edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
After some delay's tomorrow putting EBC rotors and Green Stuff pads. We will see. Vibration on these Toyota OE are ridiculous although pads have like 75% life.
Power Stop brakes on 2012 Sienna?
- Thread starter LeakySeals
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Originally Posted by The Critic
Originally Posted by LeakySeals
I'm familiar with lateral run-out but not the vent procedure or the TSB. I don't have a tool to check run out on this AWD. I do have a hub cleaner tool and a torque wrench LOL.
Here you go:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2016/SB-10084304-5448.pdf
Originally Posted by LeakySeals
Also is that rotor bolt hole 8 mm, 8 x 1.25? In case the rotors are stuck
I believe that is correct.
Thanks. Cutting the air dam to prevent front brake vibration. Wonder how they figured that one out.
Originally Posted by LeakySeals
I'm familiar with lateral run-out but not the vent procedure or the TSB. I don't have a tool to check run out on this AWD. I do have a hub cleaner tool and a torque wrench LOL.
Here you go:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2016/SB-10084304-5448.pdf
Originally Posted by LeakySeals
Also is that rotor bolt hole 8 mm, 8 x 1.25? In case the rotors are stuck
I believe that is correct.
Thanks. Cutting the air dam to prevent front brake vibration. Wonder how they figured that one out.
edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
Yesterday finished work on my Sienna.
Bought front set of EBC rotors and EBC Green Stuff pads. I knew pads in front were good, so I was assuming rear are good (bought car in September with 41,000 miles.
Anyway, rotors were vibrating so I decided to replace front components and do brake flush using Schwaben vacuum pump.
Did brake flush on VW Tiguan three weeks ago, and was planning to do on Sienna. However, unlike European cars, Toyota does not have universal brake fluid tank cap, so had to order cap for vacuum pump that can fit most vehicles. It involves chain, and tightening one, but it worked to keep vacuum at some 15psi.
So, took down rear tires and saw that rear pads were completely worn out. Than I remembered that assumption is mother of all mistakes, as I was assuming rears were changed when fronts were. Made a quick trip to Toyota dealership, got OE (Akebono made) for $67. Was shocked how small they are, which kind of explained as why brakes are just mediocre on this car.
Change was a breeze after I figured I need to use old clamps as new were not part of new brake pad set. Did rear wheel brake flush, moved to front.
Did brake flush, than pads and rotors. Used WD40 to help with taking down rotors, used rubber malt, breeze.
Installed pads and rotors, and now breaking it in.
Brake fluid I used was ATE TYP200.
So far so good. Brake feel is slowely improving, but based on my previous experience with EBC it will take several hundred miles.
Bought front set of EBC rotors and EBC Green Stuff pads. I knew pads in front were good, so I was assuming rear are good (bought car in September with 41,000 miles.
Anyway, rotors were vibrating so I decided to replace front components and do brake flush using Schwaben vacuum pump.
Did brake flush on VW Tiguan three weeks ago, and was planning to do on Sienna. However, unlike European cars, Toyota does not have universal brake fluid tank cap, so had to order cap for vacuum pump that can fit most vehicles. It involves chain, and tightening one, but it worked to keep vacuum at some 15psi.
So, took down rear tires and saw that rear pads were completely worn out. Than I remembered that assumption is mother of all mistakes, as I was assuming rears were changed when fronts were. Made a quick trip to Toyota dealership, got OE (Akebono made) for $67. Was shocked how small they are, which kind of explained as why brakes are just mediocre on this car.
Change was a breeze after I figured I need to use old clamps as new were not part of new brake pad set. Did rear wheel brake flush, moved to front.
Did brake flush, than pads and rotors. Used WD40 to help with taking down rotors, used rubber malt, breeze.
Installed pads and rotors, and now breaking it in.
Brake fluid I used was ATE TYP200.
So far so good. Brake feel is slowely improving, but based on my previous experience with EBC it will take several hundred miles.
