Royal Purple

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Originally Posted By: tinmanSC
The test they show is actually kinda silly. The lubricity tester is an odd machine. a measure of bearing wear is kinda odd, considering most engine oils don't have much extreme pressure additive (for good reason). The amount of bearing wear that any given oil has in this test is only a small part of an oils job. RP has used this test for years in their marketing, but any oil high in zinc (ZDDP) will give you similar results. If you add dandruff shampoo to your oil, which is high in zinc, you will get a similarly impressive result, including enhanced film strength. Please note adding shampoo to your oil is not recommended.
lol.gif



While the tests that all these company's show in the videos are not very "accurate", mobil1's assertion that a engine is not a high pressure environment that mimics the conditions of any of these load tests is absolutely hilarious to say the least, and just goes to show you what happens when you have the marketing dept answering questions that would be better answered by engineers.

Everyone who has any experience building motors, particular for racing purposes knows that all engines are "high pressure" environments. From cam lobes smashing into rockers and bearings that are constantly loaded with the up and down movement of an engine spinning and ridiculously high rpm's. The oils ability to prevent scarring on the bearing, while being loaded with weight is a HUGE factor in engine oils, and royal purples results in actual engines, not just marketing videos have shown that they do make some of the best oils around.

Im not refuting that brands like amsoil, and redline arent as good as royal purple, those bar far are my top 3 favorite oils on the market today. However the whole reason i choose royal purple is because of proven results, and because i am a particular fan of their "synerlec" dry film lubricant technology incorporated in their products. Ive seen how well it works first hand, and i swear by it now.

Mobil 1 however has by far got to be the worst offender when it comes to false advertising, and alot of times ive seen their oil be hit or miss when it comes to actually protecting engine parts. Ive seen guys that have run it for years and it works great when it doesnt see much abuse, and ive seen guys down right rape that oil to death where as other oils like amsoil held up by leaps and bounds ahead of mobil1.
 
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT


im curious, what exactly was this supposed to prove? that amsoil when hot is comparative to head and shoulders? they never repeated the test hot with the mobil 1 and never even bothered to show royal purple at all, or any of the other oils.
 
I'm glad Amsoil did this video, but I find it ironic from a company that still uses the 4-ball wear test. LOL
 
Originally Posted By: Spawne32
Originally Posted By: tinmanSC
The test they show is actually kinda silly. The lubricity tester is an odd machine. a measure of bearing wear is kinda odd, considering most engine oils don't have much extreme pressure additive (for good reason). The amount of bearing wear that any given oil has in this test is only a small part of an oils job. RP has used this test for years in their marketing, but any oil high in zinc (ZDDP) will give you similar results. If you add dandruff shampoo to your oil, which is high in zinc, you will get a similarly impressive result, including enhanced film strength. Please note adding shampoo to your oil is not recommended.
lol.gif



While the tests that all these company's show in the videos are not very "accurate", mobil1's assertion that a engine is not a high pressure environment that mimics the conditions of any of these load tests is absolutely hilarious to say the least, and just goes to show you what happens when you have the marketing dept answering questions that would be better answered by engineers.

Everyone who has any experience building motors, particular for racing purposes knows that all engines are "high pressure" environments. From cam lobes smashing into rockers and bearings that are constantly loaded with the up and down movement of an engine spinning and ridiculously high rpm's. The oils ability to prevent scarring on the bearing, while being loaded with weight is a HUGE factor in engine oils, and royal purples results in actual engines, not just marketing videos have shown that they do make some of the best oils around.

Im not refuting that brands like amsoil, and redline arent as good as royal purple, those bar far are my top 3 favorite oils on the market today. However the whole reason i choose royal purple is because of proven results, and because i am a particular fan of their "synerlec" dry film lubricant technology incorporated in their products. Ive seen how well it works first hand, and i swear by it now.

Mobil 1 however has by far got to be the worst offender when it comes to false advertising, and alot of times ive seen their oil be hit or miss when it comes to actually protecting engine parts. Ive seen guys that have run it for years and it works great when it doesnt see much abuse, and ive seen guys down right rape that oil to death where as other oils like amsoil held up by leaps and bounds ahead of mobil1.


