Read this report http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g2156.pdf and pick the one you like best.
Oils for 2007 H-D Sportster
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I've already read it, several times. I recommend, and have used, Mobil V-Twin 20W-50, Amsoil 20W-50 or Redline 20W-50 in the engine. I've used and can recommend Amsoil 75W-90, Mobil 75W-90 and Redline 75W-90 or 75W-90NS in the primary/transmission. Maybe Amsoil's next report will include Redline since Redline now has M/C specific oils.
I would be very carefull about what you put into the primary/trans. On Bad Weather Bikers forum they had some Buells that had their stators go out on them Turns out the guys running Mobil 1 75-90 gear oil were the unlucky ones. Nobody knows for sure, but the theory is that Mobil 1 gear oil has some other additives that may corrode the stator wiring. I'd stick with the Harley.
Very interesting. I never knew that but I did in fact have a stator go out when using Mobil 1 75W-90. I never thought the fluid had anything to do with it. I just thought "it was time". If that is more than just a coincidence that is a shame because the Mobil really improved the shifting over most other fluids. Coincidence or not, it happened to me and until today I never had a thought about the fluid having anything to do with it. Since there are other good fluids out there, I probably won't use the Mobil again just in case it is more than a coincidence.
Thank you blueglide88 for mentioning that.
When it happened to me, my stator wiring was hard and flaking when I took the stator out. I think the bike was about 6 years old when it happened and I thought the battery was dead because it was the original. I was stranded, my wife went and bought me a severely overpriced battery from the dealership. A few rides later the bike died again so I knew it was more than a battery. I got the new stator and pulled the old one out and I do remember how bad those wires were. It looked like they had been excessively heated up for several cycles and it kind of looked like the insulation was too short or had crumbled away. I remember also being upset because I had to drain the Mobil 1 gear lube out when I replaced the stator and I thought it still had some life left to it. Luckily, I discarded the fluid and put something else in. I honestly thought the fluid had nothing to do with it. Now it seems to make sense.
OK, after hitting the Bad Weather Bikers forum, I am convinced that Mobil 75W-90 is no longer a recommendation I want to make to anyone to put in the primary of a HD. It seems like a lot of people are having good luck with the Formula+ fluid and I'll probably try that. I've always wondered if the gear lubes (any brand) does damage to the transmission. Hopefully the Formula+ will work good so I can get a little bit of a comfort level knowing that it was specifically designed for the application I'm using it in. Also, I can get it very easily since there is a dealer 5 minutes away.
Just when I think I've got a handle on things, everything is turned upside down. I've stayed away from any Harley lubes for so long because I thought they were substandard and/or overpriced, now I find this out about Mobil 75W-90.
Just when I think I've got a handle on things, everything is turned upside down. I've stayed away from any Harley lubes for so long because I thought they were substandard and/or overpriced, now I find this out about Mobil 75W-90.
Another reason to stick with motorcycle formulated for, tested in, and proven in Harley Davidson motorcycles over the years. Of course, Amsoil's V-twin motorcycle oil is one of them and is the only synthetic motorcycle oil with a GL-1 rating for transmissions.
I used H-D Sport Trans fluid in my transmission/primary with good results.
Amsoil 20w50 motorcycle oil doesn't carry a GL-1 rating. It doesn't carry any API ratings. It is not an API certified oil. Amsoil recommends it for applications that require a GL-1 oil.
I'm sure Amsoil's internal testing shows this oil meets GL-1 requirements. But to say it has a GL-1 rating is false and misleading.
Dave Mann's book http://www.motor-oil-engineers.com/Motor Oil Engineers PDF.pdf says "One specific manufacturer, AMSOIL INC., offers a 10W-40 and 20W50 Motorcycle Oil which meets API SG, SL/CF, JASO MA/MA2 and GL-1 Gear Lube Specifications. This is the only oil on the market that meets all these specifications concurrently. The GL-1 Gear Lube rating provides for superior gear protection in motorcycle gearboxes which are integral with the crankcase as well as in motorcycles that have separate transmissions and primary drives, such as Harley-Davidson Motorcycles."
From the Amsoil site: "It meets
SAE 90, API GL-1 gear oil requirements and is recommended
for transmissions and primary chaincases.
AMSOIL MCV is recommended for Harley Davidson®,
Buell®, KTM, Ducati®, Aprilia®, BMW®, Triumph® and other
motorcycles where 15W-50 or 20W-50 engine oils or
SAE 90, GL-1 gear oils are used."
And "Synthetic 20W-50 Motorcycle Oil
API SG, SL/CF • JASO MA/MA2 • API GL-1"
I don't see where I was false or misleading. I never said it was API certified. Besides, API's own studies have shown 1 out of 5 API certified oils were off spec and 1 out of 20 API certified oils were so out of spec they could cause long or short term damage.
From the Amsoil site: "It meets
SAE 90, API GL-1 gear oil requirements and is recommended
for transmissions and primary chaincases.