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Wow, less than .002" of runout allowed, and directed airflow. The brakes must be undersized for the application!
I recently used Akebono pads on a friends 2012 Honda Accord coupe. Very important to have new clips on that car, the inside pad fits real tight in the caliper bracket. Unfortunately Akebono pads don't come with clips. So I had to reuse. Bad. It was just too tight IMO. Should have filed the ear down a little bit.. Disappointing you have to BYO hardware to use Akebono.
Originally Posted by LeakySeals
Originally Posted by The Critic
Originally Posted by LeakySeals
I'm familiar with lateral run-out but not the vent procedure or the TSB. I don't have a tool to check run out on this AWD. I do have a hub cleaner tool and a torque wrench LOL.
Here you go:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2016/SB-10084304-5448.pdf
Originally Posted by LeakySeals
Also is that rotor bolt hole 8 mm, 8 x 1.25? In case the rotors are stuck
I believe that is correct.
Thanks. Cutting the air dam to prevent front brake vibration. Wonder how they figured that one out.
Dumb question. When they mention phase match in the TSB, it means rotating the rotor on the hub to get the least runout?
Originally Posted by The Critic
Originally Posted by LeakySeals
I'm familiar with lateral run-out but not the vent procedure or the TSB. I don't have a tool to check run out on this AWD. I do have a hub cleaner tool and a torque wrench LOL.
Here you go:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2016/SB-10084304-5448.pdf
Originally Posted by LeakySeals
Also is that rotor bolt hole 8 mm, 8 x 1.25? In case the rotors are stuck
I believe that is correct.
Thanks. Cutting the air dam to prevent front brake vibration. Wonder how they figured that one out.
Dumb question. When they mention phase match in the TSB, it means rotating the rotor on the hub to get the least runout?
Originally Posted by LeakySeals
Dumb question. When they mention phase match in the TSB, it means rotating the rotor on the hub to get the least runout?
Since that's step 3, and the step by step A through E under step 3 describe what we have been calling "indexing" (common machinist's term) the rotor for minimum runout, I'm very sure that's what they mean by "phase match".
Dumb question. When they mention phase match in the TSB, it means rotating the rotor on the hub to get the least runout?
Since that's step 3, and the step by step A through E under step 3 describe what we have been calling "indexing" (common machinist's term) the rotor for minimum runout, I'm very sure that's what they mean by "phase match".
edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
Here is my result on Sienna:
![[Linked Image]](http://i68.tinypic.com/jl0wgn.jpg "[Linked Image]")
![[Linked Image]](http://i65.tinypic.com/bcs28.jpg "[Linked Image]")
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Okay it's a warm rainy day in New England so I'm going to start with the back brakes. I bought the harbor freight runout tool. But now I'm wondering how am I going to check runout just jacking up the rear of an AWD Sienna? I'm assuming if I pop it into neutral that might not be a good thing jacked up? Anyone think it will move? I was thinking about putting my rhino ramps in front. And slowly jacking it up with my 3 ton floor jack in neutral while the wheels are still on it and see what happens.. unless somebody else has the better idea and I'm worried about nothing?
Well I had planned on jacking up from the center because they said there was a my point right where the camera is. I don't see anything under there I guess I'll go for one of those side jack spots
Sorry folks this upgrade has made it extremely hard to upload photos. If you rotate it you can see what I'm talking about according to the manual there was supposed to be a jack point right in the center I don't see anything
Sorry folks this upgrade has made it extremely hard to upload photos. If you rotate it you can see what I'm talking about according to the manual there was supposed to be a jack point right in the center I don't see anything
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I found the correct jack spot. Its the guard over the rear diff. I was kinda nervous jacking up but it held. This is my first experience with PS brakes. The fit, quality, runout, and initial tests were all excellent. Time will tell if the coating was worth the money.
