I have a 1/2 qt. of toyota top off oil thats about 1 year old. It has been on a shelf in my car port outside but not in the rain. The bottle is covered in dust but the cap has been on tight.
Safe to use?
Safe to use?
shelf life?
- Thread starter Bagger_Matt
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IMHO, this oil should be safe to use.
There's probably lots of oil that has sat on store shelves longer than that.
This is oil, not fresh meat or produce. Let's see - the prevailing opinion on BITOG is an almost religious fervor that OCIs should be extended to 6,000 or 7,000 miles even with conventional oil (more with synthetics) despite repeated cold-hot driving cycles, inevitable moisture collection, and blowby contamination buildup in the crankcase over the OCI. Contrast the above with a tightly sealed container of virgin motor oil - which, itself, has its full complement of protective additives at original concentration. Yeah, contemplating actually putting that oil in service after a year in storage after purchase is a real tough call. If you bother logging on to the various companies' MSDS sites (Golly, heaven forbid doing a bit of independent research!), they all state that the finished products, conventional or synthetic, are chemically stable under ambient temperatures conducive to mammalian life indefinitely. (For the reading-skills challenged, that's a very long time.) Stands to reason - the stuff in its unpurified state sat in the ground for millions of years. With most or all the reactive sulfer compounds and double-bond aromatics removed, does it make sense to believe the refined product is any less stable than the stinky, toxic, crude?
(Sorry for the sarcasm - been watchin' too much "House" on the FOX network - reality-based medical drama with attitude.
)
(Sorry for the sarcasm - been watchin' too much "House" on the FOX network - reality-based medical drama with attitude.
I think you are over simplifying a complicated issue in linking a fully formulated motor oil to crude oil. The question of shelf life has come up many times on this forum and if one were to do a search, you would find volumes of comments and opinions. There was an excellent article by Kathryn Carnes in the latest issue of Tribology and Lubrication Technology that helps to better understand the question of shelf life and oils. I think you might find some level of unsaturation (double bonds) in finished oils, but the things that are more problematic are the additives and their potential interaction with very trace levels of moisture. Additionally, you have certain types of additives such as antifoam suppressants that can agglomerate with time which reduces their efectiveness. So it is not that simple of a problem.
Makes you wonder about the guys that have 200 something quarts of oil stashed in their garages
Well - ChevronTexaco oils come with production date codes.
If it's in a bottle, I'll try to tighten the caps a bit. I won't do anything with hermetically sealed jugs.
If there was anything that needs expiration dates, it would be silicated coolant, with a shelf life of about 18 months before the silicates start to drop of of suspension.
I'm one of those fellow's with a rather large stash - some bottles being over 10 years old, (picked them up at a yard sale - yes, they were all sealed). What I have noticed is that the older oil is darker, (like strong tea dark) as compared to the lite honey brown of say, Costal Fleet 15W40. I'm not sure if that is the oil "going bad" so to speak, or if that's the color when it was new. My daughter's car just loves it!
Oh, by the way, there is such a thing as liquid rocks - it's called "hot lava." (The "B-52's sang all about it
).
Oh, by the way, there is such a thing as liquid rocks - it's called "hot lava." (The "B-52's sang all about it
I've used lots of oil over the years. The color has varied from pale straw to root beer, and there was no correlation with time. "German Castrol" is green. I've seen differences in identically labelled bottles from different production dates.
I'm wondering if they might consider adding a dye just to make the product more consistent. Food coloring is added to some pet foods to make it look consistent to humans, even though the pets are colorblind. People tend to freak out from variations to something they're used to.
One reason the older oils were darker is they used Group I base oils - MUCH less refined than Group IIs. As to the allegedly complex issue of moisture in sealed motor oils reacting with the additives, then, why, oh why, do the MSDS sheets, the "bible" of the finished product characteristics put out by the blender, ALL categorically state that the finished products are stable indefinitely at normal temperatures? (and, the amount of moisture in factory-sealed bottles pales in comparison to the amount of moisture that's introduced in use . . .) Who the sam-hill is Kathryn Carnes and what are her qualifications?
Finally, go cautious about snugging down the bottle cap excessively - yours truly cleverly managed to crack a cap once doing that. Needless to say, the crack did NOTHING to enhance the original seal . . .
