Safe to Use Toyota Red or Pink in 1991 Ford F150?

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530
Location
Sonoma County, CA
Thank you for taking the time to view my post. I just acquired a 1991 Ford F150 with the 351 5.8 V8 motor. I have a stash of Toyota Pink LL and Red coolant and would love to be able to flush the system and utilize the Toyota coolant instead of purchasing alternative fluids. Any suggestions or thoughts on any compatibility issues would be greatly appreciated.
 
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1,509
Location
gulf coast FL.U.S.
I'd use it.Having two (92,94) F-150's and an 80' F-250 i'll tell you these cooling systems are not special in any way. If it meets any spec higher than swamp water,you're good.
 
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10,921
Location
Cincinnati, OH, USA
You could use G-05 instead-I have in 2 older vehicles in my sig (the '93 GMC & the '82 300D) that both originally came with green conventional, & no issues. Shame you're not close by, I would trade you 2 G-05s for 1 for the Toyota pink, I need some for the xB (it's 10 years old in February).
 

e55amgbenz007

Thread starter
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530
Location
Sonoma County, CA
Thank you guys for the responses. I do not know if my heater core is copper or brass. What I do know however, is that I get absolutely no warm air from my heater and it is really irritating. I would like to drain the system a few times to see if I can get some hot air. I would love to be able to utilize this stash of Toyota coolant as I have several dozen jugs. Tell you guys what......If anyone needs a gallon of Toyota Pink LL, I will ship one out to you free of charge. I just ask that you pay for shipping. If it is monetarily feasible, this may help a few folks out.
 
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2,633
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in the shop
Make sure you back flush the heater core really good. Also, did you check to see if your thermostat is stuck? My old 79' F150 did that and I had no heat either.
 
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12,925
Location
Northern Kentucky
If there is no heat and it's not the blend door you need at minimum a flush/back flush to remove debri from the core. Possibly a new heater core and a flush. If you already have all that coolant on hand go for it though.
 
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5,355
Location
Paramount, California
Toyota Red is for Toyotas with copper/brass/solder heater cores (1995 and earlier Toyotas). Toyota Pink is for Toyotas with all-aluminum heater cores (OK to use in 1996 and newer Toyotas). The type of organic acids found in Toyota Pink, DEX-COOL, and other types of super-long-life coolants cause leaks in copper/brass/solder heater cores. (Also note that Toyota Pink is different than DEX-COOL.) Therefore, it's safe to use the Toyota Red in your 1991 Ford but not the Toyota Pink.
 
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2,414
Location
Seattle-ish, WA
Keep the toyota coolants for your 4runner. It needs either red or pink (it can use either, just the drain interval is spec'd differently based on different, but NOT incompatible chemistry). Buy the much cheaper green coolant (Fords 2002/earlier = green) for your F150. I don't know if the chemistry of the red is compatible w/your coolant system, but why risk it with the much pricier Asian coolants? It is a waste of money and unnecessary risk. Toyota red concentrate is $28/gallon at Carquest or non-rapacious dealership ($38 at the dealership near me - thus I buy it at Carquest); Green concentrate is $8/gallon on sale at O'Reillys. Mix either with $1/gallon distilled H20 from your local supermarket. Sounds like a bad heater valve. If the engine runs in the right temp range (comes up to temp quickly, doesn't overheat), then it's likely the heater valve stuck closed. This happens over time, with wrong coolant, not changing it, etc. Check that first if nothing else is wrong.
 
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5,355
Location
Paramount, California
There is no such thing as "green coolant" as a well-defined chemical. They widely differ in composition. Their protection on your system could be a hit or a miss. Toyota Red cannot last for the long maintenance interval of newer Toyotas, which specify Toyota Pink. Toyota Red is compatible with any coolant system that doesn't call for a specific coolant. It will also outlast so-called green coolants. However, always flush the system before you switch from one coolant to another.
 