Looks good, and it looks like your Dad got his money's worth out of the old pads!
Did you lube the pad ears and backs? With all those smooth shiny anti-squeal shims it may not matter as much, but I do that on all my disc brake jobs.
Did you lube the pad ears and backs? With all those smooth shiny anti-squeal shims it may not matter as much, but I do that on all my disc brake jobs.
Originally Posted by HangFire
Looks good, and it looks like your Dad got his money's worth out of the old pads!
Did you lube the pad ears and backs? With all those smooth shiny anti-squeal shims it may not matter as much, but I do that on all my disc brake jobs.
I left the backs and the ears butt naked. I stopped greasing ears several years back because it was causing more problems than it was solving. Was attracting too much soot and sand. The pads would get stuck. The pads had a nice backing on them so I figured I would go with it as is.
Looks good, and it looks like your Dad got his money's worth out of the old pads!
Did you lube the pad ears and backs? With all those smooth shiny anti-squeal shims it may not matter as much, but I do that on all my disc brake jobs.
I left the backs and the ears butt naked. I stopped greasing ears several years back because it was causing more problems than it was solving. Was attracting too much soot and sand. The pads would get stuck. The pads had a nice backing on them so I figured I would go with it as is.
I hear you. I think some of the dirt issue is location, vehicle and even wheel dependent. (Some are worse than others)
I am trying Pastelub high solids now, instead of SilGlyde now. We'll see how it goes.
I've been advocating annual disc brake checks and relubes but not always practicing what I preach. My Honda rear annual rear brake check happened at 2 years 10 mos. Time flies. Pad lubes were fine and wear was even but bottom caliper slide pins were washed out and stuck. Must have just gotten to that state. I fixed it and put on new pins and boots but now the pads sound grindy. I may change them out after only 52K miles. Before I got 65K or so out of them and no issues.
Chastened I did the Toyota annual brake check and all is well there. I was a bit disappointed the front TQ pads are still thick, I wanted to change them out. They might make it to 100K like the OEM's... if I can stand them that long.
I am trying Pastelub high solids now, instead of SilGlyde now. We'll see how it goes.
I've been advocating annual disc brake checks and relubes but not always practicing what I preach. My Honda rear annual rear brake check happened at 2 years 10 mos. Time flies. Pad lubes were fine and wear was even but bottom caliper slide pins were washed out and stuck. Must have just gotten to that state. I fixed it and put on new pins and boots but now the pads sound grindy. I may change them out after only 52K miles. Before I got 65K or so out of them and no issues.
Chastened I did the Toyota annual brake check and all is well there. I was a bit disappointed the front TQ pads are still thick, I wanted to change them out. They might make it to 100K like the OEM's... if I can stand them that long.
Originally Posted by LeakySeals
Originally Posted by HangFire
Looks good, and it looks like your Dad got his money's worth out of the old pads!
Did you lube the pad ears and backs? With all those smooth shiny anti-squeal shims it may not matter as much, but I do that on all my disc brake jobs.
I left the backs and the ears butt naked. I stopped greasing ears several years back because it was causing more problems than it was solving. Was attracting too much soot and sand. The pads would get stuck. The pads had a nice backing on them so I figured I would go with it as is.
I told a couple guys at work I didn't grease the brakes on my Caliber and by the look on their faces you'd have swore I shot their dog. They only squeak if the cars been sitting and some rust has built up on the rotors. By the time I'm out of the parking lot at work it's quiet again.
Originally Posted by HangFire
Looks good, and it looks like your Dad got his money's worth out of the old pads!
Did you lube the pad ears and backs? With all those smooth shiny anti-squeal shims it may not matter as much, but I do that on all my disc brake jobs.
I left the backs and the ears butt naked. I stopped greasing ears several years back because it was causing more problems than it was solving. Was attracting too much soot and sand. The pads would get stuck. The pads had a nice backing on them so I figured I would go with it as is.
