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Originally Posted By: jarad248
Castrol edge or edge him. Best oil made.
How about GTX hm?
Castrol edge or edge him. Best oil made.
How about GTX hm?
Stay the course or switch to HM
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Originally Posted By: UltrafanUK
Originally Posted By: rsylvstr
Originally Posted By: UltrafanUK
If it does not leak or have serious valve guide oil seal issues causing a high oil consumption it's not a good idea to use an HM oil.
Whys that?
Most of them are just cheap conventional base oils that have extra seal conditioners and swellers added. Some of them are better than others and Mobil do seem to be top dog in HM oils in that repect.
If you use seal swellers the oil seal will press on the associated shaft with more force than is
normal and although that is good news IF the oil seals are worn, it is bad news if they are not, as they will wear out faster. Seal conditioners increase the friction between seal and shaft, which also increases seal wear rates, so regardless of which type of chemical additive is used in an attempt to help old oil seals work better, they are not worth using if you don't have bad seals or leaky gaskets.
HM oils are also supposed to contain more detergents and AW additives, BUT that is not true of most of them, just take a look at their VOA's.
Liqui Moly don't make an HM oil and they insist that it's better to stick with an approved or recommended oil and use enough stop leak additive (Motor Oil Saver) to reduce leak rates or oil consumption.
Ok if this is true then why do valvoline and castrol edge high mileage recommend their oil for newer cars as well as older....??also they contain seal conditioners not anything that changes the physical makeup of the seals,comments?
Originally Posted By: rsylvstr
Originally Posted By: UltrafanUK
If it does not leak or have serious valve guide oil seal issues causing a high oil consumption it's not a good idea to use an HM oil.
Whys that?
Most of them are just cheap conventional base oils that have extra seal conditioners and swellers added. Some of them are better than others and Mobil do seem to be top dog in HM oils in that repect.
If you use seal swellers the oil seal will press on the associated shaft with more force than is
normal and although that is good news IF the oil seals are worn, it is bad news if they are not, as they will wear out faster. Seal conditioners increase the friction between seal and shaft, which also increases seal wear rates, so regardless of which type of chemical additive is used in an attempt to help old oil seals work better, they are not worth using if you don't have bad seals or leaky gaskets.
HM oils are also supposed to contain more detergents and AW additives, BUT that is not true of most of them, just take a look at their VOA's.
Liqui Moly don't make an HM oil and they insist that it's better to stick with an approved or recommended oil and use enough stop leak additive (Motor Oil Saver) to reduce leak rates or oil consumption.
Ok if this is true then why do valvoline and castrol edge high mileage recommend their oil for newer cars as well as older....??also they contain seal conditioners not anything that changes the physical makeup of the seals,comments?
I once pondered the same thing - going to hi mileage oil. My 2008 CTS has hit 130k miles and my 2006 Sierra Denali has hit 145k miles - both have been run on Mobil 1 and EP their entire lives. No leaks, no oil consumption so I just keep the same formula that works.
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I just started running a HM oil in my Subaru due to a 1 qt every 3000 miles oil leak (not that bad I know.) It seems to have slowed that down nicely. My 96 Sonoma w/275k gets regular Mobil 1...
I don't think there is a need to go HM unless you're leaking or smoking etc.
I don't think there is a need to go HM unless you're leaking or smoking etc.
Originally Posted By: Matt6127
I just started running a HM oil in my Subaru due to a 1 qt every 3000 miles oil leak (not that bad I know.) It seems to have slowed that down nicely. My 96 Sonoma w/275k gets regular Mobil 1...
I don't think there is a need to go HM unless you're leaking or smoking etc.
I should say I'm not a Mobil 1 fan, that's just what my mechanic sells for synthetic.
I just started running a HM oil in my Subaru due to a 1 qt every 3000 miles oil leak (not that bad I know.) It seems to have slowed that down nicely. My 96 Sonoma w/275k gets regular Mobil 1...
I don't think there is a need to go HM unless you're leaking or smoking etc.
I should say I'm not a Mobil 1 fan, that's just what my mechanic sells for synthetic.
Some years ago most of the major brand oil companies decided to reduce the amount of seal conditioners and swellers used in their HM oils to comply with API specs for newer cars. So if you have a 10 year old can of an HM oil and compare it with the same current product, it has less in the way of seal swellers in particular and in reality are less effective at reducing oil consumption (If it's caused by valve guide oil seals and not bad rings), or oil leaks. Obviously that move was good for the sales of HM oils and it was good in profit terms because most of the base stocks used are just cheap dino or cheap HC synthetics.
I don't think any oil company is making a GTL or Group 4 synthoil HM oil, or even making an 0w40 HM (Might be wrong about that), so although HM oils do have their uses, they have been a step in the wrong direction if your vehicle has a turbo or you like doing extended OCI's in particular.
PS: If you have an oil dripper or burner that is beyond economic repair, first of all find out what is causing the problem, as it might be fuel contamination or thin oil use. If the rings are bad, then there is not a lot you can do other than keep the revs low and experiment with extra AW additives, fuel additives (If it's a stuck oil control ring issue) and even Italian tunes ups to burn out the Carbon.
If the valve guide oil seals are bad and you don't need an 0w, then if the problem is not too bad, an HM oil might be of use if it has the correct specs (USE THE OIL FINDER PAGE and owners manual), otherwise try a major brand stop leal additive as the good ones are far more effective than HM oils.
Oil leaks that are beyond economic repair can be reduced or even stopped by using both a stop leak additive AND a thicker oil, BUT be careful as thicker oils can increase upper cylinder wear rates due to slower flow rates. Moving up one grade never seems to cause any real issues unless the oil flow is already restricted by sludge or varnish.
Finally make sure the crank case vent system is working, cos if it blocks, the oil drip or burn rate can go into orbit!
PPS: Just to clarify one point, seal conditioners soften oil seals which helps them work, BUT it also increases the rate at which a new or good oil seal wears out if the oil contains the levels used in HM oils, so in reality there is not much difference between a sweller and a conditioner.
I don't think any oil company is making a GTL or Group 4 synthoil HM oil, or even making an 0w40 HM (Might be wrong about that), so although HM oils do have their uses, they have been a step in the wrong direction if your vehicle has a turbo or you like doing extended OCI's in particular.
PS: If you have an oil dripper or burner that is beyond economic repair, first of all find out what is causing the problem, as it might be fuel contamination or thin oil use. If the rings are bad, then there is not a lot you can do other than keep the revs low and experiment with extra AW additives, fuel additives (If it's a stuck oil control ring issue) and even Italian tunes ups to burn out the Carbon.
If the valve guide oil seals are bad and you don't need an 0w, then if the problem is not too bad, an HM oil might be of use if it has the correct specs (USE THE OIL FINDER PAGE and owners manual), otherwise try a major brand stop leal additive as the good ones are far more effective than HM oils.
Oil leaks that are beyond economic repair can be reduced or even stopped by using both a stop leak additive AND a thicker oil, BUT be careful as thicker oils can increase upper cylinder wear rates due to slower flow rates. Moving up one grade never seems to cause any real issues unless the oil flow is already restricted by sludge or varnish.
Finally make sure the crank case vent system is working, cos if it blocks, the oil drip or burn rate can go into orbit!
PPS: Just to clarify one point, seal conditioners soften oil seals which helps them work, BUT it also increases the rate at which a new or good oil seal wears out if the oil contains the levels used in HM oils, so in reality there is not much difference between a sweller and a conditioner.
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