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2,414
Location
Seattle-ish, WA
Originally Posted By: Gokhan
There is no such thing as "green coolant" as a well-defined chemical. They widely differ in composition. Their protection on your system could be a hit or a miss. Toyota Red cannot last for the long maintenance interval of newer Toyotas, which specify Toyota Pink. Toyota Red is compatible with any coolant system that doesn't call for a specific coolant. It will also outlast so-called green coolants. However, always flush the system before you switch from one coolant to another.
There's a lot wrong in this post. Traditional "green" coolant is indeed a known quantity, not a hypothetical dream-mix. Red and Pink are interchangeable; Pink has a listed, longer service life. Which is highly debated since it's made to meet political and marketing goals, not to prolong engine life. It is designed to last 100k miles and no more, and thus reduce TCO figures; it is not designed to maximize system life. Red changed more frequently is widely considered a better care system to maximize system life. Red will probably work just fine in a prior green Ford vehicle, but it's a) triple the cost, and b) requires a double/triple system flush to get the old fully out of the heater core so no bad reactions happen. Way to ridiculous a cost/benefit/labor equation to bother with.
 

e55amgbenz007

Thread starter
Messages
530
Location
Sonoma County, CA
Thank you all for your input. I did purchase NAPA's Yellow All Vehicle Concentrate and have done several drains. There was green in the system prior, and it looks fairly fresh (but with particles floating around). I am still not getting any heat though. Both hoses going to the heater core are warm. I will look at the Chilton's guide for the position/placement of the heater valve when the manual arrives on Tuesday. I am hoping that this is a relatively easy/cheap fix.
 
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5,355
Location
Paramount, California
Originally Posted By: Oro_O
Originally Posted By: Gokhan
There is no such thing as "green coolant" as a well-defined chemical. They widely differ in composition. Their protection on your system could be a hit or a miss. Toyota Red cannot last for the long maintenance interval of newer Toyotas, which specify Toyota Pink. Toyota Red is compatible with any coolant system that doesn't call for a specific coolant. It will also outlast so-called green coolants. However, always flush the system before you switch from one coolant to another.
There's a lot wrong in this post. Traditional "green" coolant is indeed a known quantity, not a hypothetical dream-mix. Red and Pink are interchangeable; Pink has a listed, longer service life. Which is highly debated since it's made to meet political and marketing goals, not to prolong engine life. It is designed to last 100k miles and no more, and thus reduce TCO figures; it is not designed to maximize system life. Red changed more frequently is widely considered a better care system to maximize system life. Red will probably work just fine in a prior green Ford vehicle, but it's a) triple the cost, and b) requires a double/triple system flush to get the old fully out of the heater core so no bad reactions happen. Way to ridiculous a cost/benefit/labor equation to bother with.
I don't want to sound harsh, but, unfortunately, your claims are entirely false. This forum is meant to be educational. If you aren't sure about something and you haven't done a thorough research, you should not contradict people with knowledge on the subject and who have done their research. Otherwise, the thread becomes full with needless false information. Green coolants differ in corrosion-inhibitor package. The only thing they have in common is that they don't have organic acids in the corrosion-inhibitor package. The inorganic corrosion inhibitors still vary widely. Different OEMs specify different inorganic corrosion inhibitors. For example Toyota requires silicates while some other OEMs forbid silicates. Toyota Pink has a completely different organic acid than in Toyota Red, sebacic acid vs. sodium benzoate, respectively. The organic acid in Toyota Pink will damage brass/copper/solder heater cores in 1995 and earlier Toyotas. A leaking heating core is a nightmare, as your entire dash as well as the A/C system needs to be disassembled to replace it. Do not use Toyota Pink with sebacic acid, DEX-COOL with 2-EHA, and similar super-long-life coolants in cars with brass/copper/solder heater cores. Toyota Red should be used in 1995 and earlier Toyotas. Regarding flushing, you should flush the system when you switch from any variety/brand of coolant to another variety/brand of coolant. Corrosion-inhibitor-package chemistry widely differs even among green coolants as I explained. To claim that Toyota, which is the No. 1 in vehicle durability/reliability, doesn't care about the durability of their engines... Well, I won't even get into that.
 