I told a couple guys at work I didn't grease the brakes on my Caliber and by the look on their faces you'd have swore I shot their dog. They only squeak if the cars been sitting and some rust has built up on the rotors. By the time I'm out of the parking lot at work it's quiet again.
Originally Posted by HangFire
I hear you. I think some of the dirt issue is location, vehicle and even wheel dependent. (Some are worse than others)
I am trying Pastelub high solids now, instead of SilGlyde now. We'll see how it goes.
I've been advocating annual disc brake checks and relubes but not always practicing what I preach. My Honda rear annual rear brake check happened at 2 years 10 mos. Time flies. Pad lubes were fine and wear was even but bottom caliper slide pins were washed out and stuck. Must have just gotten to that state. I fixed it and put on new pins and boots but now the pads sound grindy. I may change them out after only 52K miles. Before I got 65K or so out of them and no issues.
Chastened I did the Toyota annual brake check and all is well there. I was a bit disappointed the front TQ pads are still thick, I wanted to change them out. They might make it to 100K like the OEM's... if I can stand them that long.
The bottom caliper pins were washed out and stuck after 2 years using Sil-Glyde?
I hear you. I think some of the dirt issue is location, vehicle and even wheel dependent. (Some are worse than others)
I am trying Pastelub high solids now, instead of SilGlyde now. We'll see how it goes.
I've been advocating annual disc brake checks and relubes but not always practicing what I preach. My Honda rear annual rear brake check happened at 2 years 10 mos. Time flies. Pad lubes were fine and wear was even but bottom caliper slide pins were washed out and stuck. Must have just gotten to that state. I fixed it and put on new pins and boots but now the pads sound grindy. I may change them out after only 52K miles. Before I got 65K or so out of them and no issues.
Chastened I did the Toyota annual brake check and all is well there. I was a bit disappointed the front TQ pads are still thick, I wanted to change them out. They might make it to 100K like the OEM's... if I can stand them that long.
The bottom caliper pins were washed out and stuck after 2 years using Sil-Glyde?
I do anual checks on my brakes, trying to pull off the pads and check for delamination, and to make sure everything is free and sliding properly. Without fail the pins are full of grease and stuck. I work them back and forth a few times and all is fine.
Maybe it's the wrong grease (as a rule it's whatever came from factory), maybe they are stuck from lack of use--I usually get 5 years / 100k out of brake pads, and have to replace because the rotors are all grooved and pad linings are starting to fall off.
Originally Posted by LeakySeals
The bottom caliper pins were washed out and stuck after 2 years using Sil-Glyde?
Yes, only 2 years+10mos is close to 3 years. It may be more of a boot failure than a grease failure. Or maybe I didn't put the boots on perfectly. I don't know. They plug in a socket on the carrier on one side, and they have to stretch over the pin's larger outer diameter on the other side. Maybe I got it wrong in 2016. I'm anal about my brake jobs but I'm also human.
Originally Posted by supton
I do anual checks on my brakes, trying to pull off the pads and check for delamination, and to make sure everything is free and sliding properly. Without fail the pins are full of grease and stuck. I work them back and forth a few times and all is fine.
Maybe it's the wrong grease (as a rule it's whatever came from factory), maybe they are stuck from lack of use--I usually get 5 years / 100k out of brake pads, and have to replace because the rotors are all grooved and pad linings are starting to fall off.
Yeah, I need to be more strict on my annual schedule like you. I tend to think that "oh they're not squeaking or shuddering so they're fine" but I know from experience the pins or slides (depending on the design) can get sticky and start to tilt the pad at any time.
Question, "full of grease and stuck" "whatever came from factory" What kind of grease are you using? Do you ever replace it, or just stick it back in and re-use it?
