Starting Problem

[The Critic]

Was at MCD's during lunch with my mom, eating off the dollar menu. Come out...

First try: Crank, no start
Second try: "Click"
Third try: Starts, no problem.

Any ideas? The key looked a bit "worn out," and my dad theorized that this may've been the problem, so he put another key on the keychain...but I'm still stumped. This has happened before about six months ago, and this is the first time that the problem has returned.

TIA.

 

[moribundman]

Is that a VW?

 

[The Critic]

No, it was my GM.

 

[Steve S]

Probably the starter. with out diagnosing with a volt meter a guess. Usually the contacts in the starter do that when they are wearing out .Of course check and clean the battery terminals and cables so they have good contace and the voltage drop is not too bad.

 

[George7941]

Bad starter contacts would not have led to the "crank, no start" condition. Was there a "crank, no start" condition six months ago when this first occurred?

 

[kgb007stb]

Gotta love those Saturns, you and I had prior discussions about other Saturn related problems. The crank no start could be more problems, I am mainly concerned about the click no start as that could indicate a worn starter, old batter or problems with the charging system. The first condition may or may not be related to fuel and spark delivery, that may be tougher to diagnose as there are many possibilities at hand. Watch it closely, my Saturn also pulls tricks on me like this once in a while.

 

[moribundman]

Quote:

---

The key looked a bit "worn out," and my dad theorized that this may've been the problem, so he put another key on the keychain.

---

Some cars' ignition locks go bad when you hang the warden's 3lbs keychain from the ignition lock (replace lock cylinder and key). Otherwise I'd say your ignition switch has a loose connection (wear and tear or dirt). Shouldn't be difficult to pop it out. If that car has an automatic transmission the neutral safety switch may be misadjusted. But you did hear a clicking noise, which was the starter solenoid, so I guess it can't be a problem with the neutral safety switch? I would definitely check if the starter motor has come loose. This happened to my Chevy and Buick on occasion. The starter was attached only with two puny bolts that would come loose over time. Then, when the starter motor was misaligned (intermittently) it wouldn't engage and the engine wouldn't start.

 

[The Critic]

Quote:

---

Bad starter contacts would not have led to the "crank, no start" condition. Was there a "crank, no start" condition six months ago when this first occurred?

---

I believe so.

Quote:

---

Some cars' ignition locks go bad when you hang the warden's 3lbs keychain from the ignition lock (replace lock cylinder and key). Otherwise I'd say your ignition switch has a loose connection (wear and tear or dirt). Shouldn't be difficult to pop it out. If that car has an automatic transmission the neutral safety switch may be misadjusted. But you did hear a clicking noise, which was the starter solenoid, so I guess it can't be a problem with the neutral safety switch? I would definitely check if the starter motor has come loose. This happened to my Chevy and Buick on occasion. The starter was attached only with two puny bolts that would come loose over time. Then, when the starter motor was misaligned (intermittently) it wouldn't engage and the engine wouldn't start.

---

Thanks, will do. The key chain normally has five or six keys on it.

Quote:

---

Probably the starter. with out diagnosing with a volt meter a guess. Usually the contacts in the starter do that when they are wearing out .Of course check and clean the battery terminals and cables so they have good contace and the voltage drop is not too bad.

---

How would I check the starter with a voltmeter? I just bought a voltmeter several days ago. The battery connections are tight and clean. Last time this happened, I had AAA come out and do a battery load test. Battery tested out fine.

Quote:

---

Gotta love those Saturns, you and I had prior discussions about other Saturn related problems. The crank no start could be more problems, I am mainly concerned about the click no start as that could indicate a worn starter, old battery or problems with the charging system. The first condition may or may not be related to fuel and spark delivery, that may be tougher to diagnose as there are many possibilities at hand. Watch it closely, my Saturn also pulls tricks on me like this once in a while.

---

I just hate it when these problems occur intermittently, makes them difficult to diagnose. The plugs/wires are new, so that should run ignition out...I hope. The battery has been serviced recently and passed a load test just fine. The alternator has 38k on it.

 

[kgb007stb]

Another thing that happened to me is that my sun roof was stuck open when I returned home Saturday night. Holy moly not a good thing especially when I can’t diagnose it in the dark, and as we know the rains will be here this week.

Looking from your listed location, I may have to take some suggestions about getting a good mechanic around here since I am still new to the Sac area and all of my trusted mechanics are down in Los Angeles.

 

[The Critic]

Quote:

---

Another thing that happened to me is that my sun roof was stuck open when I returned home Saturday night. Holy moly not a good thing especially when I can’t diagnose it in the dark, and as we know the rains will be here this week.

Looking from your listed location, I may have to take some suggestions about getting a good mechanic around here since I am still new to the Sac area and all of my trusted mechanics are down in Los Angeles.

---

Send me a PM and I can help you out...

 

[Jim 5]

Diagnose keyswitch:

You can diagnose the key switch by using a testlight probed into the "start" wire coming out of the switch. To do this, disconnect the skinny wire going in to the starter solenoid that is hot when the ignition switch is turned to start. Next ground your testlight, then touch the point of the testlight to the skinny wire that is hot when you move the switch to "start". Now, cycle the ignition key to the start position at least 10 times and ensure that the test light comes on each and every time your assistant turns the key to the start position.

If it does, and you are satisfied that the keyed ignition switch is not faulty, move down the system to the next component; the starter solenoid.

Diagnose Starter Solenoid:

Here is a good link that describes solenoid/starter diagnosing http://www.misterfixit.com/starttst.htm. Let us know how this works out for you.

 

[Junior]

Quote:

---

Diagnose keyswitch:

You can diagnose the key switch by using a testlight probed into the "start" wire coming out of the switch. To do this, disconnect the skinny wire going in to the starter solenoid that is hot when the ignition switch is turned to start. Next ground your testlight, then touch the point of the testlight to the skinny wire that is hot when you move the switch to "start". Now, cycle the ignition key to the start position at least 10 times and ensure that the test light comes on each and every time your assistant turns the key to the start position.

If it does, and you are satisfied that the keyed ignition switch is not faulty, move down the system to the next component; the starter solenoid.

Diagnose Starter Solenoid:

Here is a good link that describes solenoid/starter diagnosing http://www.misterfixit.com/starttst.htm. Let us know how this works out for you.

---

You would be much much better off using a mulitmeter to check for continuity. A test light should not be used with modern electronics.

 

[Junior]

And or checking for voltage.

 

[Jim 5]

I'm not so sure Junior is wrong, and his advice about the multimeter can't hurt.

However, to clarify the procedure above in light of junior's advice, if you are concerned about it, use the voltage function when substituting a multimeter in place of the test light for the procedure described above.

A continuity check in these circumstances will be exceedingly difficult without extraordinarily long multimeter cables, or without removing the ignition switch from the car and bench-testing it.

 

[kgb007stb]

Have you been able to resolve this last friday?