Synthetic Oil- not more "slippery"...yet lower CF?

[MolaKule]

Ok, here are some results from a Cameron Plint friction testing machine with all fluids at 100C:

1. Unadditized PAO, COF = 0.115
2. Unadditized Ester, COF = 0.035
3. PAO with the addition of 500 ppm of above ester, COF = 0.085
4. Mixture 3 with the addition of a fatty acid friction modifier, COF = 0.03

This should give you guys an idea of the magnitudes of COF's.

The final COF's will of course differ with the TYPE and viscosity of PAO or other API Group, TYPE and viscosity of ester, type of friction modifier, etc.

 

[MolaKule]

Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Ok, here are some results from a Cameron Plint friction testing machine with all fluids at 100C:

1. Unadditized PAO, COF = 0.115
2. Unadditized Ester, COF = 0.035
3. PAO with the addition of 500 ppm of above ester, COF = 0.085
4. Mixture 3 with the addition of a fatty acid friction modifier, COF = 0.03

This should give you guys an idea of the magnitudes of COF's.

The final COF's will of course differ with the TYPE and viscosity of PAO or other API Group, TYPE and viscosity of ester, type of friction modifier, etc.


Add to that the load (forces) impressed on the sample and the metallurgy of sample will affect the COF's.

 

[mount]

You don't want to get too slippery; the oil pump won't have anything to grab on to.

Sure a lower coefficient helps with those neat Amsoil or Royal Purple test videos we've all seen, but doesn't necessarily translate to its intended application.

Very interesting. I enjoy these factual threads that don't contain wild claims from people who would fail a physics class.

 

[MolaKule]

Quote:
Very interesting. I enjoy these factual threads that don't contain wild claims from people who would fail a physics class.


Thanks.

And then there are those so-called experts who think they're engineers or those engineers who also think they're chemists.

 

[jrustles]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
The break-in they need may be almost invisible to the operator, but it still happens and if you want the thing to last to its full potential, awareness is still beneficial or they wouldn't address it in the manual.



+1

Only one way to get rings to push out against the hone, cylinder pressures.
Also, I am dubious about factory break-in. Apart from quick pressure test prior to installation, and a quick dyno run after vehicle manufacture, I doubt there is any further "breaking in" that they do. Even the car jockeys that boot the car around with a cold engine are breaking it in more than the factory IMO. I'm glad to learn otherwise.

But I too am curious, why do some manufacturers use moly break in oil?

 

[MolaKule]

Quote:
But I too am curious, why do some manufacturers use moly break in oil?


Maybe they consider their engines already broken in and the Factory Fill is not really break-in oil.

With advances in metallurgy and surface finishing, many manf. don't see any reason for run-in.

The Amsoil break-in oil is what I would consider a break-in oil, especially for rebuilt engines.

http://www.amsoil.com/lit/databulletins/g2881.pdf

 

[HerrStig]

VW used to run bug engines for a half hour on natural gas.

 

[vinu_neuro]

Why do so many factory-fills have tons of moly?

 

[MolaKule]

Originally Posted By: vinu_neuro
Why do so many factory-fills have tons of moly?


Moly is one of those additives used to get to get maximum friction reduction, but certainly not the only additive.

 

[147_Grain]

The extra moly in factory fills has a hidden side-effect in that you get better MPG than expected (due to less friction between the rough engine parts).