Suggest an oil change strategy for my new vehicle

[devnull]

I just purchased a new 2011 Honda Odyssey. This vehicle is equipped with a "maintenance minder" that (supposedly) displays the engine oil's remaining useful life. On the Ford Duratec-equipped vehicle that the Odyssey replaced, I changed the oil every 5K miles using Motorcraft synthetic blend oil and filters. When I bought the Odyssey, I was advised by the Honda dealership that the maintenance minder will sometimes go well beyond 5K miles before reporting that an oil change is necessary, and that it was up to me to decide whether to stick with 5K mile OCIs or trust the computer.

So I have a few questions for the BITOG experts. Assuming severe duty on this vehicle, meaning mostly short trips combined with mountain driving:

(1) Would you change the oil every 5K miles, or would you do what the maintenance minder recommends?

(2) Would you stick with Ford Motorcraft oil on a non-Ford engine, or use something else? Honda says to use a 0W-20 oil, which I've never used before.

(3) Would you go with Honda's OEM oil filter, or use something else?

(4) The owner's manual says not to change the oil for the first time until the maintenance minder says to do it. Can you tell me why this is the case?

(5) I've recently heard it said that the first transmission fluid drain and fill is the most important one. Is this true, and if so, would you recommend changing the transmission fluid sooner than 30K miles?

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[TurboTravis]

Follow the manual. It's literally that easy.

 

[DrDusty86]

1) Wait until the service minder gets to 10% remaining.
2) Motor Craft is an EXELLENT oil. 0w20 Honda oil is inexpensive at the dealer. Castrol Edge also has 0w20, Mobil 1 also has 0w20. ALL are great choices... flip a coin.
3) My filter rankings would be M1, Honda OE, WIX. Again no bad choices here.
4) I'm guessing: Honda programed the monitor to go off early for the first oil change for break in wear metals.
5) In a honda, YES, I would change it sooner... I'd do it at 15k then 25k after that. Use only OE fluid here.. Hondas have had a rough track record with their auto trans.. By all means change it early. Its the only weak point on the odyssey that I'm aware of.
Dusty

 

[SkyGod]

I changed my oil at 1000 miles on my two last 2 new Toyota"s.
Quite a bit of metal in the filter.
I then run synthetic at 5000 mile intervals.
Break in the first few miles with some short high rpm bursts to seal the rings.
Don't baby it.

 

[DrDusty86]

Travis, We at BITOG want whats BEST for our "babies". He's new and came to us for advise...
FYI the manual for my car says to NEVER service the trans....uuuummm yea.... I'll follow that to a "T" NNNOOOOTTT!
Dusty

 

[Lead Shoes]

I agree, make sure it sees a couple high rpm runs during the wear in, just basically drive it like you are going to for its lifetime.

And although the manual is not always right, the suggested OCI is usually spot on.

 

[The Critic]

1) I would consider changing every 5k if you plan on keeping the car for a long time. There have been recently posts about PCV issues in Honda 3.5 engines (though they have may have been resolved) that have resulted in sludge build-up.

2) Honda requires 0w-20. I would use the required oil. Mobil 1 AFE 0w-20 is available in 5-quart jugs at Walmart for $24.50.

3) The Honda filter is decent for the money if you can find it for $4-$5, but its a very average filter. It's better than the SuperTech and Purolator Classic offerings, and is a safe choice.

4) The factory fill has a higher level of anti-wear additives. This is because the assembly lube in the engine is mixed in with the initial fill of engine oil. Supposedly, this concoction will provide additional wear protection during break-in.

5) Transmissions used to be an issue in the past, and everyone is still very critical of Honda for this, but there's no evidence that there have been any widespread transmission issues since about 2004. Still, Honda transmissions are easy to service and I usually service them at about 15k with the ATF DW-1 fluid from the dealer. It is a very easy job and it takes 3.5-4 quarts of fluid. The fluid is drained from a drain plug at the bottom of the case.

 

[Steve S]

How long do you plan to keep the Honda?

 

[yaris0128]

Originally Posted By: TurboTravis
Follow the manual. It's literally that easy.
+1 If everyone that didnt care about their cars too much did that then you really cant go wrong with any kind of lubrication based problems. Especially in 2011 with our high quality motor oils.