AMSOIL MCV is recommended for Harley Davidson®,
Buell®, KTM, Ducati®, Aprilia®, BMW®, Triumph® and other
motorcycles where 15W-50 or 20W-50 engine oils or
SAE 90, GL-1 gear oils are used."
And "Synthetic 20W-50 Motorcycle Oil
API SG, SL/CF • JASO MA/MA2 • API GL-1"
I don't see where I was false or misleading. I never said it was API certified. Besides, API's own studies have shown 1 out of 5 API certified oils were off spec and 1 out of 20 API certified oils were so out of spec they could cause long or short term damage.
Tim, you can post all the Amsoil marketing babel you want, but the fact remains the oil does not carry any API ratings. It may very well meet the GL-1 specs, but we only have Amsoil's word on that, not a valid API license and the requisite testing that is behind that license.
Now before I get accused of bashing Amsoil, let me say that I would be fully comfortable using this oil in my Harley--both the engine and transmission. I believe it is a good oil, but my assessment is not based on Amsoil's disingenuous marketing which can mislead people into thinking this oil carries API, JASO, and ACEA approvals which it does not.
Now before I get accused of bashing Amsoil, let me say that I would be fully comfortable using this oil in my Harley--both the engine and transmission. I believe it is a good oil, but my assessment is not based on Amsoil's disingenuous marketing which can mislead people into thinking this oil carries API, JASO, and ACEA approvals which it does not.
API, JASO and ACEA don't seem to have any problem with Amsoil's labeling. Neither does Chevrolet, Harley Davidson, Mercedes Benz, Honda, etc. AMSOIL puts dozens of other companies and oil organizations names on their labels. Nobody has disproved their tests or ratings. They compare their products by name against the competition. None of them seem to think it is untruthful or misleading. No warranty problems over the past 35 years. The oil has never failed in recommended applications. I don't see why some consumers have such a problem with it.
G-man, I could be wrong here, but API does not “certify” gear oils as they do for the voluntary engine oil license system.
I have wondered about this before; if AMS doesn't want to pay for the testing, whats to stop a big company like shell from doing the same thing? I mean if you can say your oil passes the test and you don't actually get your oil tested (and you get away with it) what value does an offical API seal bring you? I bet most consumers don't really check that stuff. If a small company like AMS isn't paying for the tests, why should anybody else?
G-man - what are the misleading marketing practices you are talking about? The Federal Trade Commission and the Better Business Bureau doesn't report any. I don't see any organized consumer groups, oil groups, or vehicle manufacturers complaining.
SLM - Many times a bidder will have in his bid proposal that an oil must be API Certified. This is why Amsoil certifies its cheapest to make, lowest quality lines. API Certification is very easy to get if you pay the money, and you can use low quality/cost feedstocks and additives. Look at all the oils that are API certified and cost very little to manufacturer. They are the ones you see on sale a t a dollar a quart.
SLM - Many times a bidder will have in his bid proposal that an oil must be API Certified. This is why Amsoil certifies its cheapest to make, lowest quality lines. API Certification is very easy to get if you pay the money, and you can use low quality/cost feedstocks and additives. Look at all the oils that are API certified and cost very little to manufacturer. They are the ones you see on sale a t a dollar a quart.
OK, the engine oil choice should be pretty easy. But how about the trans? I'd prefer to use something other (and better)than the H-D "Formula+".
I'm having a hard time understanding this GL-1 marketing ploy by a-oil? As near as can find gl-1 is just straight mineral oil and cannot have EP or AW, or FM additives. Seems to me a-oil 20w50 (or any of their mc oils) has plenty of these additives and isn't just straight oil? So, either its NOT GL-1, or every other motor oil on the market is too? My opinion is they some how are trying to link gl-1 spec with motorcycles because they have a transmission, indirectly fooling the consumer into thinking the oil is something special because it meets GL-1?
If you look at the testing in the report, the Amsoil motorcycle oils seem different than the rest. They don't shear in standard ASTM testing like the others do (except for Torco and Mobil 1 motorcycle oils), they don't allow rust like Castrol and Bel Ray. They don't foam like Mobil 1, Castrol and Bel Ray. They don't allow gear wear like Torco, Yamalube, and Pennzoil. They do seem to have the balanced characteristics you would want in a gear lube as well as an engine oil.
Maybe because it's not a marketing ploy. Amsoil is simply saying that the MCV 20W-50 is a fine replacement for the Harley Formula+
Since HD owners may go looking for a GL-1 (which their stuff isn't!)..... Amsoil says "GL-1" for the suitable replacement (actually better than). G-man knows all this (he's using a racing motor oil), not sure why he's not saying so other than Tim in his bumbling way keeps on with the Amsoil mantra. And hence starts a squabble.
HD is the one trying to fool customers, IMHO. If you would try for once to not try to prove something AGAINST Amsoil, maybe you could understand.
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