had a 1995 Toyota Landcruiser with about 140K miles. Did a fluid exchange at 60K miles and at 120K miles, using mobil synthetic ATF. It ran like new and fluid was alway clean and never needed to add fluid between exchanges. I would never use anything but ATF in a transmission. Never "flush" meaning use a cleaner in a transmission. Nothing should ever go into a transmission that is not ATF and meets the manufactures spec's. JMHO

 

[Pitbull]

Seems like the new transmissions are more dependable then the old 3 speeds. The manufactures are sealing (getting rid of the dipstick access) and using advanced transmission fluids to prolong the life of the transmissions. This keeps Idiots that think they are automotive experts from adding fluids to their transmissions causing premature failure.

 

[brianl703]

I recall seeing a couple of company vehicles..at different companies I'd worked for..where Type F was used to top up the leaking transmission, based on the empty bottles of Type F that were in the vehicle.

Neither of these vehicles specified Type F. I suspect that the Type F was purchased because it was the cheapest thing on the shelf that said "Transmission Fluid" on it.

 

[terminaldegree]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kestas:
Can you see the trend here? I'm sure others my age have the same experience. Our family has never had to worry about automatic transmissions until the manufacturers started coming up with new designs (4-spd, electronic, lock-up torque converters).

It seems that any money we've saved by burning less gas with this new technology has gone straight to the transmission shop for repairs. This is not what I call progress. I believe we've taken a step back in automotive transmission technology.

---

ding ding ding ding! Tell him what he's won, Wink!

Sister's Volvo 740GLE was into the upper 100K range on the original ZF when she got rid of it. Maintenance? Never. Probably the third AC compressor and 4th set of brakes, though.

 

[VNT]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pitbull:
Seems like the new transmissions are more dependable then the old 3 speeds. The manufactures are sealing (getting rid of the dipstick access) and using advanced transmission fluids to prolong the life of the transmissions. This keeps Idiots that think they are automotive experts from adding fluids to their transmissions causing premature failure.

---

No, all it means is the OEM is saving the cost of the dipstick/tube. THe OEM figures most people are too stupid or lazy to check the tranny fluid and/or read the owners manual or buy a FSM. Also do you think the OEM gives a crap about the 2nd owner when the tranny takes a dump???

This is just another way of making the DIYer go to the stealership to have service done, ie fluid changes via their flushing machines which are big time mark up and money makers.

 

[Pitbull]

Disagree, Toyota does not manufacture with the goal of failure after the end of warranty coverage. The idea is to keep idiots that think they know what they are doing from screwing up the transmission by adding crap that is not compatible. Flush machines are everywhere, every small shop has them and the cost is very low. Based on your analysis, all of the manufactures added electronic's and computer technology just so the DIYer could not work on their car and these advances made our cars less dependable. Someone needs to drag you into the present.

 

[Kestas]

I agree. There are too many idiots screwing up simple tasks, though some of the problem lies with manufacturers now using specialized fluids.

It wasn't long ago where nearly every car used 10W-30/Dexron/green coolant/DOT3. Now I'm afraid of touching any car that's not mine unless I spend a couple hours looking through the owner's manual or researching the internet to find what can be used in a particular vehicle.

 

[brianl703]

quote:

---

Originally posted by VNT:
This is just another way of making the DIYer go to the stealership to have service done, ie fluid changes via their flushing machines which are big time mark up and money makers.

---

???

The 4T40/4T45 GM transmission which has no dipstick does not require a flushing machine to change the fluid, nor would it be recommended because it has a filter that should be changed too.

Procedure for changing the fluid on that transmission:

1)Drop pan, drain fluid.
2)Replace filter, reinstall pan.
3)Add 7 quarts via filler opening on top of transmision.
5)Start engine.
6)Let run for 5 minutes, shift through the gears.
7)Open check plug with engine running. If fluid drains out, level is fine when only a slight amount is draining out. If no fluid drains out, add some until it starts draining out.
8)Reinstall check plug. Done.

I think about the toughest part of this would be making sure that the vehicle is level.

 

[FazerZ]

quote:

---

Originally posted by VNT:
No, all it means is the OEM is saving the cost of the dipstick/tube. THe OEM figures most people are too stupid or lazy to check the tranny fluid and/or read the owners manual or buy a FSM. Also do you think the OEM gives a crap about the 2nd owner when the tranny takes a dump???

This is just another way of making the DIYer go to the stealership to have service done, ie fluid changes via their flushing machines which are big time mark up and money makers.

---

Being in the transmission service industry, I agree with you. This is primarily a cost savings for the OE and promotes using the OE's service department to do any and all service work.

It's true a sealed system can prevent a lot of operator/owner mistakes, but I doubt that is a primary concern of the OE.

In addition, if you work on these late model vehicles, you'll notice spare compartment space is getting harder and harder to find and the ability to eliminate another tube is likely very appealing.

Lifetime fluids and sealed systems are just a way for the OE to create disposal assemblies. I just happened to be reading over some BMW service literature and there was a line in the manual that stated if there is a transmission leak, the whole unit has failed and needs to be replaced. Now that's good thinking!

DH

Sorry to post off topic, just wanted to add my thoughts.

To make the post more relevant to topic:

93 Toyota Land Cruiser 1FZ-FE, auto trans model A442F, 265K, drain/fill with conventional ATF every 20-30Ks. Filter/Pan never dropped. Shifts well except in extreme cold, has a 2-3 flare that improves after warmup.

 

[FazerZ]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pitbull:
Disagree, Toyota does not manufacture with the goal of failure after the end of warranty coverage. The idea is to keep idiots that think they know what they are doing from screwing up the transmission by adding crap that is not compatible. Flush machines are everywhere, every small shop has them and the cost is very low. Based on your analysis, all of the manufactures added electronic's and computer technology just so the DIYer could not work on their car and these advances made our cars less dependable. Someone needs to drag you into the present.

---

Flush machines are used by those same idiots all the time too. Does that make it twice as bad?

DH

 

[Pitbull]

quote:

---

Originally posted by FazerZ:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pitbull:
Disagree, Toyota does not manufacture with the goal of failure after the end of warranty coverage. The idea is to keep idiots that think they know what they are doing from screwing up the transmission by adding crap that is not compatible. Flush machines are everywhere, every small shop has them and the cost is very low. Based on your analysis, all of the manufactures added electronic's and computer technology just so the DIYer could not work on their car and these advances made our cars less dependable. Someone needs to drag you into the present.

---

Flush machines are used by those same idiots all the time too. Does that make it twice as bad?

DH

---

Yes