Straight weight oil for new engine break in?

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Originally Posted By: willistheguy
Oh unfortunately I was being sloppy there and just used the words interchangeably. The main point I was saying is that stuff is tight because it's new
laugh.gif
I didn't have time to get reallly in depth with the micrometers but I know the crankshaft was virtually perfect.

Also I should mention the engine has a NEW CAM. So I will be doing the factory camshaft break in procedure (~2000 rpm varying 100 rpm up and down for 20-30 minutes).


The break in procedure you're talking about above is for flat tappet camshafts, your roller cam requires no such break in. Just fire it up, top off the fluids and enjoy.

What kind of vehicle is it going in? Carb or efi? Stock cam or larger? What are the details on the rebuild?
 
Originally Posted By: SR5
A mineral 10W30 that is high on zinc and low on VII would be my pick. Like VR-1 10W30 or a HDEO 10W30 or 15W30.

However you have roller cams and the oil is already in the sump. Have you consider electric pan heaters or dip stick heaters?, you know the plug in oil heaters they run in Canada and similar places over winter. Just an idea from a guy that lives in the tropics.


You know you can see Canada from Michigan right? It's basically the same weather as Southcentral Canada and so people in Michigan know about oil pan heaters too.

The thing is, if this is a weekend or summer play toy, I wouldn't bother putting one on, I'd just put 5w30 stout oil in it and go.

And yes x2, on no need for a cam break in procedure on a roller cam.
 
Originally Posted By: jayg

You know you can see Canada from Michigan right? It's basically the same weather as Southcentral Canada and so people in Michigan know about oil pan heaters too.

No I don't, but now I do. No offence intended.

What I'm saying, is that it already has SAE30 in the sump, why not use a pan heater to warm it up before you fire it up for the first time.
 
Originally Posted By: SR5
Originally Posted By: jayg

You know you can see Canada from Michigan right? It's basically the same weather as Southcentral Canada and so people in Michigan know about oil pan heaters too.

No I don't, but now I do. No offence intended.

What I'm saying, is that it already has SAE30 in the sump, why not use a pan heater to warm it up before you fire it up for the first time.

Reprime the engine before starting.
 
SAE 30 is just fine. I have built about 35 small block Chevy engines and have broke EVERY ONE in with SAE 30 oil. After 500 miles, I would then run 10W30 for 1K miles. After that 1K miles, 10W30 or 5W30.
 
Originally Posted By: SR5

What I'm saying, is that it already has SAE30 in the sump, why not use a pan heater to warm it up before you fire it up for the first time.



Because he may not have a spare pan heater to install on the motor and even if he did, it may be a pain to install it (some epoxy on). This is likely on a car that wont ever need it again if its not a daily driver in the winter. If it is a built motor hotrod daily riving in MI in the winter, it'll rust in half before there is an issue regarding lubrication.

Much easier to either just turn it on in the 40s (not that cold) or drain it and put a 5w30 in it.
 
Originally Posted By: willistheguy
Oh unfortunately I was being sloppy there and just used the words interchangeably. The main point I was saying is that stuff is tight because it's new
laugh.gif
I didn't have time to get reallly in depth with the micrometers but I know the crankshaft was virtually perfect.

Also I should mention the engine has a NEW CAM. So I will be doing the factory camshaft break in procedure (~2000 rpm varying 100 rpm up and down for 20-30 minutes).

You have a roller cam , you don't need to do that 30 minute breakin procedure if you didn't know.
 
Originally Posted By: FordCapriDriver
Originally Posted By: willistheguy
Oh unfortunately I was being sloppy there and just used the words interchangeably. The main point I was saying is that stuff is tight because it's new
laugh.gif
I didn't have time to get reallly in depth with the micrometers but I know the crankshaft was virtually perfect.

Also I should mention the engine has a NEW CAM. So I will be doing the factory camshaft break in procedure (~2000 rpm varying 100 rpm up and down for 20-30 minutes).

You have a roller cam , you don't need to do that 30 minute breakin procedure if you didn't know.

Yep, roller cam=No 20 minute cam break in @ 2K rpm.
 
Originally Posted By: jayg
Originally Posted By: SR5

What I'm saying, is that it already has SAE30 in the sump, why not use a pan heater to warm it up before you fire it up for the first time.



Because he may not have a spare pan heater to install on the motor and even if he did, it may be a pain to install it (some epoxy on). This is likely on a car that wont ever need it again if its not a daily driver in the winter. If it is a built motor hotrod daily riving in MI in the winter, it'll rust in half before there is an issue regarding lubrication.

Much easier to either just turn it on in the 40s (not that cold) or drain it and put a 5w30 in it.


Yeah, I get that. I meant something removable, which is why I also mentioned a dip-stick heater.
Remember the OP was talking about warming oil on the stove. I'm thinking there are better options to warm the oil, and yes non permanent options.

Yes, he may not have a spare heater, but given as you already pointed out how cold it gets there and how people in Michigan know about this stuff etc., then maybe a friend has something to lend him for a day or two. Given how common they are, and how you can see Canada on a clear day...
 
There is lots of good advice here. Generally, when it comes to monogrades and break in, note that a lot of the actual break in oils available are monogrades. I suppose they limit the VII package, cut the friction modifiers, and load up on AW compounds. For a flat tappet engine, particularly a high performance one, that would be useful.

