Short trips thin vs thick conclusion?

Status
Not open for further replies.
T

TheKracken

Joined
Apr 18, 2017
Messages
515
Location
Fort Worth TX
Has there been a conclusion if for a short tripping vehicle it is better to have a thin oil since the vehicle will never be up to operating temperature or something more like a 5w40 HDEO that can "handle" the fuel dilution better as well as a high dosage of ZDDP for start up wear?

My vehicle:

2004 toyota Sienna with 276k miles on the clock. Currently running PPHM synthetic 0w20. Considering running a HDEO 5w40 (I have 8 gallons of M1 TDT)

I have searched and can't seem to come to a conclusion.
 
I'd stick with the oil that got the Sienna to 276K miles, it appears that seems to be working.
 
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I'd stick with the oil that got the Sienna to 276K miles, it appears that seems to be working.


+1
 
If the manufacturer specs / allows the use of Xw20 I would feel even more comfortable using it on a short tripper. As you said it wont get up to operating temp so the oil will still be thicker than it needs to be.
 
Originally Posted By: TexasVaquero
0x20 can get to all parts of the engine quicker and lube quicker, so use it.


Really ???
 
Originally Posted By: Lubener
the reason you didn't find anything is because it is insignificant.


This looks like another job for Universal Answer B Man

The reason you didn't find anything is because Nobody Knows.

I'd bet.

But I don't know.
 
Originally Posted By: PimTac
As mentioned before,why not stick with what you have been running?


Maybe OP's driving habits/circumstances have changed since the 1st perfectly run 275.9k miles....
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: TheKracken
Has there been a conclusion if for a short tripping vehicle it is better to have a thin oil since the vehicle will never be up to operating temperature or something more like a 5w40 HDEO that can "handle" the fuel dilution better as well as a high dosage of ZDDP for start up wear?

My vehicle:

2004 toyota Sienna with 276k miles on the clock. Currently running PPHM synthetic 0w20. Considering running a HDEO 5w40 (I have 8 gallons of M1 TDT)

I have searched and can't seem to come to a conclusion.


I you're really short tripping like you say above:

- never up to operating temperature
- fair amount of fuel dilution

I'd advice thicker and with a higher concentration add pack.

Fuel and water thin out the concentration of all additives in the add pack AND thin out the viscosity of the oil. The thicker oil will not help with corrosion resistance but it won't make it worse either. Good thing is that corrosion attacks all metal surfaces, including the ones that aren't in contact and supporting moving parts. Corrosion in itself is harmless for 80% of the engine but not desireable of course.

A higher viscosity oil will reach an adequate temperature sooner to help in evaporating fuel and water.

High TBN (reserve alkalinity) is what you need to combat the acids reaching and forming in the oil. That kind of use drops the alkalinity quite ast, so if you can double the TBN, go for it. some HDEO have very high TBN.

ZDDP is also an anti-oxidant and will be important in this role. Having a synthetic (and high oxidatively stable) base oil will also help so the ZDDP isn't consumed to keep the base oil from oxidising and can be available to combat oxidising contaminants. It's not for start-up wear I'd want the ZDDP there.

But even with all that, you'll have reduced oci compared to a vehicle used on long runs and not suffering from dilution.
 
Seems the logical step up would be xw-30 ... but must of grabbed a deal on the TDT. Why not use it in the T100 (and/or)?
 
I'd switch to Mobil 1 AFE 0w20 and goose it with a quart of your TDT to use it up....this way your running slightly thicker oil and still having most of the benefits of 0w20 and getting rid of your 5w40. At 276K I doubt a little 5w40 will hurt...

I just realized you were running a HM 0w20 so you could use Mobil 1 HM 0w20 rather than AFE although I doubt it would make much difference...
 
Originally Posted By: TexasVaquero
0x20 can get to all parts of the engine quicker and lube quicker, so use it.


A quality 0-20
Originally Posted By: TexasVaquero
0x20 can get to all parts of the engine quicker and lube quicker, so use it.


My engines call for a 20wt oil and I use 0-20. Both engines still perform like new. A 40 wt will only increase the oil temp, make it harder on the oil pump, and flow slower to the cam area in very cold temps. Also may cause the engine to be a little more sluggish.
 
OP- great question--as I am in the same place---wife's 2017 Q5 3.0 is exclusievly short-tripped and wondering if 502 rated 5-30 or 5-40 would be the best choice
Steve
 
Thank you for all the responses thus far! I should have mentioned that the car specs 5w30 and back specs 0w20 and I believe 40 weight oils are okay too.

This car used to be used for long commuting but now the commute is short. The 0w20 was for potentially better fuel economy. Now that circumstances have changed, I am trying to evaluate if this is still the best oil for the vehicle. I like the idea of mixing the 5w40 and 0w20 AFE since I have both. Since it takes 5 quarts I would think maybe 1 quart of M1 0w20 and then a gallon jug of the tdt would work well.
 
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: FordCapriDriver
TexasVaquero said:
0x20 can get to all parts of the engine quicker and lube quicker, so use it.

Wrooooooooooong[/quot
40wt oil will flow to the cam area slower in very cold temps than a 0-20.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWiQyR7PWII

The OP is in Seattle, he doesn't need 0W oils, he could use 5W or 10W-Xx oils and be perfectly ok.
Click to expand...
 
Originally Posted By: FordCapriDriver

The OP is in Seattle, he doesn't need 0W oils, he could use 5W or 10W-XX oils and be perfectly ok.


Exactly. The 5W or even a 10W would be well suited for Seattle. Those oils will flow just as well as 0W in those temps. The extra viscosity at startup will give a little more cushion to the bearings while waiting for hydrodynamic lubrication ...and still flow fine. If the mfg specs 5w-30 I'd shoot for that. A strong add pack/TBN would be helpful.

It's sort of irrelevant to compare the flow of a 0w-20 to say a 5w-40 at startup. They both flow like thinner oils until the car reaches normal operating oil temps (130-170 deg F).

That ESSO video above is based on seeing temps of -30 deg F. That will never happen in Seattle where temps probably rarely dips under 20-30 deg F. The average winter low temp is in the upper 30's. The record low temp in Seattle is 0 deg F. back in 1950.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

A
Recommendation Needed... Short Trips and GDI Engine.
2 3
Replies
44
Views
5K
AdmiralYoda
C
Short Trip Oil Question
Replies
15
Views
3K
Jpc1623
N
Good quality oil for fuel dilution?
2 3
Replies
46
Views
4K
ARCOgraphite
I
  • Locked
Hopefully not a thick vs. thin thread
Replies
19
Views
4K
Gokhan
J
OCI/FCI of Many Years But With Low Miles
2
Replies
28
Views
2K
Jim Rogers
Back
Top