I live in a cold climate surrounded by farm land. It's literally the definition of rural. Of course it's not my only vehicle though. My wife wouldn't have transportation to get around the area when I'm gone 2-3 days at at time when I have to drive halfway across the state for work. Where does your "wealthy" number start at? Just curious...
Tesla Q2 Deliveries crushes estimates
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I live in a cold climate surrounded by farm land. It's literally the definition of rural. Of course it's not my only vehicle though. My wife wouldn't have transportation to get around the area when I'm gone 2-3 days at at time when I have to drive halfway across the state for work. Where does your "wealthy" number start at? Just curious...
Bingo. Absent radical change in batteries, charging, and/or infrastructure or driving patterns, the EV profile will not work for most Americans. It's that simple. It doesn't work for you. It only works b/c you have multiple vehicles and the one that drives the EV, doesn't really "drive" anywhere, apparently.
Well, average adult male salary is about $50k.
When I last looked at the average Telsa owner, 50s, male, $100-150k salary. So, 2-3x average male salary. Multiple cars. Home owner with garage. Assets, I think, over a million. Most overwhelming living in California, one of the most expensive states in the nation, and within that, in a few zip codes most expensive in the nation. That's a baseline IMO.
That’s pretty lofty. We’re talking about a $40k car… My other car is a 5 year old hatchback.
It actually works fine for me when I take it, but my wife would rather drive her car than mine. I’d just have a second Tesla but I missed the million in assets target.
As the cheaper Y and 3 proliferate thats coming down.
Pretty sure low end model y and 3 are now below the average vehicle costs in the US. just under or just over its now an average priced car.
Should the average car or truck really be 50K - if the average guy makes 50K? Seems out of whack to me.
I definitely didn’t buy $40k-$50k cars making $50k a year but I’m sure there are some who do.
That’s pretty lofty. We’re talking about a $40k car… My other car is a 5 year old hatchback.
It actually works fine for me when I take it, but my wife would rather drive her car than mine. I’d just have a second Tesla but I missed the million in assets target.
Yet, again, it's not a requirement, it's just the user profile I'm quoting from memory. And, considering something like the majority of Teslas are purchased in a few areas of California, it makes sense.
Top 10 selling vehicles are 6 trucks (which are almost universally for work, for utility, home owners, etc.). Nearly all men own trucks (or SUVs). Makes sense as they are extremely USEFUL at multiple blue collar work or other tasks or hobbies. There are 2 SUVs, which have essentially replaced the Minivan for moms shuffling kids around, and for active lifestyle folks.
There's 1 passenger car, which average folks buy for commuting.
And there's a Tesla, which I recall being a $60,000 model. Practically no utility, it's a overpriced status symbol. Gee, who's buying those? See user profile cited above.
I think it’s cute you think those trucks are all doing real work.
Point being, that should not be missed, is there is a FINITE number of customers.
Further point, we're in a recession, interest rates on cars is something like 10%, likely turning into a deep depression, in a war with a superpower, likely a multi-front superpower war, and about 1/2 of the globe is dumping the dollar near term aligning trade against the US currency with a different currency.
The FINITE number of people wanting a virtue signaling car is going to grow slowly and cap at 10% at best. If not retract. I don't see lines of people in a few years, of this fallout, clamoring for a EV. None of the figures support that. I think overwhelmingly people are going to be tightening belts, making appliances and cars last longer, etc. rather than luxury purchases (and new cars are luxury items).
Further point, we're in a recession, interest rates on cars is something like 10%, likely turning into a deep depression, in a war with a superpower, likely a multi-front superpower war, and about 1/2 of the globe is dumping the dollar near term aligning trade against the US currency with a different currency.
The FINITE number of people wanting a virtue signaling car is going to grow slowly and cap at 10% at best. If not retract. I don't see lines of people in a few years, of this fallout, clamoring for a EV. None of the figures support that. I think overwhelmingly people are going to be tightening belts, making appliances and cars last longer, etc. rather than luxury purchases (and new cars are luxury items).
That seems like a thinly veiled insult attempt suggesting I'm naive.
Every man I know owns a truck and those trucks do truck tasks, whether working in blue collar jobs, or hauling toys on weekends - boats, RVs, skidoos, etc. - or home improvement jobs like Lowes runs for bags of concrete, lumber, towing a trailer, etc. These men have common sense.
I don't know any men who own EVs.
RVs and Ski Doos sound like expensive toys to me. You know, since EVs are just expensive toys… It’s probably worth saying because you’ve decided that only rich people drive EVs, poor people aren’t buying those new trucks, especially the one’s pulling water toys. Those guys are typically making 6 figures too unless they’re up to their eyeballs in debt. It takes money to spend money. I guess you just have to decide who you approve of spending it and how. I know what I make and I sure don’t have boat money.
in Q1 The best selling vehicle in the world that isnt a truck was the model y - which is an SUV, so pretty practical.
