Oil temperature

During the summer my GTI will hover around 215-223 on flat grounds. Going up the mountain it can vary. Oddly enough if there's no traffic and am cruising along the extra "load" the oil temperature will hardly creep up. However if I'm stuck behind a semi or slower moving traffic (as low as 15mph, struggling to decide to be in 1st or 2nd gear) the oil temperature has shot up close to 235-240 before. I'm assuming this is because of reduced air flow.
 
I wonder why the v6 and v8s have such a different in oil temperature?

Different oil coolers and filters, and because the Pentastar is a more efficient design. I wonder if we'll ever see the V8 version of the Pentastar engine because it's a very good design.

This guy got over 600,000 miles out of his 3.6 Pentastar.



I recently test drove a 2020 Jeep Grand Cherokee "North Edition" that was running 0W-20 from the factory. The engine got up to temperature, 212F very fast and then stayed there. I loved how smooth the engine was and how easily it was revving, almost effortless. Well, as soon as I have the money together for a decent down payment, we'll get one.
 
When BMW was having issues with their oil temps in the N52/54 before the oil cooler install update, they said 275 was max operating temp, and 300 was where the trouble started, so Ive always used that as a guide. My M cars never go above 210-220, my old A4 showed 205-210 constantly no matter what temps with syn. When they ran conventional it was about 240. I normally see about 225 in most of the BMWs we work on.
My N52 does not have OFH with heat exchanger. I am wondering how much it would help if I add OFH from N52's for 528, X3? You familiar with that?
 
My 2016 Subaru WRX (2.0L TGDI, 268 HP, 6MT) had an oil temp gauge.

I always used Pennzoil Platinum 10W-30.

Depending on ambient temperature and speed, it was usually about 205°F - 220°F. If it was cold outside abud I was doing 70 on the interstate, it might settle at 195-200. Even on a hot day in traffic, max would be about 220.

The highest I saw it was around 250°F, while chasing a Nissan GT-R up Monteagle Mountain (I-24, between Nashville and Chattanooga) at 100+ with my mountain bike on the hitch mount and a car full of camping gear.
 
Hmm, none of my vehicles have an engine oil temp gauge, no idea how I'd plumb on in (down the dipstick tube?).

These days they still mostly ambient though...
 
I wonder if we'll ever see the V8 version of the Pentastar engine because it's a very good design.
I always thought they should, but I'm guessing the whole "it's got a Penta dude!" just won't cut the mustard at the stoplight. Probably the longer crank and longer heads (exhaust manifold is part of the head, right?) might be reasons why it's not easily done. Longer camshafts too, more twist to watch for? That and the forces at the crank must be higher, so the main bearing journals, maybe crank main diam, all that might have to scale up, thus cutting into efficiency (or max output has to be limited?). All just pure SWAG here.

Just scaling up should be 407hp/359ft-lb, right? Derating for the issues that I think might occur would say maybe 350/325 hp/tq (pure guess as to a derate) which fed into an 8spd transmission would yield I'd think an altogether "good enough" engine combo. But just looking at those numbers and then the competition... I think it becomes clear why this just won't happen. It just doesn't "look good enough" to sell.
 
Ford
20 Grade - Anything over 248F
50 Grade - Anything over 302F

Those are where protection mode engages on a Ford so I would expect those are the upper limit for the viscosity.
 
I always thought they should, but I'm guessing the whole "it's got a Penta dude!" just won't cut the mustard at the stoplight. Probably the longer crank and longer heads (exhaust manifold is part of the head, right?) might be reasons why it's not easily done. Longer camshafts too, more twist to watch for? That and the forces at the crank must be higher, so the main bearing journals, maybe crank main diam, all that might have to scale up, thus cutting into efficiency (or max output has to be limited?). All just pure SWAG here.

Just scaling up should be 407hp/359ft-lb, right? Derating for the issues that I think might occur would say maybe 350/325 hp/tq (pure guess as to a derate) which fed into an 8spd transmission would yield I'd think an altogether "good enough" engine combo. But just looking at those numbers and then the competition... I think it becomes clear why this just won't happen. It just doesn't "look good enough" to sell.

Nah, it's a cost issue. If Ford can do it with its 5.0L Coyote engine, so can FCA/RAM. Toyota did is as well, they have that 5.7L "iForce" motor. I guess someone in the Toyota marketing department is a huge Apple fan. A crew cab Tundra with that engine accelerates like a coughing fart. Low-end torque is non-existant on that engine. I test drove a couple of them and walked away pretty unimpressed. The interior and cabin tech was about a decade old as well. Now, the 5.0L Coyote engine is a different story, it feels much better to drive.

As it stands, FCA makes good money from the 5.7L HEMI. It's not exactly the epitome of manufacturing precision or quality (gotta love the tight tolerance BS that some believe to be true), but it has good low-end torque and it makes them good money. So why fix something that works? I believe that it's cheaper for FCA to manufacture the 5.7L HEMI than the 3.6L Pentastar. As for names, FCA/Dodge/RAM is good at naming things, so I'm sure they'll come up with a clever name if a DOHC V8 will ever see the light of day.
 
I used to track oil temps in my VW but now I only track oil pressure and coolant temperature on my water cooled vehicles. On my old XR dirt bikes I had a temperature dip stick. In the summer it would top out at over 325 degrees.
 
