supertech walmart filter help

[paulswagelock]

I also took some pics at a local Walmart. I am not ok with these. The ones I looked at had openings facing both directions. The issue I have is that in the small area I can snap in the photo, many of the slits are fully or partially blocked. So remembering college physics, oil is an incompressible fluid, so flow is directly related to Cv. Thus, the larger the area for flow passage, the more flow at the same Dp and Sg. So one of several things would happen - same flow but higher pressures, maxed out oil pump capacity thus limited flow, or the bypass would always be open to allow the flow.
Any of these choices are unacceptable to me.

Here are some pics to show you what I found. Two different ST models, and a Fram OCD to show what they were trying to build (imagine using the Fram OCD as a positive example). You can really see in the second photo how many of the up facing slits are not open. Even the OCD has some damaged slits.

ST 6607

ST 4967

Fram OCD

 

[Sayjac]

When I finish my dissection I'll have a close up/closer look. But, some of the openings from the outlet side 'look' open when the light from the led flash light hits them right and a shadow is cast. However, when the light is moved, the opening is appears closed. Bypass end view is consistent with openings, and I see no issues with the ST 7317 centertube.

 

[kcfx4]

paulswaglock, i note AA on that filter, also note that on Mobil 1 Extended Performance, what is that?

 

[Sayjac]

M1 and ST are both made by Champ.

 

[kcfx4]

so should we assume m1 is bad?

 

[Sayjac]

Quote:
so should we assume m1 is bad?

Heck no! ST is the low end, made for Wally special. Mobil 1 Extended Performance (and K&N) made by Champ to M1 specs. But, some of the base stampings could be similar.

 

[kcfx4]

i was just asking, i buy my small engine filters from a farm store for $2 and the box says ace, bottom of box says champ labs, and no where is warranty mentioned like on most filter boxes

 

[Sayjac]

It's cool. Purolator makes lower end filters too, like Proline for Pep Boys and ProMotive for Advance too. They also make Bosch DP though too.

Here's a pic that shows one can't go on a pic from down the centertube alone. This is from the base/thread end and some of the slits look open, but upon closer inspection with the naked eye and flash light they are closed. Shadows from flash.

 

[kcfx4]

sayjac, i have mouthed off to you in the past, and i appologize, and i thank you

 

[Sayjac]

It's all good.

 

[kcfx4]

so sayjac, is what youre saying Mobil 1 Extended Performance and BoschD+ made by same ppl?

 

[Sayjac]

Mobil 1 Extended Performance made by Champ Labs. Bosch DP made by Purolator. But Purolator is now jointly owned by Bosch and Mann&Hummel

 

[kcfx4]

so wich is better in your opinion?

 

[Sayjac]

If you're doing long OCI's, I think both are good. Some prefer the thread end bypass of M1, but BDP also has efficiency rating and holding capacity. And, according to river rat, thicker than P1 media with the same high efficiency.

If I used them regularly, I'd likely buy on lowest price. But, if you're not doing 10-12+k OCI's, seem like a waste to me. If one gets them in an oil/filter promo, that is a less expensive way to obtain them. How I recently obtained 3 BDP's, my first ever.

Just take your pick.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: paulswagelock
I also took some pics at a local Walmart. I am not ok with these. The ones I looked at had openings facing both directions. The issue I have is that in the small area I can snap in the photo, many of the slits are fully or partially blocked. So remembering college physics, oil is an incompressible fluid, so flow is directly related to Cv. Thus, the larger the area for flow passage, the more flow at the same Dp and Sg. So one of several things would happen - same flow but higher pressures, maxed out oil pump capacity thus limited flow, or the bypass would always be open to allow the flow.
Any of these choices are unacceptable to me.


Remember that the oil pump is "positive displacement", so it's going to try and force the same volume through the system regardless of downstream restriction up until the pump hits max pressure relief setting.

So, if the center core of the filter was choked way down, the filter will obviously go in to bypass mode, and if the filter's bypass can not handle the flow from the pump at higher engine RPM, then the pump will hit it's pressure relief.

This means at higher RPM, there could be a greatly reduced volume of oil supplying the engine because the pump would go in to relief mode when the the volume coming out of the pump was way less then if the filter wasn't super restrictive.

Bottom line ... could be a very bad situation for the engine. And the scary part is ... the driver of the car may not even see any signs something was wrong unless he has an oil pressure gauge to look at and know something is not right.

sayjac - good detective work!

 

[noblite]

Has anyone contacted Champ about this problem?

 

[edhackett]

I have. I talked to them this afternoon. I'll be sending the three filters that I bought to them FedEx on Monday. In the mean time they are going to send someone to Wal-Mart to look at the filters.

I cut open the ST7317 so I could view the tube from the by-pass end. All of the "holes" are completely closed on the base end. About one third are closed when viewed from the by-pass end. Those that are open are just tiny slits about 1/8 inch long and a couple of thousands wide, no where near enough area for proper flow.

The filter sayjac shows looks to be OK from the by-pass end. Some of the filters I looked at were OK, most were not. The good ones looked like sayjac's by-pass end on the base end also.

I won't be posting pictures, as I get a server error trying to access my pictures. The OP's picture tells the story just fine.

Ed

 

[Sayjac]

Two more pics from my ST 7317. Note Pic #1 base/thread end down, light on base end, lights show on cardboard below. Consistent with looking down dome end and seeing openings.
Pic #2, light on base end, note no lights below, light reflecting off base end at top. Ignore light coming out endcap at bottom, it was removed and fit back on.

I'm satisfied nothing wrong with this filter. Also, difficult to determine anything definitive regarding centertube without dissection.

#1

#2

 

[river_rat]

Cool pics!

I used to look for potential leaks in my welds in grease ducting that way.

Ya. the D+ I looked at...can't remember the numbers...definitely had thicker than PureOne media.

 

[ABerns]

Went to Wal-Mart this evening, spent about 20 minutes going through Super Tech filters (while a Wal-Mart associate kept looking down the aisle - I think he wanted me gone so he could stock the shelves, so I felt kinda bad).

Anyway, a few of them seemed to have the same problems mentioned here - it was very hard for me to tell, though. If there were holes, they were very minimal. Mentioned something to the associate - probably thinks I'm crazy, but it was worth a shot to prevent trouble for someone else.