I only use grease that specifically says for brakes, not bearing grease or chassis lube, and I remove it and replace it on each brake job or "annual" check. That's one of the main reasons I'm doing the check, is to replace the grease, which is why I'm kicking myself on this one. Still, given other's experiences, if I pull the plug and replace everything next week, it's still a 52K mile rear brake job with mid-level uncoated rotors and really cheap pads, on a vehicle where many owners report 60K-ish lives on their tiny rear brake pads, and always less than the fronts. My previous rear brake job on the vehicle got 62K and the pads were very thin, so 52K isn't too bad.
Toyota fronts have 82K and still have a fair bit of pad. From my records, I've been checking/re-lubing those every year except one 18 month period in the middle. If I had relubed my Honda rears at 18 months I probably wouldn't be here doing this confessional.
The bottom caliper pins were washed out and stuck after 2 years using Sil-Glyde?
Yes, only 2 years+10mos is close to 3 years. It may be more of a boot failure than a grease failure. Or maybe I didn't put the boots on perfectly. I don't know. They plug in a socket on the carrier on one side, and they have to stretch over the pin's larger outer diameter on the other side. Maybe I got it wrong in 2016. I'm anal about my brake jobs but I'm also human.
Originally Posted by supton
I do anual checks on my brakes, trying to pull off the pads and check for delamination, and to make sure everything is free and sliding properly. Without fail the pins are full of grease and stuck. I work them back and forth a few times and all is fine.
Yeah, I need to be more strict on my annual schedule like you. I tend to think that "oh they're not squeaking or shuddering so they're fine" but I know from experience the pins or slides (depending on the design) can get sticky and start to tilt the pad at any time.
Question, "full of grease and stuck" "whatever came from factory" What kind of grease are you using? Do you ever replace it, or just stick it back in and re-use it?
I only use grease that specifically says for brakes, not bearing grease or chassis lube, and I remove it and replace it on each brake job or "annual" check. That's one of the main reasons I'm doing the check, is to replace the grease, which is why I'm kicking myself on this one. Still, given other's experiences, if I pull the plug and replace everything next week, it's still a 52K mile rear brake job with mid-level uncoated rotors and really cheap pads, on a vehicle where many owners report 60K-ish lives on their tiny rear brake pads, and always less than the fronts. My previous rear brake job on the vehicle got 62K and the pads were very thin, so 52K isn't too bad.
Toyota fronts have 82K and still have a fair bit of pad. From my records, I've been checking/re-lubing those every year except one 18 month period in the middle. If I had relubed my Honda rears at 18 months I probably wouldn't be here doing this confessional.
I use whatever grease came with the calipers. Push the pin back and forth, and the grease loosens up. I think it just takes a set from sitting.
I have Sta-Lube which I've used, and found not to be great. I finally got some Sil-Glide to have on the shelf but have yet to use it. I think it's The_Critic who recommends using Honda's M77 moly paste for lubing brake pad ears, and I've found that to last about a year before it's washed away. I generally pull off the shims on the caliper bracket, sand off any rust, put down a layer of M77, install shim, put M77 onto pad ears. [I don't put grease onto the anti-squeal shims that are on the pads--I did that once, and it squealed for a couple months, until the lube washed away.]
I think Eric on South Main Auto (youtube) doesn't bother with lubing pad ears, just attracts dirt, doesn't to last nor do much, but maybe I'm remembering wrong.
I have Sta-Lube which I've used, and found not to be great. I finally got some Sil-Glide to have on the shelf but have yet to use it. I think it's The_Critic who recommends using Honda's M77 moly paste for lubing brake pad ears, and I've found that to last about a year before it's washed away. I generally pull off the shims on the caliper bracket, sand off any rust, put down a layer of M77, install shim, put M77 onto pad ears. [I don't put grease onto the anti-squeal shims that are on the pads--I did that once, and it squealed for a couple months, until the lube washed away.]
I think Eric on South Main Auto (youtube) doesn't bother with lubing pad ears, just attracts dirt, doesn't to last nor do much, but maybe I'm remembering wrong.
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