Porsche C40 / VW511 00 Oil requirement.

[Indyxc]

Why do you need such high HTHS?

In my applications it helps push my engine operating regime to the right in the stribeck curve. Granted the majority of my wear concerns are in the boundary operating regime (cams in the M176). Likwise, without a super high viscocity, but high HTHS oil, keeps my plastic S55 oil pump happy.

 

[scrllock]

C40 GT is now as well, but it's $50/qt!

Fifty? You mean fifteen?

https://www.suncoastparts.com/product/0w40m1c40gt.html

 

[Indyxc]

It's $50 at FCP euro. Which is quite insane.

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/porsche-engine-oil-0w-40-1-liter-genuine-porsche-v04015009f

Ok, $48 for black friday.

 

[altaylar]

Fifty? You mean fifteen?

https://www.suncoastparts.com/product/0w40m1c40gt.html

This is wild

 

[chris719]

It's $50 at FCP euro. Which is quite insane.

Ok, $48 for black friday.

Must be their way of making sure no one orders it for the LRG program

 

[chris719]

Why do you need such high HTHS?

TBH it’s probably not the worst thing for S55 with the bearings sometimes looking questionable.

 

[NuttCase]

Our Cayenne S comes with Mobil 1 C40 0w40 in it

True

...as do all new Porsches.

Untrue

Mobil 1 C40 is an excellent oil and C40 is a very high standard. I have not heard of a single issue using Mobil 1 X4 ESP and I've met lots of Porsche owners at club events, who use nothing else. That said, there are some (mostly older than me - 60+) who have their historical brand preferences (Millers, Motul and Rock Oil come to mind), service their cars a couple of times between the main dealer services, and they don't have any problems either. But I've not seen any evidence that deviating from the Mobil 1 has any engine benefits.

You will probably find that your owners manual (physical one or online) asks for 0W-40 and C40 and there is only one oil that satisfies both requirements i.e. Mobil 1 X4 ESP 0W-40. All the other C40 approved oils are 5W-40. I think most would agree that unless you park outside in very severe winter temperatures, the difference between a 0W and 5W would be irrelevant re: engine protection, but running a 5W-40 is a deviation from your manual.

motul xclean gen 2 used to have P-C40 approval. could he used it still? i mean we dont know why it lost this approval,there was a lot of discussion here ... and since we say MB 229.52 is the only that matters couldnt he use it anyway? (just like we say the same thing for bimmers)

I don't think it is so much a case of "losing" the approval but more a case of not renewing it. The Motul 8100 X-Clean gen2 approval, along with four other oils from Total, Ravenol, Transnational Blenders, and Yacco expired in 2024 and were not renewed.

Perhaps, Motul decided that the revenue from selling an approved C40 oil didn't justify the cost of maintaining the approval. I'm completely speculating by suggesting that the large majority of Porsche owners stick to the manual and run the 0W-40, so all the 5W-40 oils were poor sellers to Porsche owners. It does seem a bit of a quandary that 5W-40 oils are approved by Porsche and on the list, but the owners manuals specify 0W-40 only which reduces the short list from ~ten oils to one. What's the point of paying for an approval if Porsche is subsequently precluding it from use in the owners manuals?!

from the Cayenne owners manual :

 

[scrllock]

You will probably find that your owners manual (physical one or online) asks for 0W-40 and C40 and there is only one oil that satisfies both requirements i.e. Mobil 1 X4 ESP 0W-40. All the other C40 approved oils are 5W-40. I think most would agree that unless you park outside in very severe winter temperatures, the difference between a 0W and 5W would be irrelevant re: engine protection, but running a 5W-40 is a deviation from your manual.

Here in the US the manual says 0w40 or 5w40 is fine. There is always confusion about whether you follow the engine bay sticker, the manual, or what, but any oil listed in either location is perfectly okay. There is no "deviation" here.

As for the rest of it, who knows why approval wasn't pursued or granted. It's very simple though, if you care about the approval, you stick to the list.

 

[NuttCase]

Here in the US the manual says 0w40 or 5w40 is fine. There is always confusion about whether you follow the engine bay sticker, the manual, or what, but any oil listed in either location is perfectly okay. There is no "deviation" here.

As for the rest of it, who knows why approval wasn't pursued or granted. It's very simple though, if you care about the approval, you stick to the list.

I did check the online manual using a #chassis number from a USA Cayenne and only 0W-40 was listed. In doing so, I also noticed a slight error in their unit conversion. "Depending on the driving style and the operating conditions, the oil consumption can be up to 5.5 gal/1 000 mi (0,8 l/1 000 km)"

I don't doubt what you are saying though, but any chance you or any US owners could post a pic from the paper manual? It would give me a bit more confidence in switching out from the Mobil 1 next time. thx

 

[Vercingetorix]

I had no clue Q8 motor oil was made by Kuwait Petroleum. Seen them sponsor many a race car on TV.

 

[scrllock]

I did check the online manual using a #chassis number from a USA Cayenne and only 0W-40 was listed. In doing so, I also noticed a slight error in their unit conversion. "Depending on the driving style and the operating conditions, the oil consumption can be up to 5.5 gal/1 000 mi (0,8 l/1 000 km)"

I don't doubt what you are saying though, but any chance you or any US owners could post a pic from the paper manual? It would give me a bit more confidence in switching out from the Mobil 1 next time. thx

I will post the link I had earlier. If you put a 2020 cayenne S vin into the Porsche manual lookup, the engine oil section is pretty clear that both are approved.