 

[Beagle2000]

If I were you I would fill the crankcase with olive oil and filter it through a pair of your wife's old pantyhose.
I really get tired of these stupid posts that over analyze every last possibility.
I know someone will post and say if you don't like the question then just walk away and move on but some of the posts on here go beyond anal and approach outright stupid.
This one qualifies for stupid.
You have a brand new vehicle so why would you be dumb enough to even consider doing anything other than what the manufacturer recommends.
I mean really?

 

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: Beagle2000

You have a brand new vehicle so why would you be dumb enough to even consider doing anything other than what the manufacturer recommends.
I mean really?


My owner's manual told me that all of the driveline fluids were good for the life of the vehicle. I was probably 10K away from catastrophic failure of my AWD clutch when I changed the fluid @ 90K.

Honda recommended 105K valve adjustments on some early model CRV's (and 15K on other models with similar heads?). You can pretty much guess the result...

The manufacturers don't always get it right. They're juggling competing interests of having cars last and selling a "low maintenance" vehicle. Often times, their idea of service life may conflict with the owner's idea. If it does, then one should consider adjusting some of the service intervals accordingly. Not doing so is, to use your word, dumb...

 

[JOD]

keep in mind the MM will recognize if you're operating the vehicle in severe duty. So, changing based on miles makes little sense. If you want to give yourself an extra measure of protection, change it at an earlier % of the MM's recommendation (say 25-30% of life left) rather than base it on something as arbitrary as miles. That's the whole point of monitoring things besides miles--it's based on more complete information.

I would go with the factory fill for at last 80% of the MM's recommendation, based on its unique composition, and I'd probably do one early drain of the ATF. The PureOne filter seems to offer the best filtration, excellent flow and reasonable price, so I'd probably go with that for an oil filter. For oil, any 0W20 would work. I'm using Toyota's 0W20 in my Duratec, mostly because it's the lightest at startup. If you're doing a lot of short trips, that may be a consideration. Walmart's not the only place that sells oil... This stuff is cheaper from some dealers than M1 is at Walmart.

Regarding the tranmission, it really makes more sense to me to do frequent, single drain and fills, say every 20K, than the 3x every 60K.

That's my .02.

 

[Eddie]

+1 follow the manual. The AT problems were solved years ago so no changes from the manual recomendations are necessary.

 

[DCRamsey]

Since no one has said it, I’ll be the martyr. I would change the oil the second I got home. Then change it when I had put 1,000 miles on it and again after another 1,500 miles had been put on the vehicle. Then I would begin whatever interval I was going to use. I would never leave that initial fill in for 5,000 miles. There is quite a bit of residue left over from the manufacturing process and there’s no good reason to let it stay in the engine for the first 5,000 miles. I haven’t seen anything that proves there is a “special break in oil in the Honda.” I do have proof that the first few oil changes will have all kinds of material you don’t want circulating through the oil system. I have 189,000 on a 2004 Honda Accord and the Motorcraft is an excellent choice. If your vehicle calls for a 0W20 there are a number of good choices available.

 

[OldCowboy]

Originally Posted By: JOD
keep in mind the MM will recognize if you're operating the vehicle in severe duty. So, changing based on miles makes little sense. If you want to give yourself an extra measure of protection, change it at an earlier % of the MM's recommendation (say 25-30% of life left) rather than base it on something as arbitrary as miles. That's the whole point of monitoring things besides miles--it's based on more complete information.


+1 on changing according to the oil minder. Mileage is a lousy way to determine when to change oil. Frequent short trips are much harder on oil than long trips at highway speeds. The oil minder has an algorithm that takes trip length, load, speed, temp, etc all into consideration to give you a much more reasonable OCI than mileage.

 

[NHHEMI]

Originally Posted By: TurboTravis
Follow the manual. It's literally that easy.

Just do what Honda tells you to do while under warranty and you are good to go. Use the right weight, ratings, and change it on time according to the owner's manual. Certainly it won't hurt to be more dilligent about maintenance than what Honda wants and to change fluids more often but do not exceed what they allow for time wise and do not deviate from the types of fluids they require.