How many teams in the 24hrs of LeMans run Royal Purple again? Formula 1?

Obviously Mercedes and Porsche need to pay you a visit to learn a thing or too. They use Mobil 1 in their race cars! FOR SHAME!
 
mobil 1 is a sponsor of the formula 1 cars, you really think they are using off the shelf grade oil in a 19,000rpm formula 1 race motor that holds those rpm's for extended periods of time? I dont think so lol probably the most absurd thing ive ever heard.
 
Originally Posted By: Spawne32
mobil 1 is a sponsor of the formula 1 cars, you really think they are using off the shelf grade oil in a 19,000rpm formula 1 race motor that holds those rpm's for extended periods of time? I dont think so lol probably the most absurd thing ive ever heard.


x1000
 
Originally Posted By: Spawne32
mobil 1 is a sponsor of the formula 1 cars, you really think they are using off the shelf grade oil in a 19,000rpm formula 1 race motor that holds those rpm's for extended periods of time? I dont think so lol probably the most absurd thing ive ever heard.


Where did I say they were using an off the shelf grade in Formula one? Perhaps that's the most absurd thing you assumed?

Their 0w40 is a popular oil in the 24hrs of LeMans however. The same oil you can buy at Walmart.
 
Originally Posted By: DragRace
Originally Posted By: Spawne32
mobil 1 is a sponsor of the formula 1 cars, you really think they are using off the shelf grade oil in a 19,000rpm formula 1 race motor that holds those rpm's for extended periods of time? I dont think so lol probably the most absurd thing ive ever heard.


x1000


x1000 to what? That the mobil oil used in Formula 1 isn't an OTS oil? Nobody implied otherwise. However, that doesn't change that fact that I've never heard of anybody running Royal Purple in a Formula 1 car.

The more pedestrian Mobil grades are used in other racing venues however, most notably their 0w40.
 
RP doesn't really impress me because it doesn't carry any manufactures seals.

Besides none of the cars that actually need a stout oil actually use it, they all ship from the factory with Mobil 1 or in Ferrari's case Castrol.

I don't think RP has the R&D budget to play with the big boys. It will probably do fine in a 4 cylinder Honda motor, or a minivan, but I wouldn't want to trust it in a Porsche GT2, or a 599 Ferrari.
 
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Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
RP doesn't really impress me because it doesn't carry any manufactures seals.

Besides none of the cars that actually need a stout oil actually use it, they all ship from the factory with Mobil 1 or in Ferrari's case Castrol.

I don't think RP has the R&D budget to play with the big boys. It will probably do fine in a 4 cylinder Honda motor, or a minivan, but I wouldn't want to trust it in a Porsche GT2, or a 599 Ferrari.


I am not saying that Mobil and Castrol aren't good oils or anything but don't take the fact they come as FF in a performance vehicle to mean they are superior to everything else. Marketing deals take place that help companies become FF even for hi-perf applications.

Also, RP's started out with racing in mind. You clearly know little about the oil or company if you think it is only suited to 4cyl Hondas and that it has no race/hi-perf lineage. How many cars does Amsoil or Redline come FF in? The answer is none but does that make their oils inferior as well? Come on man. NO car mfg is going to choose a boutique oil company for their FF oils. The small company could not supply enough nor compete with the price the large oil company can offer the car mfg. That does not mean the small company's oil is inferior.

The factory approvals/licenses/etc... stuff has been beat to death. It means little in the way of actual oil quality.

Have you ever used RP in any application? I am just curious.
 
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Originally Posted By: NHHEMI


The factory approvals/licenses/etc... stuff has been beat to death. It means little in the way of actual oil quality.

Have you ever used RP in any application? I am just curious.


I don't agree with that. Doug has written many a dissertation on the relevance and value of manufacturer approvals, most notably those from CAT and Cummins in regards to diesel oils.

Honda appeared to think that high temp deposit control was enough of an issue that they developed HTO-06 for example.

Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
Porsche's lubricant Approval process for instance includes special Test sequences for viscosity and anti foaming
The anti foaming testing is very important with most Porsche engines due to their dry-sump lubrication system(s)


Seems relevant....

http://www.eng.rpi-inc.ru/materials/26/neo364/DAY2/SESSION5/TNasch.pdf
 
Originally Posted By: Brenden
The only reason I never jumped on it is because idk if I could get enough miles out of the OCI to make it worth spending 5 dollars more than m1 EP..


Now that Royal Purple has reformulated their standard off the shelf formulation to comply with API SN, you are better off buying Mobil EP and saving your money. Royal Purple HPS is a different situation all together with Synerlec and 1200 ppm ZDDP.

Originally Posted By: Artem
I'm willing to give RP a try, esp the new HPS (high performance street) line that is coming out. I suspect that a few UOA might show that it performs good but its the long term wear / corrosion that concerns me.


This is a more robust formulation than the old version of standard Royal Purple.

Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
As for the price,RP`s actually the cheapest synthetic on the market. At $8.99,it`s a couple of bucks cheaper than Amsoil and Redline.


Cheaper than Red Line, yes. It's not cheaper than Amsoil if you are a preferred customer. Then you can buy Amsoil at dealer cost.

Originally Posted By: Spawne32
Ive seen guys that have run it for years and it works great when it doesnt see much abuse, and ive seen guys down right rape that oil to death where as other oils like amsoil held up by leaps and bounds ahead of mobil1.


True story!

Originally Posted By: buster
I'm glad Amsoil did this video, but I find it ironic from a company that still uses the 4-ball wear test. LOL


The 4 ball wear test is repeatable with consistent results. The one arm bandit can be manipulated to give the desired results you want the crowd to see for whatever product is currently being tested.

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
How many teams in the 24hrs of LeMans run Royal Purple again? Formula 1?

Obviously Mercedes and Porsche need to pay you a visit to learn a thing or too. They use Mobil 1 in their race cars! FOR SHAME!


Brown bagging a sponsor is common in racing. The sponsor logos on the car say one thing, the oil in your sump is completely different. It's common in open wheels and NASCAR. This is not new news.

Now, about the factory fill discussion. It's all about product recognition, brand association, and quality to cost ratio.

Exxon Mobil with Mobil 1 can achieve all three areas concerning the OEMs requirements to use a factory fill lubricant.

Since all blenders source their base stocks and additives from other manufacturers, they couldn't possibly give the best quality to cost ratio. Blenders like Amsoil, Red Line, and Royal Purple formulate to higher standards using more expensive base stocks than the base stocks used in highly refined petroleum blends like Mobil 1 5W-30 (non-EP....common use for GM). Another reason why Mobil 1 meets the quality to cost ratio.

Amsoil, Red Line, and Royal Purple are rarely used by non DIY oil change customers. Mobil 1 is a big name in car maintenance aftermarket sales. Say the words "Engine Oil" to 100 people who are NOT car buffs, and I bet 90 would think "Mobil 1" before anything else. Therefore, Mobil 1 has brand recognition to increase GM's marketing (and all other OEMs who use M1 as a factory fill).

Say the word "Amsoil" or "Red Line" to a non car buff, and most of them will say...."What's that?"
 
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI


The factory approvals/licenses/etc... stuff has been beat to death. It means little in the way of actual oil quality.

Have you ever used RP in any application? I am just curious.


I don't agree with that. Doug has written many a dissertation on the relevance and value of manufacturer approvals, most notably those from CAT and Cummins in regards to diesel oils.

Honda appeared to think that high temp deposit control was enough of an issue that they developed HTO-06 for example.

Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
Porsche's lubricant Approval process for instance includes special Test sequences for viscosity and anti foaming
The anti foaming testing is very important with most Porsche engines due to their dry-sump lubrication system(s)


Seems relevant....

http://www.eng.rpi-inc.ru/materials/26/neo364/DAY2/SESSION5/TNasch.pdf


Let me clarify my point. I am not talking about the spec's themselevs being irrelevant. I have said from day one around here to always use an oil that meets/exceeds the OE oil spec for your application.

