stock market

[PandaBear]

Walmart employees seemed plenty essential to me. They didnt sit at home while people who's jobs mattered kept America afloat. Nope. They mattered, too, and were right out there working.


Let me make this simple: Did you sit at home last year and get paid by people's taxes, who were working, to burn oxygen? Then your job might not be super necessary.

Did you keep working for your pay? Then congrats! Your job is not just fluff.

Well, you were the one who called retail jobs fluff jobs, not me. I guess only the retailers you shopped at are essential and the ones you don't shop at are fluff?

My wife lost her job last year, and will be again this year at her new job. She was temporarily unemployed and collect unemployment checks. She was a QA in drug companies, 1 for lung cancer drug and another for leukemia treatment. Companies decided that they want to save money by consolidation, or lost money doing it. So they decided her position is a fluff job. You also decided that since she sat at home collecting money she is also not necessary.

She didn't get to keep working for her pay, so her job is a fluff. Sorry for the people who need those medicine I guess, it must be too cheap to be made with her salary.

 

[PandaBear]

I'd agree dairy farms are somewhat an aberration. Nothing is absolute.

You are a confusing man/woman. I guess I really cannot make out a consistent logic out of your arguments.

 

[wildcatgoal]

This is not financial advice. The 2021 stocks I will be targeting are:
- Airlines
- Cruise companies
- Mobile gaming
- Oil
- Weed stocks that are targets for M&A
- Med devices
- International banking

Your mileage may very.

 

[PandaBear]

I am putting a lot of money into Intel lately. I see that the demand for chips have increased and TSMC / Samsung / GloFo will have a hard time satisfied with all the demands at capacity. I do believe in the long run Intel will do well with the new CEO and they are righting the ship slowly, based on what I heard from leaks on "Moore's law is dead" pod cast on Youtube. It may not happen overnight but I do think the worst is over, and I am ok parking some my money on INTC for a decade waiting for it to go up.

Still holding onto AMD / NVDA / AMZN / MSFT, deciding whether to time the market with Micron, Seagate, WDC at the moment as the cycle is swinging to up turn. I would buy some MediaTek stock but it is not traded in the US, I am not sure if TSMC and ASML are at the right prices. My wife has been sinking money into Square and SalesForce.

We have paid off our mortgage and is not really in any debt. So other than property tax (and income tax of course) we don't really need much, and can afford a lot of risk with a long investment horizon. Rental income can sustain us even if we lose money and have to wait 10 years for a recovery. This is likely not the typical American investment strategy but it works well for us so far.

 

[JeffKeryk]

I think what you mean is "you just might end up making more money so you get to pay more taxes".

I was confident @Ws6 would get the point.

 

[Wolf359]

I was confident @Ws6 would get the point.

Well you could make more money and not pay taxes if you buy the right investments. Earnings from mutual funds/stocks don't get taxed as high and if the share price just goes up without spitting out any dividends or capital gains, on paper you make more money but don't have to pay any more in taxes. Also gains in a Roth would be tax free.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Well you could make more money and not pay taxes if you buy the right investments. Earnings from mutual funds/stocks don't get taxed as high and if the share price just goes up without spitting out any dividends or capital gains, on paper you make more money but don't have to pay any more in taxes. Also gains in a Roth would be tax free.

I have $$ in a Schwab CA Muni Tax fund. Double tax free. There is no such thing as a 100% safe investment, but this is pretty close.
No big gains but no taxes. Steady as she goes... Conservative as heck.

 

[Wolf359]

I have $$ in a Schwab CA Muni Tax fund. Double tax free. There is no such thing as a 100% safe investment, but this is pretty close.
No big gains but no taxes. Steady as she goes... Conservative as heck.

I never understood the pursuit of not paying taxes. I'd rather have a 10-13% return in something like the S&P 500 and pay a little taxes than a tax free 2% bond fund.

 

[PandaBear]

I never understood the pursuit of not paying taxes. I'd rather have a 10-13% return in something like the S&P 500 and pay a little taxes than a tax free 2% bond fund.

I think it depends on your risk profile and goal. Typically lower rate tax free funds have lower risk as well.