 

[RichR]

Go with the MM and use a synthetic 5 or 0-20.
You will go past the 5k mark.I have a one year old RL and never went past the 5k oci.
Supposedly Honda gives the fill extra moly for break in
at the engine plant.Go with the Honda filter that ends with 01 in its part number.H&A sells them.Its the better of the two for that engine.
Honda does not recommend flushing their transmissions.
Get 4 qts. of DW-1 and drain and refill it at an early mileage.
I'm sure there are forums you can read to find the locations of the drain and refill plugs.Always loosen the refill before draining and be ready to put some muscle to the wrench Honda like to really tighten them.
Also do the p/s fluid with a turkey baster at every oc.
Use only Honda fluids except for oil and you should be fine.

 

[ahoier]

(1) I'd go by the MM definitely......the engineers knew what they were doing, the MM is very "smart" and knows when the oil needs to be replaced based on how you're driving.....so ya, if you are doing "severe service" driving, it'll acknowledge that fact when you notate your MM % and your mileage....

(2) I'd go for the 0W-20......if that's what Honda specs, I'd go with it....BTW, is that per the "Oil Cap" or the Manual? a 5W-20 or 5W-30 may be usable even.....but I'd definitely consult the owner's manual for that opinion

(3) whatever you can find that's cheap, tried, tested, and true. I particularly like the Fram XG and TG filters.

(4) During assembly they use special assembly lube with additives to help with the break in....I'd take the first OCI to at LEAST 10%...just so the additives can help break in the engine.

(5) I'd change out the filter at 20k....and then every 30k thereafter. And only use Honda approved fluids...per the manual. Some you may be able to get "Aftermarket" I believe the Supertech "MERCON V" is spec'd for Honda but I could be wrong. But definitely go with something Honda approved.

 

[devnull]

Originally Posted By: DrDusty86
Travis, We at BITOG want whats BEST for our "babies".


Exactly. That's why I posted here. Thanks for the suggestions, DrDusty.

Originally Posted By: The Critic
5) Transmissions used to be an issue in the past, and everyone is still very critical of Honda for this, but there's no evidence that there have been any widespread transmission issues since about 2004.


That's good to hear. My Acura TL had transmission issues. A family member's Honda required a complete transmission rebuild. Like you, though, I think I'll be changing the transmission fluid in the Odyssey sooner than the manual recommends.

Originally Posted By: Steve S
How long do you plan to keep the Honda?


About ten years assuming 15K per year, maybe longer if it proves to be a better vehicle than my last Honda.

Originally Posted By: JOD
Originally Posted By: Beagle2000

You have a brand new vehicle so why would you be dumb enough to even consider doing anything other than what the manufacturer recommends.
I mean really?


My owner's manual told me that all of the driveline fluids were good for the life of the vehicle. I was probably 10K away from catastrophic failure of my AWD clutch when I changed the fluid @ 90K.


This. The vehicle that the Odyssey replaced had "lifetime transmission fluid" according to the owner's manual. I've heard of many problems with Audi and BMW transmissions that were resolved when the owners went against the manual and replaced the "lifetime transmission fluid." Similarly, when I was having transmission problems with my Acura, more than one technician said they did not recommend using Honda Z1 ATF, despite the owner's manuals saying it was imperative that it be used. (The transmission had Mobil 1 in it when I sold the car.)

Originally Posted By: OldCowboy
+1 on changing according to the oil minder. Mileage is a lousy way to determine when to change oil. Frequent short trips are much harder on oil than long trips at highway speeds. The oil minder has an algorithm that takes trip length, load, speed, temp, etc all into consideration to give you a much more reasonable OCI than mileage.


Thanks for the suggestions everyone. I've decided to trust the maintenance minder, both for the factory fill and afterwards.

 

[DrDusty86]

Critic:
My step mom's 07' oddy has had 2 replacement transmissions it has 66k One was replaced by dad as it was "just" outside the warranty. I'll see if I can post the bill....EEEEKKKK it wasn't cheap.. Honda's still do have trans issues or hers would still be on the #1. TAKE CARE OF THE TRANS early OR IT WILL FAIL! Period...
Dusty