Proper Synthetic for 2002 GTI 1.8 Turbo

Mindflux · May 18, 2004

I've been trying to paruse this site and soak in some information. However I am having trouble with the multitude of acronyms or abreviations for things. That's fine, really I'm not looking to be an oil expert.

I currently use 0w40 Mobil 1 European Formula (or whatever they call it these days), however I recall reading that this oil is Group III based, not IV or V based. So I was searching for alternatives.

So far, I've come up with:

Redline 5w40
AMSOIL 5w40
Royal Purple 10w40(no 5w??)

So, between those, none of them are terribly easy for me to acquire locally. I can get AMSOIL 10w40 locally, easily. However, since I know nearly nothing about oil I'm unsure if that's kosher or not.

The manual suggests 5w30 or 5w40, but from seeing some tests done here, it seems there's a good amount more lead showing up in the 5w30 than the 5w40 (with this engine). Which I guess is bearing wear?

ANYWAY. To sum things up, I'm looking for a good 'proper' oil to use since the Mobil 1 0w40 seems to sheer down easily.

Now, I know some aren't fans of AMSOIL, some aren't fans of RP or RL.. but please try and keep your preferences aside unless it's for some provable (shown tests) reason one is poor for my needs.

The car IS modded, it has a chip and some other horse-power enhancing modifications, but nothing as extreme as TyrolKids 300WHP 1.8T.

It seems the 5w40 will have to be ordered online, regardless of who makes it.. unless I can pick up some 10w40 without any detrimental effects!

Please advise, sorry to ramble and if I've mixed anything up feel free to correct me.

-Ryan

Jelly · May 18, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Mindflux:
I currently use 0w40 Mobil 1, however I recall reading that this oil is Group III based, not IV or V based. So I was searching for alternatives.

ANYWAY. To sum things up, I'm looking for a good 'proper' oil to use since the Mobil 1 0w40 seems to sheer down easily.

-Ryan

Nope...M1 0w-40 is group IV based and, IMHO, is a great oil, meeting a good deal of hard to achieve approvals, including:

BMW LL-01
Daimler Chrysler 229.3/229.5
Opel Long Life Service Fill GM-LL-A-025
Opel Diesel Service Fill GM-LL-B-025
Porsche Approved
Volkswagen 502.00/505.00,503.01

To achieve these approvals, this oil needs to achieve high levels of fuel economy (comparatively speaking) and resist thicking out of grade during long drain intervals.

In regards to talk of the 0w-40 "shearing-down", I don't believe it's really an issue. It doesn't shear-down like conventional oils do...it's actually designed to (to meet approvals listed above). On low mileage drain intervals like many do here on their UOA's, it'll show the 0w-40 having lost viscosity. Run it on out a little bit though and the viscosity will have thicked on up.

This is the best widely-available COTS lube you can purchase for this vehicle (and at an attractice price), but you do have many more choices through mail-order as you've previously pointed out.

If this were my vehicle though, I'd run M1 0w-40 with a high quality oil and high quality paper air filter.

Just change on VW suggested drain intervals and you'll be set!

[ May 18, 2004, 11:28 PM: Message edited by: Jelly ]

Darryl · May 18, 2004

You're already using one of the best oils there is.

Just stay with the Mobil 1 0w-40 and don't give it a second thought.

Darryl

Audi Junkie · May 18, 2004

Mindflux · May 18, 2004

Well then, that's a bit of a turn of events.

I could have sworn there was quite a bit of hubbub about M1 switching most of their oils to Group III and still calling it Synthetic (like Castrol was doing). If this is not the case, I'll continue to use it. However, I am in Texas, and summer is upon us; is 0w40 going to be thick enough for the Texas heat?

-R

Jelly · May 18, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Mindflux:
Well then, that's a bit of a turn of events.

I could have sworn there was quite a bit of hubbub about M1 switching most of their oils to Group III and still calling it Synthetic (like Castrol was doing). If this is not the case, I'll continue to use it. However, I am in Texas, and summer is upon us; is 0w40 going to be thick enough for the Texas heat?

-R

No, Mobil1 is still group IV.

Where did you hear that though?

Yes, M1 0w-40 is thick enough for the Texas heat, but like I pointed out before, you do have many other options to consider.

[ May 18, 2004, 11:43 PM: Message edited by: Jelly ]

Mindflux · May 18, 2004

I heard it a few years back, there was some really big hubbub about it too.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=313674

This was one of the threads from way back. It looks like the first post has been edited to clarify though. You can paruse through the first few pages to get an idea of what was going on, I'm sure.

Mindflux · May 18, 2004

Oops!

Forgot to mention. Well if 0w40 is fine for Texas winter and summer, why would I even consider another option? Would RL/AMS/RP make THAT much of a difference from the M1? Sure, I'd love to give the appropriate weight/viscocity AMS/RL/RP a try, but if it's not necessary... I don't think I'll do it.

I could probably special order some AMS 5w40 from the Carquest up the road that carries it.

Pablo · May 18, 2004

Or you could order the Amsoil from one of the site sponsors!

Jelly · May 18, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Mindflux:
Oops!

Forgot to mention. Well if 0w40 is fine for Texas winter and summer, why would I even consider another option? Would RL/AMS/RP make THAT much of a difference from the M1? Sure, I'd love to give the appropriate weight/viscocity AMS/RL/RP a try, but if it's not necessary... I don't think I'll do it.