Of course, people have their own ideology or emotional reason for doing certain things, be it buying organic, domestic, charity work, not paying taxes, support veterans, etc. This is why one must not assume he or she is always "right" and others are "wrong" but only what works for us and what doesn't work for us.

Personally I hate dividend stocks, it is higher tax than capital gain, it is a way for the management to tell you they don't know how to grow the company (even if it means they are in a saturated market they could have try to penetrate into other markets instead), I do not need the money to come back to me to live on. Why would I pay top dollar for executives when all they do is sending me a check every month instead of coming up with ways to grow? Why are they just deflating the business doing nothing but sending me a check or buying back shares?

If I really want to not pay tax I want my investment to grow, and only sell them when I need the cash, problem solved. Why do I want a check come back to me every quarter and then I have to pay tax on it and then find ways to invest on it again?

 

[Dave Hess]

Still holding onto AMD / NVDA / AMZN / MSFT, deciding whether to time the market with Micron, Seagate, WDC at the moment as the cycle is swinging to up turn. I would buy some MediaTek stock but it is not traded in the US, I am not sure if TSMC and ASML are at the right prices. My wife has been sinking money into Square and SalesForce.

I‘m holding AAPL, AMZN and TSLA for the long run.
Got some NIO very very cheap and will see what happens.

The rest are a mix of ETFs and mutual funds, leveraged ETFs and some REITs for nice dividends.

Looking forward to economy reopening very soon.
.

 

[PimTac]

I think it depends on your risk profile and goal. Typically lower rate tax free funds have lower risk as well.

Of course, people have their own ideology or emotional reason for doing certain things, be it buying organic, domestic, charity work, not paying taxes, support veterans, etc. This is why one must not assume he or she is always "right" and others are "wrong" but only what works for us and what doesn't work for us.

Personally I hate dividend stocks, it is higher tax than capital gain, it is a way for the management to tell you they don't know how to grow the company (even if it means they are in a saturated market they could have try to penetrate into other markets instead), I do not need the money to come back to me to live on. Why would I pay top dollar for executives when all they do is sending me a check every month instead of coming up with ways to grow? Why are they just deflating the business doing nothing but sending me a check or buying back shares?

If I really want to not pay tax I want my investment to grow, and only sell them when I need the cash, problem solved. Why do I want a check come back to me every quarter and then I have to pay tax on it and then find ways to invest on it again?

What about a older investor who takes a set amount from their portfolio on a regular basis? Having a good portion in dividend paying stocks means less of the principle has to be sold to meet the payment.

 

[PandaBear]

What about a older investor who takes a set amount from their portfolio on a regular basis? Having a good portion in dividend paying stocks means less of the principle has to be sold to meet the payment.

As I mentioned before everyone has different need. I am middle age and already achieve financial independent, have an 80 year investment horizon, basically my investment is for my grand children, I can out last 8 market crash in theory. I also live in a high tax state but with close contact with an industry that is high risk high reward.

It doesn't work for everyone, I would not recommend the same for older investor with a need to cash out every month. I told my father in law (age 76) not to buy the same stock I'm buying, and I told him what I'm doing and he agreed as well.

Sooner or later you need to review your portfolio and see if the executives are cheating short term to give you more cash or are doing the job to invest for the long term. It is very easy to cheat and give out dividend, it is very hard to grow for the future.

 

[Ws6]

Agree, and the existence of these jobs mean someone think they are worth keeping.

Of course we don't get equilibrium all the time. Sometimes it takes decades for some old jobs to exit the market. For example we have a lot of excess milk these days and farms are gradually giving up and exiting. It takes a decade or two but eventually we will have fewer bigger farms. It does not mean today's dairy farmers are doing fluff jobs, or are not essential. What happen to them are unfortunate but natural in the economy, and it takes time for things to eventually settle down one way or another.

I'd agree dairy farms are somewhat an aberration. There are no absolutes.

Well, you were the one who called retail jobs fluff jobs, not me. I guess only the retailers you shopped at are essential and the ones you don't shop at are fluff?

My wife lost her job last year, and will be again this year at her new job. She was temporarily unemployed and collect unemployment checks. She was a QA in drug companies, 1 for lung cancer drug and another for leukemia treatment. Companies decided that they want to save money by consolidation, or lost money doing it. So they decided her position is a fluff job. You also decided that since she sat at home collecting money she is also not necessary.