Even with Group I oils, there was wide variety of color in the finished product. The biggest problem with moisture is probably once a bottle is opened; I'd think there might be a problem with large half-empty drums stored for a long, long time. As for cracking a bottle cap, I've got lots of empty bottles (ready to store used oil) with extra bottle caps. I'm just sure not to break them.quote:
Originally posted by Ray H:
One reason the older oils were darker is they used Group I base oils - MUCH less refined than Group IIs. As to the allegedly complex issue of moisture in sealed motor oils reacting with the additives, then, why, oh why, do the MSDS sheets, the "bible" of the finished product characteristics put out by the blender, ALL categorically state that the finished products are stable indefinitely at normal temperatures? (and, the amount of moisture in factory-sealed bottles pales in comparison to the amount of moisture that's introduced in use . . .) Who the sam-hill is Kathryn Carnes and what are her qualifications?Finally, go cautious about snugging down the bottle cap excessively - yours truly cleverly managed to crack a cap once doing that. Needless to say, the crack did NOTHING to enhance the original seal . . .
Some of you might recall a thread I started not long ago about oil color. In it, I stated that upon cracking open a bottle of "Accel" 30 weight, non-detergent API SA, (notice the "SA" rating), that it was clear like water. I have also used "Unilube" API SA and it has a really lite orange blossom honey color, (poo bear would approve). I'm not trying to be a smart a** or know it all, but I would be very inclined to believe that an off brand SA rated oil at .59 cents a quart is a very low quality oil to begin with. I'm not doubting what ya'll are saying about oil color of some years back, all I can tell you is what I've seen in my oil usage. Just my humble opinion.
The older oils were darker than the new light honey colored oils. My guess is more additives/lower quality base stock vs new oil with less additives but better base stock.
Dave
Dave
"Who the sam-hill is Kathryn Carnes and what are her qualifications?"
For those who might be interested, she is the Features Editor of Tribology and Lubrication Technology. This magazine is one that is highly respected for the technical content of its articles. I am sure that MolaKule would agree. The article that she wrote was "Is this Oil too Old?" which was rather comprehensive as she not only interviewed numerous oil company individuals (e.g., ExxonMobil, DA Stuart, Shell, ChevronTexaco, Cargill, Castrol, etc.) to obtain their postion on shelf life, but also did considerable research. If you are really interested in learning more about shelf life, it is a good article worth reading. She has worked as a writer/editor for Lubricants World for several years before becoming involved with STLE's Tribology and Lubrication Technology. So although she is not a formulations chemist or a tribologist as such, she does know her way around.
For those who might be interested, she is the Features Editor of Tribology and Lubrication Technology. This magazine is one that is highly respected for the technical content of its articles. I am sure that MolaKule would agree. The article that she wrote was "Is this Oil too Old?" which was rather comprehensive as she not only interviewed numerous oil company individuals (e.g., ExxonMobil, DA Stuart, Shell, ChevronTexaco, Cargill, Castrol, etc.) to obtain their postion on shelf life, but also did considerable research. If you are really interested in learning more about shelf life, it is a good article worth reading. She has worked as a writer/editor for Lubricants World for several years before becoming involved with STLE's Tribology and Lubrication Technology. So although she is not a formulations chemist or a tribologist as such, she does know her way around.
Thanks for the update. Guess I'll just hafta toss my entire stash of printed-out MSDS sheets. Danged oil company graduate tribology techies - don't know crap from shinola . . .
I'm with Ray H on this one. I've used oil that was in my stash for nearly 10 years with no problems. Right now I have Mobil 1 5w30 SJ Advanced Formula version vintage 97' in my 01' Accord. In my 02' Buick I have vintage 96' QS 5/30
spiked with 1 qt. of QS Synquest 5/50 synthetic.
Both are running perfectly. Since I have never exceeded a 4500 mi. OCI (used to be 3k OCI but since finding this site and realizing that my driving is about 80 % highway I've extended it to about 4K/4 months.) I don't foresee a problem.
I'm thinking of taking the M 1 in the Honda to 6 months or 6K and then using that combo/interval
from now on. Also, I've stopped accumulating oil
as I now realize that improvements in technology
can make newer oils better.
PS. I bought about 80 qts. of various synthetics
for $ 2 appiece in 96' or 97' when a chain called AutoPalace went bellyup
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