RI DMV Trying to ban Kei Trucks, again?

[Egg_Head]

You have to wonder what is "driving" this and it is NOT safety. Automotive Dealers Association?

https://www.thedrive.com/news/rhode..._Dynamic&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email

 

[97prizm]

It has to be someone in the law making community that really dislikes vehicles. I think Vermont had something Similar happen as a number of people had their Subaru Sambar, and Mitsubishi Delica registrations pulled due to "Safety ".

 

[skyactiv]

Maybe the golf cart and utility vehicle lobby is behind it. The goal is to set a precedence and hope other states follow.
The on road saftey thing is an excuse. John Deere ... doesn't want to lose sales of their Gator utility vehicle?

 

[Astro14]

Honest question: why is it “not” safety?

Those things are tiny little death traps that do not meet federal crash protection standards, it says so in the article. Being over 25 years old, they fall into an “antique” exception to that failure to meet FMVSS, but they still don’t meet the standard.

 

[PWMDMD]

I don't see how these can be treated any differently than any other +25-year-old vehicle that doesn't meet FMVSS standards. FWIW...I do not recall ever seeing one of these on the road - ever in my life. How many of these exist in RI?

 

[Astro14]

I don't see how these can be treated any differently than any other +25-year-old vehicle that doesn't meet FMVSS standards. FWIW...I do not recall ever seeing one of these on the road - ever in my life. How many of these exist in RI?

I think there’s a big difference between say a 1975 Chevy Impala convertible, that met all the FMVSS standards at the time, but does not meet modern standards, and this little truck which was manufactured much more recently, and never met any standards.

It really is no different than a golf cart. Some municipalities, and states, allow the license of a golf cart for use on a public road. Some do not. I have seen those little trucks on the road around here, and there is simply no crash protection. Heavy traffic in Virginia Beach, which has pretty busy traffic, and some somewhat aggressive drivers, I think the things are dangerous.

The question is: are they more dangerous than my neighbor’s 1972 triumph TR6 convertible?

My neighbor doesn’t drive the Triumph in rush-hour traffic. Which is how I see folks driving these things. If it is an antique car, then it should be driven like an antique - in the licensing of an antique car, at least in my state, there are restrictions on how the car can be used. It cannot be used for work, it cannot be driven daily, and it cannot exceed 4000 miles per year.

So, if it’s an antique car, then it’s an antique car. Not a daily driver. Not a rush hour commuting vehicle.

The point that there are model Ts on the road, is a good one, but that would obligate the owners of these little trucks to use them like the owners of the model T use their lightweight, frankly, unsafe, vehicles.

 

[PWMDMD]

I think there’s a big difference between say a 1975 Chevy Impala convertible, that met all the FMVSS standards at the time, but does not meet modern standards, and this little truck which was manufactured much more recently, and never met any standards.

It really is no different than a golf cart. Some municipalities, and states, allow the license of a golf cart for use on a public road. Some do not. I have seen those little trucks on the road around here, and there is simply no crash protection. Heavy traffic in Virginia Beach, which has pretty busy traffic, and some somewhat aggressive drivers, I think the things are dangerous.

The question is: are they more dangerous than my neighbor’s 1972 triumph TR6 convertible?

My neighbor doesn’t drive the Triumph in rush-hour traffic. Which is how I see folks driving these things. If it is an antique car, then it should be driven like an antique in the licensing of an antique car, at least in my state, there are restrictions on how the car can be used. It cannot be used for work, it cannot be driven daily, and it cannot exceed 4000 miles per year.

So, if it’s an antique car, then it’s an antique car. Not a daily driver. Not a rush hour commuting vehicle.

If it's good for the goose then it's...

As I said, I don't see how you can treat two vehicles that both do not meet FMVSS differently. If there are restrictions on how antique vehicles are used because of safety concerns, then there should also be restrictions placed on these vehicles due to safety concerns. I'm not saying they have to be the same restrictions, for instance, perhaps these little trucks should only be used on certain local roads with limited speed limits or in areas designated as rural areas. These restrictions may make their everyday use impractical but at least the law would seem to be applied more consistently.

 

[Opelman]

I drive 50 plus year old Opel daily when the roads here aren't salted. When I lived in Southern CA, it was year round, traffic or not. Are you suggesting that I shouldn't be allowed to drive it because it doesn't meet current standards? Same with my even older pickup. I could happily daily drive as early as the late 1920s. Maybe not a T for highway use but any of the larger cars, no problem. I am looking forward to putting our 1927 Willys- Knight on the road. Unrestored but mechanically sound.

 

[supton]

I'm not saying they have to be the same restrictions, for instance, perhaps these little trucks should only be used on certain local roads with limited speed limits or in areas designated as rural areas.

In NH that seems to be the case. 35mph max roads, something like that--I've looked into this a couple of times, for running trash to the transfer station, but technically... I can't even cross the road. [Chances are, it'd be fine, it's like 20 yards of "illegal" driving.]

I can't vouch for this list but this might give some insight.
https://tfltruck.com/2014/08/heres-the-skinny-on-mini-truck-legalities-in-each-state/
Google links indicate around 19 states allow these trucks? something like that.

Does seem like it's a bit unregulated, each state doing its own thing. Which is fine, but RI is making a decision, then changing its mind, that's apt to cause problems.

 

[fsdork]

If it's good for the goose then it's...