The evo's oil temp usually sat around 190-210 during normal drives and 220-230 during HPDE events and it comes with a cooler. I only had a full bolt-on evo and tune and I wasn't very fast. The time attack guys at my power level + slicks + aero can see up to 250-260 during a time attack event.
 
Nah, it's a cost issue. If Ford can do it with its 5.0L Coyote engine, so can FCA/RAM. Toyota did is as well, they have that 5.7L "iForce" motor. I guess someone in the Toyota marketing department is a huge Apple fan. A crew cab Tundra with that engine accelerates like a coughing fart. Low-end torque is non-existant on that engine. I test drove a couple of them and walked away pretty unimpressed. The interior and cabin tech was about a decade old as well. Now, the 5.0L Coyote engine is a different story, it feels much better to drive.

As it stands, FCA makes good money from the 5.7L HEMI. It's not exactly the epitome of manufacturing precision or quality (gotta love the tight tolerance BS that some believe to be true), but it has good low-end torque and it makes them good money. So why fix something that works? I believe that it's cheaper for FCA to manufacture the 5.7L HEMI than the 3.6L Pentastar. As for names, FCA/Dodge/RAM is good at naming things, so I'm sure they'll come up with a clever name if a DOHC V8 will ever see the light of day.

The HEMI, being a pushrod design, is simpler, cheaper to manufacture and gets "good enough" gas mileage with MDS that it beats out the DOHC Toyota offering with all its added complexity. Chrysler did the OHC V8 thing back with the 4.7L and it was pretty unremarkable like the 4.6L SOHC Ford. Not great amounts of power, physically huge, small displacement relative to physical size...etc. GM stuck it out with a pushrod mill, Chrysler followed suit with the HEMI and Ford has now gone back that direction with the 7.3L. There's something to be said for the simplicity and compact nature of a pushrod engine and we know that these platforms are more than capable of making acceptable amounts of reliable power while taking up relatively little space. The 6.4L makes 485HP in car trim while still meeting emissions standards, which, while not quite as good in terms of HP/L as the Pentastar, doesn't take up much more space.

The big bore 6.4L is 0.8L/cylinder
The Pentastar is 0.6L/cylinder
So, scaling up the Pentastar to a V8, keeping all the other dimensions the same you end up with a 4.8L, not far off from the Coyote and previous 4.7L SOHC engine in a footprint significantly larger than the 5.7L or 6.4L and assuming power density remains the same, it would produce ~407HP, not much of a step-up from the 5.7L HEMI's 395 and would likely cost significantly more to manufacture.
 
The HEMI, being a pushrod design, is simpler, cheaper to manufacture and gets "good enough" gas mileage with MDS that it beats out the DOHC Toyota offering with all its added complexity.

That's why I said that the Tundra with the Toyota DOHC iForce engine accelerates like a coughing fart. You have to rev it like crazy to get any performance out of it.

You provided a very good explanation and I agree with everything you said. I doubt that there is any cause for concern as we won't see any V8 DOHC motor out of FCA any time soon, if ever. The low-end torque that my HEMI makes is nice, I rarely, very rarely push that engine beyond 3000 rpm in my 2016 RAM 1500.

To slightly deviate, if they ever decide to redesign the Charger and Challenger, and start putting their turbocharged inline 4 and V6 engines in them, they won't be as "affordable" as they are now, not to mention that they will lose their luster. I'd like to see them fix their abysmal small overlap crash performance though and leave them as they are.
 
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To slightly deviate, if they ever decide to redesign the Charger and Challenger, and start putting their turbocharged inline 4 and V6 engines in them, they won't be as "affordable" as they are now, not to mention that they will lose their luster.
Agreed. This is why I decided to get mine sooner rather than later, after it's been neutered by EPA and equipped with a 2.0 turbo. :)
 
Agreed. This is why I decided to get mine sooner rather than later, after it's been neutered by EPA and equipped with a 2.0 turbo. :)

Actually, a 2.0T motor is not bad in something like the Alfa Romeo Stelvio, however, it doesn't belong anywhere near a Charger or Challenger.
 
Actually, a 2.0T motor is not bad in something like the Alfa Romeo Stelvio, however, it doesn't belong anywhere near a Charger or Challenger.

It's like the ecoboost 4 or the v6 in the mustang. They're still plenty fast but to me a mustang isn't a mustang without the V8. Surprisingly the EB/auto/convertible mustang put up a stronger fight than I previously thought though.
 
Never have checked the temperature of oil and never thought of doing that. That makes me curious lol.

I wonder if that is one of the displays on the Torque app... Do all vehicles put out that info or have that sensor as per OBD or ECU data? Or does the car not really care. Maybe some models would do something with how hot the oil is.

Or do they only care about coolant temp?

I do realize this particular discussion seems gravitas towards the Ram, 300, FCA.
 
It's like the ecoboost 4 or the v6 in the mustang. They're still plenty fast but to me a mustang isn't a mustang without the V8. Surprisingly the EB/auto/convertible mustang put up a stronger fight than I previously thought though.

Isn't that 2.3L EcoBoost the one with the head gasket issues? You're right, the V8 is where it's at!
 
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