Messages
5,355
Location
Paramount, California
Originally Posted By: Gokhan
Green coolants differ in corrosion-inhibitor package. The only thing they have in common is that they don't have organic acids in the corrosion-inhibitor package. The inorganic corrosion inhibitors still vary widely. Different OEMs specify different inorganic corrosion inhibitors. For example Toyota requires silicates while some other OEMs forbid silicates. Toyota Pink has a completely different organic acid than in Toyota Red, sebacic acid vs. sodium benzoate, respectively. The organic acid in Toyota Pink will damage brass/copper/solder heater cores in 1995 and earlier Toyotas. A leaking heating core is a nightmare, as your entire dash as well as the A/C system needs to be disassembled to replace it. Do not use Toyota Pink with sebacic acid, DEX-COOL with 2-EHA, and similar super-long-life coolants in cars with brass/copper/solder heater cores. Toyota Red should be used in 1995 and earlier Toyotas. Regarding flushing, you should flush the system when you switch from any variety/brand of coolant to another variety/brand of coolant. Corrosion-inhibitor-package chemistry widely differs even among green coolants as I explained. To claim that Toyota, which is the No. 1 in vehicle durability/reliability, doesn't care about the durability of their engines... Well, I won't even get into that.
Correction: I meant Toyota requires phosphates while some other OEMs (mainly European) forbid phosphates. Toyota forbids silicates. Toyota apparently likes phosphates for water-pump lubrication and extra corrosion inhibition. Typical North American green coolant consists of some silicates and a chosen combination of phosphates, borates, nitrites, etc. Exact formulation varies from brand-to-brand. Factory-filled Japanese-OEM green coolants contained no silicates. Toyota doesn't like silicates because of water-pump-seal abrasion and gelling but some criticized the lack of it for not providing enough protection for water-pump cavitation. It should be OK in any car that doesn't specify a particular coolant though, such as an old Ford, and most importantly, it's safe on copper/brass/solder heater cores. Regarding price, you can get Toyota Pink (50/50) for $15 - 20 a gallon and Toyota Red (concentrate) for $20 - 25 in good dealers, not a lot more expensive than typical aftermarket antifreeze that is selling for $15 or more these days.
 
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12,925
Location
Northern Kentucky
Originally Posted By: e55amgbenz007
Thank you all for your input. I did purchase NAPA's Yellow All Vehicle Concentrate and have done several drains. There was green in the system prior, and it looks fairly fresh (but with particles floating around). I am still not getting any heat though. Both hoses going to the heater core are warm. I will look at the Chilton's guide for the position/placement of the heater valve when the manual arrives on Tuesday. I am hoping that this is a relatively easy/cheap fix.
You got a dex clone. If you were out buying something new I would have recommended Motorcraft gold/Zerex G05
 
Messages
5,355
Location
Paramount, California
Originally Posted By: e55amgbenz007
The "Dex clone" would be a safe coolant to run then?
2-EHA in DEX-COOL damages copper/brass/solder heater cores and causes leaks, which are very difficult to repair. Same goes with the sebacic acid in Toyota Pink. Green coolants, which don't contain organic acids, as well Toyota Red, which contains sodium benzoate, are both safe on copper/brass/solder heater cores. Toyota made the transition from Toyota Red coolant to Toyota Pink coolant a few years after they used copper/brass/solder heater cores for the last time for 1995-model-year vehicles. For the old Ford, either Toyota Red or a green coolant is fine. For 1995 and older Toyotas, use Toyota Red but don't use a green coolant, as Toyota forbids silicates found in North American green coolants. Don't use DEX-COOL or Toyota Pink in any vehicle with a copper/brass/solder heater core.
 
Messages
5,355
Location
Paramount, California
Originally Posted By: e55amgbenz007
Gokhan, your insight is invaluable and much appreciated. I will be draining all of the NAPA fluid tomorrow and replacing with a fluid with your recommendations in mind.
Yep, replacing the heater core is a nightmare. 2-EHA eats the soldered joints. I learned the lesson the hard way in my Corolla after using DEX-COOL for several years. Make sure you flush the system after you drain the old coolant and before you put the new coolant. Here is an article that talks about copper/brass/solder heater cores and organic acids used in corrosion-inhibitor packages: http://www.motor.com/article.asp?article_ID=816
 
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