Trims are 47, 50 , and 54K.
Id love to see current demographics on Telsa, whats the latest you have?
You're trying to be argumentative and contort my obvious points. I'm not interested in arguing with you. You don't like the facts, I get it. There's 1 EV in the top 10 vehicles, and it's not bought by poor or middle class people. The other 8 vehicles are bought by a broad spectrum but most are truck chassis and bought by men who need trucks, for work, home improvements, or hobbies. It's really that simple.
I've already explained the documented EV profile, which is funny. They are not saving the environment by buying a NEW ELECTRIC CAR. A true environmentalist, if he were to own a car, would opt for a old one in good condition with low maintenance requirements. That's where the real environmentalism is. NEW CARS require massive amounts of energy and resources, and EVs are among the worst offenders for global destruction. The facts are, relatively hilarious, given the product vs. user profile.
First, I assume your Google isn't broken and I'm not doing research projects.
Secondly, China and Europe are far different user profiles. Regarding Europe, fuel prices about 4-10x that of Americans and distances far greater. And they also have mass transit as a "backup" form of transit, and live in more walkable communities. Not a lot of farms or rural areas in Europe, versus the US where distances between cities can be 100s of miles. Further, many of the European nations have highest wealth per capita, like Sweden, which I believe has a huge adoption of EVs. All extremely different than Americans who 1) have cheap fuel, 2) often drive long distances. It makes sense for people in Europe. Next, regarding China, I'm not super familiar with their culture or layout but I suspect it's vastly different than the USA - very dense cities, small driving needs, limits on travel distances and freedom of movement, possibly mandates against fuel consumption, probably lots of coal fired electricity, etc. Impossible to compare US vs. China EV ownership.
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Often people reference stuff they've recently read, I figured you might have read something you had handy. Nothing nefarious.
We've all seen 60K teslas - but thats not what most cost now. Im not sure I agree suv's dont have utility - you might be stand alone in that thought.
Im always open to seeing data.
Who is buying basic $47k Teslas? Further, I'm factoring total upfront ownership costs including taxes, fees, registration, insurance. Add $2000 or whatever for a charging system at home. That's $5-10k on a $47k car in California, if cash. That brings that car, effectively, well north of $50k close to $60k. For internet discussion, it is close enough. You buy the cheapest Y in California, out the door, how much are you into it for? I'm estimating, for conversation, $60k. More if financed, closer to $90 when paid off over 5 years.
No I’m trying to get you to understand how ridiculous what you’re saying sounds. The car upsets you. If I would have spent what I did on the Tesla and added $20k to it to purchase another F150(which is what it would take to buy one these days), that wouldn’t have bothered you.
I’ve still not met the person who bought an EV to save the environment which I’m guessing you haven’t met any either since all the GUYS you know drive trucks. That’s supposed to make me feel less masculine, right?
Seriously everyone I’ve talked to with an EV or even a hybrid has said they bought the car because they liked the car. Some said they got tired of spending more for fuel. I still mostly drive my GTI for the reasons mentioned above. I love the car. It’s pretty good on fuel. I just don’t like big vehicles. For most they’re unnecessary. I value driving dynamics and I like smart design. I just don’t need a truck like I used to or I’d still be driving a 2017 F150. That truck had an identical price tag as the Tesla new and it was an XLT. In other words it cost nearly the same out the door, but exponentially more to operate.
Um…. me? I think most that have them on here have base Teslas. There really aren’t options unless you’re into the stupid “Full Self Driving”. I paid $2,300 for taxes but all these numbers you added in you’d have to do with any new car purchase including the tax. You don’t need that stupid charger either, but I’ve already told you that 10 times and you still repeat it. The home charger adaptor you need is $230. That’s it. It’ll work on 110v or 220v.
Actually almost no one buys the performance versions because the middle and low ends are still pretty snappy.
If you add tax license title and finance every car goes up - so sure take any 50 K car thats finance could become 60. MSRP is how you compare because financing makes it variable.
Im not even including th 7500 you get off on all of them. so that pushes the price into the 30's on one of them.
For sure It COULD be 2K to install a charger it cost me 250 bucks to put a nema 14-50 in the garage.
If you think I'm here to argue EVs, I'm not. Time will prove them to be failures IMO. They do nothing better than a ICE other than quickness (rapidly drains battery), and home charging (the equation could flip tomorrow, not convenient for most people who drive longer distances or don't have a place to charge), they are not more environmentally sound, their longevity will not be better than ICE which have many still on the roads after 3-4 decades.
They cannot do the prime things people need: 1) long distances, 2) hauling/towing, 3) easy/cheap to fix, 4) last decades.
They cannot do the prime things people need: 1) long distances, 2) hauling/towing, 3) easy/cheap to fix, 4) last decades.
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