As I said, I don't see how you can treat two vehicles that both do not meet FMVSS differently. If there are restrictions on how antique vehicles are used because of safety concerns, then there should also be restrictions placed on these vehicles due to safety concerns. I'm not saying they have to be the same restrictions, for instance, perhaps these little trucks should only be used on certain local roads with limited speed limits or in areas designated as rural areas. These restrictions may make their everyday use impractical but at least the law would seem to be applied more consistently.

I view it as comparable to grandfathering anything else safety related, such as the NHL's grandfather clause relating to the introduction of mandatory helmet usage. The guys who came up without helmets were allowed to finish off their career that way, but new players had to wear them. Allowing people to keep running their antique, unsafe (speaking relatively about collision protection) vehicles until they have to be retired, while requiring new vehicles to comply with safety standards is similar in concept. Allowing ongoing import of vehicles from other countries with lower safety standards can serve to side-step the mandated advancement of safety standards in North America.

 

[DriveHard]

...and we are going the opposite way here in the middle of Iowa. Our big (for Iowa) town of about 80k people just legalized side by sides on city streets as long as they have proper lighting. We now have these things running all over town. People taking their kids to school in them, running to walmart, going out to eat...

For the record, I have ZERO problem with them, and if I could AutoX it, I would love to own a Slingshot!

 

[wings&wheels]

Yet RI does not have a helmet law for 21+ motorcycle drivers.....so much for the safety aspect of this.

Obvious (if you ever lived in RI ) politics aside, as others have stated kei cars are not safe, at least as compared to modern, heck even most contemporary North American market vehicles. The decision to drive them should be up to the owner/driver.

 

[PWMDMD]

Yet RI does not have a helmet law for 21+ motorcycle drivers.....so much for the safety aspect of this.

Obvious (if you ever lived in RI ) politics aside, as others have stated kei cars are not safe, at least as compared to modern, heck even most contemporary North American market vehicles. The decision to drive them should be up to the owner/driver.

This was my initial thought too but this assumes the driver is aware of the risk and they have the opportunity to exercise their right to say no to driving it. I’m thinking of work situations where an employee uses one of these as a company vehicle and they are not told it’s a death trap.

 

[KrisZ]

It's always for your safety or your own good. We need to be protected from ourselves obviously.

 

[Tdbo]

It's always for your safety or your own good. We need to be protected from ourselves obviously.

It's called control.

 

[dogememe]

I don't see how these can be treated any differently than any other +25-year-old vehicle that doesn't meet FMVSS standards. FWIW...I do not recall ever seeing one of these on the road - ever in my life. How many of these exist in RI?

I don’t know about RI but here in CA these little things have a huge following and I see them regularly!

 

[Rmay635703]

Honest question: why is it “not” safety?

Those things are tiny little death traps that do not meet federal crash protection standards, it says so in the article. Being over 25 years old, they fall into an “antique” exception to that failure to meet FMVSS, but they still don’t meet the standard.

Because I can drive an ATV / Sidebyside on 50% of roads (northern communities 100%) and a motorcycle on 100% of roads.

Also several Kei vehicles have been sold in the US as road legal, The belief that Japan, a NIMBY first world country makes vehicles that are inherently unsafe and polluting is a myth people like to believe from authorities. Heck any vehicle made before 2010 is supposedly a gross safety risk according to .gov.

If the only thing we value in a vehicle is safety everyone needs one of these, no safety equipment but safe in all collisions, even a head on with a semi or a train is very survivable, IEDs are also usually very survivable .

Safety standards which are pretty much written with full lobbying buy in from auto makers only exist for market isolation, that’s why Europe won’t allow a reciprocation agreement as our us standard vehicles keep failing in base form over there, AKA vehicles built to us standards are considered wildly unsafe to pedestrian traffic and we never pass their enhanced requirements.

Why authorities are concerned about something 0.01% of people own brought in legally under the 25 year rule is beyond me.

Is it really a concern that 100% of cars sold will be 25 year old kei vans?

 

[wings&wheels]

Because I can drive an ATV / Sidebyside on 50% of roads (northern communities 100%) and a motorcycle on 100% of roads.

Also several Kei vehicles have been sold in the US as road legal, The belief that Japan, a NIMBY first world country makes vehicles that are inherently unsafe and polluting is a myth people like to believe from authorities. Heck any vehicle made before 2010 is supposedly a gross safety risk according to .gov.

If the only thing we value in a vehicle is safety everyone needs one of these, no safety equipment but safe in all collisions, even a head on with a semi or a train is very survivable, IEDs are also usually very survivable .

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Safety standards which are pretty much written with full lobbying buy in from auto makers only exist for market isolation, that’s why Europe won’t allow a reciprocation agreement as our us standard vehicles keep failing in base form over there, AKA vehicles built to us standards are considered wildly unsafe to pedestrian traffic and we never pass their enhanced requirements.

Why authorities are concerned about something 0.01% of people own brought in legally under the 25 year rule is beyond me.

Is it really a concern that 100% of cars sold will be 25 year old kei vans?

because "...and I wrote legislation banning unsafe vehicles from being registered in our State, keeping our roads safe...vote for me."

 

[CKN]

It's always for your safety or your own good. We need to be protected from ourselves obviously.

The issue is that sometimes you do......some have the rational or IQ of a cucumber.

 

[KrisZ]

The issue is that sometimes you do......some have the rational or IQ of a cucumber.

The issue is that those are a fraction of a percent cases and what started of as "sometimes" is now the norm and modus operandi.