I could probably special order some AMS 5w40 from the Carquest up the road that carries it.

Like Pabs said, if you're gonna use Amsoil, go with one of the site sponsers. They're great guys!

With that said though, I'd go with M1 0w-40. Available locally and at a very good price.

It can definitely handle the Texas "winter" and any punishment you'll throw it's way, while also giving you an engine that will be very well protected and very clean. Sure, some other oils could very well offer a few ppm reduction in wear metals, but the car's gonna rot out from underneath you before the use of 0w-40 became the contributing factor in your vehicles demise.

Just make sure to do an analysis every once in a while to make sure nothing is drastically wrong (coolant leaks, intake leaks, etc, etc...).

Mindflux · May 18, 2004

I'll PM one of the AMS guys here and see what they say.

This place is great, however.. (like every other walk of life) it seems there are some "haters" of each brand.. it's so hard to chose!

Jelly · May 18, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Mindflux:
I'll PM one of the AMS guys here and see what they say.

This place is great, however.. (like every other walk of life) it seems there are some "haters" of each brand.. it's so hard to chose!

Who's "hatin'" what?

Mindflux · May 18, 2004

Well not anyone in this thread specifically. I've just seen a few members (I don't recall who) who seem to frown on AMSOIL, then some that frown on Redline, and yet again others frowning on Royal Purple.

Some of these people commented in tests (OUA? UAO? AUO?) somethin..

Is there an acronym faq in here? LOL

Jelly · May 18, 2004

Sorry...thought you were talking about this thread.

No acronym FAQ, but you're referring to UOA, or used oil analysis.

Quattro Pete · May 18, 2004

If I were to stick with M1, which is one of the best locally-available synthetics, I'd use their 5w-30 instead of the 0w-40, as it has delivered slightly better UOAs in the 1.8T engines, and it doesn't shear as much as the 0w-40. I've ran both in my 1.8T, and the engine seemed more lively with the 5w-30, but that's just my subjective observation.

Other good oils would be GC 0w-30 (SLX), Amsoil/Redline 5w-30 as well.

I'm running M1 0w-40 right now, but will be switching to GC 0w-30 (SLX LongTec) at the next oil change, 5K mile OCI (

here's another acronym for you - Oil Change Interval).

Cheers,

harrydog · May 18, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Mindflux:
alternatives.

Now, I know some aren't fans of AMSOIL, some aren't fans of RP or RL.. but please try and keep your preferences aside unless it's for some provable (shown tests) reason one is poor for my needs.

It seems the 5w40 will have to be ordered online, regardless of who makes it.. unless I can pick up some 10w40 without any detrimental effects!

-Ryan

If you have any Advance Auto Parts stores in your area, you should be able to buy Redline 10w40 off the shelf. I've had very good UOA results with it in my Subaru turbo.

Mindflux · May 18, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Quattro Pete:
If I were to stick with M1, which is one of the best locally-available synthetics, I'd use their 5w-30 instead of the 0w-40, as it has delivered slightly better UOAs in the 1.8T engines, and it doesn't shear as much as the 0w-40. I've ran both in my 1.8T, and the engine seemed more lively with the 5w-30, but that's just my subjective observation.

Other good oils would be GC 0w-30 (SLX), Amsoil/Redline 5w-30 as well.

I'm running M1 0w-40 right now, but will be switching to GC 0w-30 (SLX LongTec) at the next oil change, 5K mile OCI (

here's another acronym for you - Oil Change Interval).

Cheers,

But in the UOA's for a 1.8T that I found here it showed "significant" +13% more lead in a 5w30 blend, than a 5w40 blend, which people believed to be bearing wear. Does that not concern you?

Mindflux · May 18, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by harrydog:

quote:

Originally posted by Mindflux:
alternatives.

Now, I know some aren't fans of AMSOIL, some aren't fans of RP or RL.. but please try and keep your preferences aside unless it's for some provable (shown tests) reason one is poor for my needs.

It seems the 5w40 will have to be ordered online, regardless of who makes it.. unless I can pick up some 10w40 without any detrimental effects!

-Ryan

Click to expand...

If you have any Advance Auto Parts stores in your area, you should be able to buy Redline 10w40 off the shelf. I've had very good UOA results with it in my Subaru turbo.

Thanks! I had called them last night and they said they had 5w30 and 10w30, but no 10w40 or 5w40. I asked if they could order it and they said no.

Quattro Pete · May 18, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Mindflux:
But in the UOA's for a 1.8T that I found here it showed "significant" +13% more lead in a 5w30 blend, than a 5w40 blend, which people believed to be bearing wear. Does that not concern you?

Not sure which particular UOAs you're referring to. If we're talking about something like 4 vs. 5 ppm difference in lead, I'd say that insignificant. Also, I wasn't aware we had any M1 5w-40 1.8T UOAs yet, or was it Delvac (same thing)?

Have a look at this one:
http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=000987

10/27/03 is M1 0w-40
02/25/03 is M1 5w-30

Regards,

Mindflux · May 18, 2004

Err. excuse me. when comparing 5w30 to 0w40 in the UOAs I saw, there was a ~13% increase in iron using 5w30 over 0w40. Which people thought was bearing wear.

Not 5w40.. grief.. I'm lost!

Proper Synthetic for 2002 GTI 1.8 Turbo

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