She didn't get to keep working for her pay, so her job is a fluff. Sorry for the people who need those medicine I guess, it must be too cheap to be made with her salary.

Like I also stated...there are no absolutes. Also yes, some retailers are fluff. Or do we really need Gucci handbags? We do need groceries though. Fuel. Etc.

Your wife was the victim of her company, not of being fluff or inessential. There is a difference. Any company can make poor choices as such.

 

[Ws6]

I never understood the pursuit of not paying taxes. I'd rather have a 10-13% return in something like the S&P 500 and pay a little taxes than a tax free 2% bond fund.

Some of us are just disgusted with where the money goes. We do all we can to not pay any more than necessary.

 

[Ws6]

You are a confusing man/woman. I guess I really cannot make out a consistent logic out of your arguments.

There is a consistent logic. It's just not super rigid, because there are exceptions that I'd expect someone to grasp, such as your wife losing her job. She obviously had an important job that is necessary. Meeting 1 aspect of the criteria I stated doesn't change that in my mind. Nor in yours, likely.

Was her industry relieved of duty? No. It was just her and a few others like her which worked for very short sighted companies.

Then you wanted to apply "all retail " to my statement. I guess I'm lucky you didnt assume I meant people who sell and supply home oxygen or something?

Dude, you have to have actual common sense. You know very well Michael Kors retailers and RedBall Oxygen retailers are not the same, lol!


All that said....I said "...worked retail or had some fluff...." and "I dont...and I dont"


This clearly delineates a separation between "retail" and "fluff".

Go back and read that post again.


This takes us all the way back to my chastising your lack of reading comprehension. And here we are again. You are either not comprehending what I type, or you are being disingenuous and choosing to pretend you cannot.

 

[JeffKeryk]

I never understood the pursuit of not paying taxes. I'd rather have a 10-13% return in something like the S&P 500 and pay a little taxes than a tax free 2% bond fund.

Your point is well taken. In my case, I have plenty of risk that I manage (tech), plenty of "safer" index funds and such in the Schwab Private Client and the CA Bond Fund. It's a way to diversify. As you know, bonds can be a hedge against stocks. I think we all expect interest rates to climb one of htese days, so the bonds will do better... But they are performing as expected.

I agree with paying taxes being a nice problem to have.

 

[Wolf359]

Your point is well taken. In my case, I have plenty of risk that I manage (tech), plenty of "safer" index funds and such in the Schwab Private Client and the CA Bond Fund. It's a way to diversify. As you know, bonds can be a hedge against stocks. I think we all expect interest rates to climb one of htese days, so the bonds will do better... But they are performing as expected.

I agree with paying taxes being a nice problem to have.

They always said that but I never found that to be the case so I dumped my bonds years ago. When the market was down, they were down, when it was up, it was just up a little. They just tracked the market except you got lower returns so I figured why even bother locking in lower returns?

 

[Wolf359]

Some of us are just disgusted with where the money goes. We do all we can to not pay any more than necessary.

You're basically getting worked up over nothing. Basically the facts of life. Don't like it, get active politically and try to change it, but there's also people on the other side who will oppose you. Your arguments and logic so far aren't very persuasive or strong so I don't like your odds.

You should have learned as a child that not everyone gets their way.

 

[supton]

They always said that but I never found that to be the case so I dumped my bonds years ago. When the market was down, they were down, when it was up, it was just up a little. They just tracked the market except you got lower returns so I figured why even bother locking in lower returns?

I figure, once I get a decent nest egg, a few years out from retirement I might like to have 5 years of expenses or so in bonds. A few years to draw from, if it all crashes. But not more than that. Just enough to get by, so I don't buy high and sell low, that mentality.

 

[Wolf359]

I figure, once I get a decent nest egg, a few years out from retirement I might like to have 5 years of expenses or so in bonds. A few years to draw from, if it all crashes. But not more than that. Just enough to get by, so I don't buy high and sell low, that mentality.

Took one day for me to set up a margin account. You can tap up to 50% of the cash value of the account. Transfers take 1 day or less.