Retract Ceramlub Advice

[doitmyself]

After just 22 months and about 30,000 miles on my Caravan, my Raybestos PG Plus brake pads started "chirping" with only 1/16" of material left. Somewhat premature wear in my opinion.

When I took the caliper pins apart, I was shocked to find the Ceramlub all dried up and caked.

Let me be the first to say that this might be due to poor caliper design. Maybe the boots don't contain the grease well enough. But, based on this experience, I will not recommend this stuff to anyone again. When I opened the container I noticed a fair amount of oil separation. I wonder if others are having trouble with this stuff or is it just that my calipers don't like it?

Anyone else have experiences to share with Ceramlub?

 

[Quest]

Ever consider AGM's Sylglide? My customers have clocked millions of kms+ (incl. all the cars in my family and friends that fall under my maintenance) in it and been very, very good so far, with no drying up nor binding.

I tend to resort to using Permatex ultra ceramic synthetic lube for pad backing (very sticky) to keep the pads from chirping.

(*just serviced my wifey's 04 camry frt caliper with silglyde and very smooth and sliding very nicely*)

Q.

 

[doitmyself]

Yes, I have and use Sylglide. But, I have a "problem" in that I like to try new things out!

Sylglide is an unusual grease. Left exposed to air/light it turns into a bright yellow paste, not like traditional clear'white silicones. I wonder what it is composed of. I don't even see silicone in the msds:

http://www.imperialinc.com/msds0075150.shtml

 

[Kestas]

I checked Ceramlub's MSDS information. All I could find is that it has finely divided ceramic particles in an oil based paste. When you took the caliper apart, the oil-based part of the lube dried off, leaving the ceramic thickener behind.

Ceramlub would have a superior product if they substituted silicone oils for oil oils.

 

[Quest]

Yes, I agree that Sylglide is kinda weird in ways like you've described.

That being said, however, sylglide is, of all the synthetic(or non-syn, brake component lubes that claimed to be compatible to all rubber/plastic components)I"ve tried so far, sylglide seems to hold up to it's task the longest, with the least amount of negative impacts on all braking components.

Also: sylglide seems to be the closest in terms of consistency to those that came along with factory calipers (o.e. Nissin, Sumitomo, etc.) While I do not know exactly what the original OE factory formulations being used. I do believe, however, that sylglide is the most compatible to those used in the said factory calipers.

Q.

 

[Tempest]

I have used Ceramlub on 3 cars with no problems.

It is designed as a high content ceramic solid lube (40% I think). The oil is just a carrier. The liquid part is only to make it easy to apply and spread.

 

[doitmyself]

Kestas describes well what appeared to happen in MY case.

No one probably cares, but I will post this anyway (it's just too much fun)! I found a MSDS for Sil-glyde here: http://www.worldpac.com/msds/pdfs/WP-001.pdf

It's really not a traditional silicone lube like most believe:

Polypropolene glycol < 60%
Castor Oil < 45%
Silicone dioxide < 15%
Polydimethylsiloxane < 5%
Oleoyl Sarcosine < 5%

Old school, yet works so well as Quest ascertains. Less than 5% silicone. Could someone teach me about Polypropolene glycol and castor oil as lubricants?

 

[doitmyself]

And...why are people so bent out of shape saying not to use petroleum lubes on brakes? The slide pins are isolated from the hydraulic system. Regarding rubber compatibility, we pump petroleum grease into tie rods and ball joints all the time (in the old days of zerks).

 

[XS650]

doitmyself, there is "rubber" then there is "rubber"

"rubber" that is formulated to survive contact with brake fluid, might not be the same "rubber".

One of the reason that brake fluid took the development path that it did was back in the olden daze when hydraulic brakes came out, there wasn't any "rubber" that did well in constant contact with petroleum automotive products.

Rubber is in quotes because what is commonly called rubber is a wide variety of very different man made elastomers

 

[doitmyself]

doitmyself, there is "rubber" then there is "rubber"

"rubber" that is formulated to survive contact with brake fluid, might not be the same "rubber".

Ya, I know about the different types of rubber...nitrile, buna, natural, EPDM, etc.

So, maybe the "rubber" on the external caliper piston boot is not the same EPDM rubber on the slide pin bushings. Theoretically, grease/oil could leak out of the caliper slide pins and onto the piston boot, thus swelling it.

I guess I was wondering how grease/oil on the pins (sealed with bushings) could make it's way into the hydraulic portion of the system where the rubber is definitely prone to petroleum damage.

Some people still use anti seize (petroleum) on the exterior sliding metal caliper parts without worrying about it migrating to the piston. Very thin applications, mind you.

Any comments about the Sil-glyde msds??