What I am talking about is the relevance of actually being licensed/approved vs not. If the oil meets/exceeds the spec that is all that matters when you are talking oil quality the way so many are in this thread. Having a license or factory approval does NOT make the oil superior to an oil that doesn't carry the same paperwork but actually meets/exceeds the spec.

The fact is that non licensed/approved oil might actually be superior to the licensed one. A license or factory approval only means the oil meets the minimum oil spec and nothing else.

Let me try it this way using a very common oil spec just as an example( not an indicator of a super quality oil )...

GM6094M

You have Oil Company A who pays GM to be tested and certified/licensed as meeting the standard in their 5W-30 oil. Company A's 5W-30 just barely meets the spec but it does so it is now a licensed product.

Now we also have Oil Company B who sells a 5W-30. They however decide not to pay GM the hundreds of thousands it cost to get licensed. Their oil however actually far and away exceeds the GM6094M oil standard.

So, which oil is the better oil to use if you need an oil meeting GM6094M? Oil A that is licensed but barely meets the spec or oil B that is not licensed but blows the spec out of the waTer?

This is my point. A piece of paper saying your oil meets such and such a spec does not mean an oil without it is inferior or does not meet the spec.
 
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But that is why I cited Honda's test as an example. When that test came out, there was only one oil on the market that met it (M1 5w30). That list contained only two oils for a very long time: Mobil 1 5w30 and Pennzoil Platinum 5w30.

In this case, getting the approval appears to be difficult. So, are we then to just take the word of the blender that their oil is "recommended for" an HTO-06 spec application because they say so, without the actual Honda approval on the bottle?
 
Originally Posted By: Unleashedbeast


Brown bagging a sponsor is common in racing. The sponsor logos on the car say one thing, the oil in your sump is completely different. It's common in open wheels and NASCAR. This is not new news.


While I agree that this is common, we have numerous accounts on this forum of people observing what was being put in the race cars at various events. Johnny (from Pennzoil) saw, and asked about the use of Mobil 1 0w40 at the 24hrs of Daytona. Doug Hillary, who has numerous connections with Euro manufacturers remarked about the extensive use of that same oil in many racing venues including LeMans.

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Now, about the factory fill discussion. It's all about product recognition, brand association, and quality to cost ratio.


Well of course it is! It is also about the oil manufacturer working closely with the vehicle manufacturer, and this is where many of the application-specific specs and approvals come from, such as BMW's LL-01 spec.

Quote:

Exxon Mobil with Mobil 1 can achieve all three areas concerning the OEMs requirements to use a factory fill lubricant.


Yes, because they are able to work closely with manufacturers, have the budget to develop a lubricant for the application in a timely manner, and are able to provide an end-to-end product development because they can do everything in-house.

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Since all blenders source their base stocks and additives from other manufacturers, they couldn't possibly give the best quality to cost ratio. Blenders like Amsoil, Red Line, and Royal Purple formulate to higher standards using more expensive base stocks than the base stocks used in highly refined petroleum blends like Mobil 1 5W-30 (non-EP....common use for GM). Another reason why Mobil 1 meets the quality to cost ratio.


Those base stocks are of course sourced from companies like Exxon Mobil. The same can be said for additives. How do we know that the oil is formulated to a "higher standard". Because you say so? Because THEY say so? What oil is formulated to a higher standard than M1 0w40? What single oil has a broader range of OEM use, racing use, and approvals for difficult to obtain Euro specs?

Quote:
Amsoil, Red Line, and Royal Purple are rarely used by non DIY oil change customers. Mobil 1 is a big name in car maintenance aftermarket sales. Say the words "Engine Oil" to 100 people who are NOT car buffs, and I bet 90 would think "Mobil 1" before anything else. Therefore, Mobil 1 has brand recognition to increase GM's marketing (and all other OEMs who use M1 as a factory fill).

Say the word "Amsoil" or "Red Line" to a non car buff, and most of them will say...."What's that?"


This is true. It doesn't speak in any way to the quality of the products in question however.
 
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