For your case, you won't need this. But, such products are available when you do.
 
Originally Posted By: Garak
Is that before or after your ten minute warmup?
wink.gif

In California we do a 10 minute warm up when ever the temps drop below 60*f. Darn near freezing don't ya know.
 
OP, that site you linked to contains this:-

"Friction modifiers are long chain polymers similar to synthetic rubber that are ground up and blended into multi-viscosity oils. This allows the use of a thinner viscosity base oil for easier cold starting and reduced friction. As the oil heats up, the friction modifier thickens and allows the oil to behave more like a heavier viscosity oil at operating temperature."

They seem to be confusing friction modifiers and viscosity index improvers, which doesn't inspire confidence, though maybe there are some with dual-function?

I've never done a full engine rebuild, but 4WIW if I had 30W in it I'd use it.

I doubt you need to heat the oil on the stove, but if you wanted to it'd be do-able using a double boiler. It'll be hot to handle though.
 
Originally Posted By: willistheguy
Oh unfortunately I was being sloppy there and just used the words interchangeably. The main point I was saying is that stuff is tight because it's new
laugh.gif
I didn't have time to get reallly in depth with the micrometers but I know the crankshaft was virtually perfect.

Also I should mention the engine has a NEW CAM. So I will be doing the factory camshaft break in procedure (~2000 rpm varying 100 rpm up and down for 20-30 minutes).
If you did not measure the parts how do you know they are clearanced properly? Measuring is one of the most important things to do when assembling an engine.
 
Okay okay okay!

Let's refocus here. The reason this post exists is to discuss the reasoning for using a straight weight oil for an engine rebuild. I did not give that much information about my engine build initially because this was supposed to be more of a general topic.

Here are some responses:
-I am not concerned about block/oil heaters because this is not a winter car, I just happened to finish the build near winter.
-You are right CT8, measuring is important. I'm in school for automotive. (I haven't taken my fuels/lubes course yet :D). I don't want to get into the discussion of why I did what to my engine. It was calculated. I just want to discuss this threads topic.
-Some would disagree with those of you who are saying you don't need to break in a roller cam: Roller cam break in. Also from Micheal Prodemand's general break in tips (doesn't specify roller or not but roller engine vehicle was entered into prodemands vehicle search): "Breakin procedure is required when new or reground camshaft has been installed. Operate and maintain engine speed between 1500-2500 RPM for approximately 30 minutes. Procedure may vary due to manufacturer's recommendations." (I get break in is much more sensitive for flat tappets but nonetheless some say you need to do the same break in for roller cams)

Since people asked, here is more details on THIS build (I still want to focus on the straight weight oil question)
91 thunderbird 302 block, cylinder bores ball honed only
87 mustang rotating assembly + pistons
new cam bearings, rod bearings, main bearings
chrome moly piston rings (would switch to iron if I could go back)
96 explorer heads/intakes with full valve job and new springs
Trick flow stage 1 roller cam
Ford racing lifters + new pushrods
1.6 Roller rockers
Reman oil pump
Comp cams timing gear set
 
I have never done a cam break in on a roller motor because the cams wouldn't know the difference.

You don't need to heat your oil on a stove beforehand because it's not a 1925 expedition in a bush plane. You don't need an oil pan heater because as you said it's not a winter car. You can either run the 30 SAE which will be fine if you want start in the 30s-40s or drain it for a 5w30.

There isn't much else to add to this thread. Simple decisions for you to make.
 
Originally Posted By: Ducked
OP, that site you linked to contains this:-

"Friction modifiers are long chain polymers similar to synthetic rubber that are ground up and blended into multi-viscosity oils. This allows the use of a thinner viscosity base oil for easier cold starting and reduced friction. As the oil heats up, the friction modifier thickens and allows the oil to behave more like a heavier viscosity oil at operating temperature."

They seem to be confusing friction modifiers and viscosity index improvers, which doesn't inspire confidence, though maybe there are some with dual-function?

I've never done a full engine rebuild, but 4WIW if I had 30W in it I'd use it.

I doubt you need to heat the oil on the stove, but if you wanted to it'd be do-able using a double boiler. It'll be hot to handle though.


I suppose a viscosity modifier is also a hydrodynamic friction modifier when you think about it.
 
Originally Posted By: Jetronic
Originally Posted By: Ducked
OP, that site you linked to contains this:-

"Friction modifiers are long chain polymers similar to synthetic rubber that are ground up and blended into multi-viscosity oils. This allows the use of a thinner viscosity base oil for easier cold starting and reduced friction. As the oil heats up, the friction modifier thickens and allows the oil to behave more like a heavier viscosity oil at operating temperature."

They seem to be confusing friction modifiers and viscosity index improvers, which doesn't inspire confidence, though maybe there are some with dual-function?

I've never done a full engine rebuild, but 4WIW if I had 30W in it I'd use it.

I doubt you need to heat the oil on the stove, but if you wanted to it'd be do-able using a double boiler. It'll be hot to handle though.


I suppose a viscosity modifier is also a hydrodynamic friction modifier when you think about it.


Well yeh, but then so is oil. If you apply the term that broadly it ceases to have much meaning.

Don't like the "ground up rubber" bit much either. I'd like it even less if it was true.
 
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