 

[NuttCase]

I will post the link I had earlier. If you put a 2020 cayenne S vin into the Porsche manual lookup, the engine oil section is pretty clear that both are approved.

Ah ok, no need I found it using a 2020 # as you suggested. Must have changed at some point since, as a 2025 # brings up only 0W-40.

 

[Oldbro]

My 2025 manual says 0w40 which squares with the engine bay sticker.

 

[svenson]

I don't think it is so much a case of "losing" the approval but more a case of not renewing it

if not renewing it,then it would appear on the bottle at all. we have seen it on the bottle for sometime as soon as gen2 was out new on the market ,which means they paid for it..then we saw a new bottle without the approval.thus the word "loosing it" .i dont know the exact procedure about removing an approval out of a bottle.perhaps edyvw who worked in that bussines can tell us. i think something was not good with motul and not porsche,imagine they had to pay for a new bottle whatever that cost is.why porsche not to want a very popular oil in rennlist porsche to be out of approval?

 

[NuttCase]

The approvals are not indefinite - they have an expiry and if the company does not apply to have the approval extended, then it will lapse and they can no longer claim the approval on the product. The Motul gen2 approval expired on 30-06-24 and I would guess that lines up with the new label with shorter approval list. The cost of changing the label on newly manufactured and filled bottles from 1-7-24 would be very minor. As I mentioned earlier, my best guess would be a purely commercial decision from Motul that the cost of maintaining the approval didn't justify the sales. I recall in the past @edyvw stating that the fee paid by lubricant companies to car manufacturers such as VW and MB is a small nominal sum of money - a few grand from memory. But perhaps Porsche is different. Any Porsche owner knows that if you put a Porsche sticker / part number on an item the price doubles, even if it's exactly the same part; battery charger, oil filters etc. come to mind. Or $57/day just to access the workshop manuals online! It can't be a coincidence that five different lubricant companies decided not to renew the approvals when they expired in 2024.

Ultimately, only Motul can confirm the exact reason for not renewing the approval. I might drop them an email later.

 

[NuttCase]

@svenson @scrllock
So I heard back from Motul and most of what I've written previously is incorrect, but I'll leave it there anyway.

The Motul 8100 X Clean gen2 no longer carries the C40 approval as the formulation was updated to be compliant with API SP. They have now introduced a dedicated C40 formulation, although it's still not easy to find in the UK. It's called "Specific C40 5W-40". I'm expecting it to appear next time Porsche publish their list of approved oils. EDIT : It's on there.

Refer to the Motul Catalogue for more details.

 

[chris719]

I would assume it is something like Infineum will not sell the add pack for X3/X4/C40 GT to anyone but XOM, and the other C40 additive pack options do not pass SP for whatever reason.

 

[svenson]

@svenson @scrllock
So I heard back from Motul and most of what I've written previously is incorrect, but I'll leave it there anyway.

The Motul 8100 X Clean gen2 no longer carries the C40 approval as the formulation was updated to be compliant with API SP. They have now introduced a dedicated C40 formulation, although it's still not easy to find in the UK. It's called "Specific C40 5W-40". I'm expecting it to appear next time Porsche publish their list of approved oils. EDIT : It's on there.

Refer to the Motul Catalogue for more details.

View attachment 312924

View attachment 312925

I would assume it is something like Infineum will not sell the add pack for X3/X4/C40 GT to anyone but XOM, and the other C40 additive pack options do not pass SP for whatever reason.

yep.seeing that the specific is SN , i think we just found out why it is removed from the sp motul gen2.
now we need a VOA to have an idea of the new specific the sepcific additive which caused it to beeing removed.then you guys ,who can read this stuff, can make a conclusion, maybe.

this oil nowhere in europe too.perhaps its too soon after the announcement on their site.i know about this oil for a month now,so expecting it probably next semester. i really dont know if dealers will make a deal about it nad sell it.i still cant find anywhere near me the new xclean gen 2 bottle,i have to order it from north europe but its an expensive oil by price + delivery expenses ,price goes sky high.its not that i need it anyway,so many oils cheaper and good now.

 

[9XI]

We had similar debate here - until the heat covncinced moderators to lock the thread.

9

Post in thread 'Porsche Approved Oil: replacement of A40 with C40 oil'

Jul 13, 2023

There is no monopoly-like situation. BMW can choose whoever they want as a supplier or Porsche. HOWEVER, customer protection laws in the EU, US etc. do not allow them to get into those shenanigans, and I am not sure how did you come to that conclusion.

How could I not? The manufacturer does not allow European customers to use any other brand than Mobil. This may be due to legal reasons but it seems other manufacturers are not subject to the same restrictions.

Another aspect that concerns me is the dealers failure to provide a satisfactory explanation. Instead of addressing...

• 9XI

I, too don't want to use X3/X4 since the manual is also suggesting 5W-40 which has noticeably better specs.
Definitely something unlogical is going on here. What should actually carry more weight here: the owner’s manual or a dealer recommendation that refers to “Freigaben” and simply says we should trust our Porsche partner?

Nowhere does it say that 5W-40 must not be used. Only that 'only 0W-40 should be used.'